Hey everyone, I'm planning to put sub-woofers in the back of my car (Yes, the rear trunk, the one that is NOT connected to the cabin in anyway). For someone like me, the setup is perfect, because it would be incredibly easy to put two 12's in there, requiring little to no fabrication. Now the obvious problem is that between me and the subs is several hundred pounds of drive train and a double firewall. Which translates to a lot of vibration but not a lot of sound. My solution is to port the sound from the trunk into the cabin. I was thinking I could run a dryer tube out from the trunk to the firewall. My only issue is where to cut. Where is the best place to get through the firewall into the cabin?

through the passenger side would be ideal, but the battery & alternator are there, creating a possible problem. behind the driver side is the line that goes to the gas tank. it's real easy to get through there if you're carefull. That's where alot of us have but our subs. I'd go there, just go slow and work your way around that gas line. it's fairly large so it can't be missed.

Do you care anything about the quality of sound at all, or actually feeling the bass in the cabin? Because you're not going to get it by putting the speakers on the other side of the drivetrain (unless you convert to electric).

As it is, there is way too much interference between you and the trunk, for putting speakers there to make any sense.

But if you just want to piss off people near you while in traffic, then it's a great place to put them.

It is a firewall and it is there for a reason. Cutting all the way though both layers is a mistake however, it's your car.

Nolan

quote Originally posted by jasedude: For someone like me, the setup is perfect, because it would be incredibly easy to put two 12's in there, requiring little to no fabrication. My solution is to port the sound from the trunk into the cabin. I was thinking I could run a dryer tube out from the trunk to the firewall. My only issue is where to cut. Where is the best place to get through the firewall into the cabin?

Am I missing something here? Little to no fabrication, but then you are going to have to fabricate a way to connect the trunk to the interior of the car. I can just imagine how much engine noise is going to be introduced in something as thin as a dryer duct hose. Plus you will need to cut a hole in the firewall and trunk, make something to clamp the hose onto at each end, and figure out a way to route a 4"ish tube through your engine compartment without interfering with the engine.

Personally I'd ditch the dryer hose idea, it's to flimsy. Maybe some 3 or 4 inch pvc wrapped with dynamat. Pvc will also allow you better mounting options as it's much sturdier and less likely to flex and move from air rushing around it. You could maybe route it over the trans side if it's a duke, I have no idea of the space limitations on a V6, so I don't really know where you might route it on one of those.

Edit: I just checked and it looks like a 3" pipe on the drivers side might be possible. You'd have to go in next to the decklid hinge mount by the canister. For a duke powered Fiero that is.

[This message has been edited by Khw (edited 08-14-2010).]

quote Originally posted by Khw: Personally I'd ditch the dryer hose idea, it's to flimsy. Maybe some 3 or 4 inch pvc wrapped with dynamat. Pvc will also allow you better mounting options as it's much sturdier and less likely to flex and move from air rushing around it. You could maybe route it over the trans side if it's a duke, I have no idea of the space limitations on a V6, so I don't really know where you might route it on one of those. Edit: I just checked and it looks like a 3" pipe on the drivers side might be possible. You'd have to go in next to the decklid hinge mount by the canister. For a duke powered Fiero that is.

IF I were going to actually try to do something like this, I would totally skip the idea of using a standard 3-4" pipe. I would look for a wrecked 2nd gen RX7 or C4 Vette or something, with the insane Bose system in it, and use some of the tubing that they actually designed to route around the wheel wells in the rear of those cars.

But really, I wouldn't do it. It's going to sound completely horrible no matter what you do. You'd get it done, and probably want to rip it out and weld the firewall back up as soon as you started the car the first time, after completing the install. I don't know why people want to install massive subs in everything, anyway. If someone was building a db Drag car, maybe, but you wouldn't get very far by mounting them in the trunk and routing a port to the cabin, in a Fiero. The port tube will be too long, and while 2 12"s might fit in the trunk, the air volume in the Fiero trunk is probably barely enough to have one of them perform at peak potential.

I understand its not for everybody...but being a teenager, I want what I had in my old big car, loud obnoxious bass, even if the quality isn't audiophile status. It's the same as Rim's, some people like big, chromed out flashy one's, others think they are gaudy. It's just the personal taste of my generation that sound systems should be VERY loud. I know there are other options, but I'm spoiled for two 12's and I don't know of any other way to get them in the car. Why would porting the trunk into the cabin be any worse then a standard car with subs in the trunk? They don't even have a port, the bass has to go through the seat.

Also, I have done a battery relocation, so perhaps the best place to go in would be through the passenger side where the battery tray is. Is that section double fire walled?

Here is where I am trying to repair my 88 that I didn't know the PO had butchered . That is the fuel tank hose there:

and here:

Cut and installed the other speaker hole cover today. These shots are from the engine side of the firewall:




Buy you a Walkman and turn it up full blast. Fixing this F*** Up was real fun.

quote Originally posted by jasedude: I understand its not for everybody...but being a teenager, I want what I had in my old big car, loud obnoxious bass, even if the quality isn't audiophile status. It's the same as Rim's, some people like big, chromed out flashy one's, others think they are gaudy. It's just the personal taste of my generation that sound systems should be VERY loud. I know there are other options, but I'm spoiled for two 12's and I don't know of any other way to get them in the car. Why would porting the trunk into the cabin be any worse then a standard car with subs in the trunk? They don't even have a port, the bass has to go through the seat. Also, I have done a battery relocation, so perhaps the best place to go in would be through the passenger side where the battery tray is. Is that section double fire walled?

You don't really need 2 12"s to get VERY loud in a Fiero. In my 86, I drove around with a ported 8" mounted in a truck box, sitting in the passenger floor under the dash, with the speaker facing upward. I had it hooked up to the factory subwoofer amp. With that, and the crappy dash speakers I had, it was still very loud. Sometimes, I would even drive around with a hatch box in the passenger seat, with two 10"s, and hooked it up to the factory amp. Now that was definitely loud. Also, I had to take the sunroof out to fit the box in, because the top corner would stick out just far enough to not fit in, even with the sunroof popped.

You'd be better off mounting the subs behind the seats if you REALLY MUST HAVE them. See http://fierosound.com/stereo.html for the best way to mount two speakers that big. If you go with the super low-profile ones, you can probably avoid cutting the firewall. And the full firewall is 2 panes. Most cars don't have ports from the trunk, because the trunk is just an extension of the passenger cabin. There's no sealed area between the two. In the Fiero, though, you've got 2 panes of firewall steel, and a drivetrain. If you do manage to route a port tube through the engine bay, and into the cabin, it's going to pick up all kinds of ambient noise from the engine bay. You're porting through an open area. You'll have engine noise, road noise, and even rain, causing additional noise in the tube. Not to mention that the engine bay ambient temperature is very hot, which will also affect performance.

But maybe you have some unobtanium to make the port out of, which will handle the heat and not take on the ambient noise. :P

quote Originally posted by jasedude: Also, I have done a battery relocation, so perhaps the best place to go in would be through the passenger side where the battery tray is. Is that section double fire walled?

As you can see in the pictures josef644 posted the upper area of the firewall is single layer. So if you went in where the battery used to reside you'd encounter a single layer. The problem with going in there is you will be going over the belt side of the engine and I don't know if you have room to route a tube in there because of that. The lower section is double layer as a channel runs behind the firewall. This channel is sometimes opened up to allow the backside of the speaker to utilize the space for mounting depth and a little extra airspace. The problem is on the drivers side the fuel lines run through that channel and great care must be taken if you remove the part of the firewall foward of the channel. Also this channel is not sealed to the outside, so you will need to seal up each end if you went that way. Here's a picture of the channel opened up on the drivers side.



The metal of the channel extends maybe 2" above the cutout shown and from there up the firewall should be single layer.

Edit: A note on the 2 12's. I used to run 2 12's in my kingcab pickup truck. I eventually went to 2 10's for more space and was suprised that the 2 10's were louder. If you check speaker specs, you can find comparable spl ratings between them. The biggest difference is going to be in low frequency extension, but in all honest you can find 10's that can play down to 30ish hz which pushes the limit of what humans can hear anyways.

[This message has been edited by Khw (edited 08-14-2010).]

quote Originally posted by Khw: Edit: A note on the 2 12's. I used to run 2 12's in my kingcab pickup truck. I eventually went to 2 10's for more space and was suprised that the 2 10's were louder. If you check speaker specs, you can find comparable spl ratings between them. The biggest difference is going to be in low frequency extension, but in all honest you can find 10's that can play down to 30ish hz which pushes the limit of what humans can hear anyways.

I'm guessing the box itself was approximately the same size for the 10s, as it was with the 12s. The 10s were probably 'louder' because the volume of the box was closer to what they require to operate optimally, while with the 12s, there was less available air volume in the box, and the speakers required more. Another reason I highly suggest not putting them in the trunk, and going with smaller speakers.

Not sure if you have seen it but there have been a few guys that installed a larger box in the front compartment where the spare tire is. You would lose your spare tire tho but you could probably build a pretty powerful enclosure in that area and port it into the cabin as you wanted to pretty easily. The spare tire could also easily be replaced to the trunk area and attatched to the side of the trunk wall to get it to be secured and still have some useable space in there. I am trying to figure out where I want to install my new 10" Rockford sub in the car and I have been thinking along these lines.... I also like to put my sunroof in the front a lot so I need to be able to do that as well.... Now two twelves would be pretty nasty in a little car like a fiero. Perhaps you could sell one of them and build a highly efficient enclosure for the other one and port it into the cabin in the footwell area as some have done. That would be pretty cool and if powered properly would provide all the bump you could ever want I am sure.... I used to have four tens in a Honda civic way back in college and I used to work for a stereo shop building enclosures for a short while. Things have changed seriously from then and what I found was that on my second box I build I only used two tens and had the specs right and it was about as powerful as the four tens were with improperly sized boxes..... Bottom line is, you gotta get the enclosure sized to fit the sub and power level or you are not gonna make any real power no matter what you do.... I really like the subs between the seats look but I have not been able to figure out how to do it and get it to work well... I am sure it can be done but it will not be simple. Good luck and peace

Pete

quote Originally posted by dobey: I'm guessing the box itself was approximately the same size for the 10s, as it was with the 12s. The 10s were probably 'louder' because the volume of the box was closer to what they require to operate optimally, while with the 12s, there was less available air volume in the box, and the speakers required more. Another reason I highly suggest not putting them in the trunk, and going with smaller speakers.

Actually, no. The 12's had 2.5 cubic feet each as recomended by the manufacturer and the 10's 1.5 cubic feet each as recommended. This was a kingcab truck and I removed the seats for the 12's. When I had a child I needed the seats back so I built the enclosure for the 10's so it would sit under the seats and aimed the drivers toward the floor. The enclosure had about a 3" openeing across the face that let the sound eminate out as the box sat above the driveline hump. The 12's on the other hand were aimed directly into the back of the seats. Maybe that muffled the sound a bit. The 12's were PW1240 single voicecoil drivers made by Pyle back in the early 90's. The 10's were GT1041D, dual voicecoil drivers made by JBL in the late 90's.

Edit: Oh yeah, the 12's were pushed by a 400 watt Pyramid amp, the 10's by a Orion 280GX. I'd say that played into the 10's being louder also.

[This message has been edited by Khw (edited 08-14-2010).]

Wow, what an incredibly unique idea. I totally give you props for thinking out of the box.

With that said, I would hate to see you go through all the effort only to be dissapointed so try this; take two cardboard tubes and hold them up to your ears and listen to the change in sound. Sound is vibration and pressure waves, your ducts will alter the structure of the sound like you just heard for yourself.

You're an ambitious kid, I admire that too, if you channel your effort and energy into perhaps some low profile subwoofers and a beefier set of speakers all around, you'll probably be more than satisfied at the sound.

One more thing to add. I'm looking at a 84 engine bay. I know in later models they relocated the C500 connector off to one side of the engine bay. I don't know which side, but the area I'm looking at for the port to go through may be where they relocated it to. If so then that would make it difficult to do it that way also.

[This message has been edited by Khw (edited 08-14-2010).]

i have many, MANY ideas for getting an insane sub system in my Fiero, including his idea. the tube wouldnt make it sound horrible if a PRO made it and got the port tuned. and engine noise is as easy to drown out as anything else....just use a CRAPLOAD of sound insulation. and anyone saying having the subs so far away will make it bad, what about the people with subs up front sealed and ported to the cab that think it sounds great? sure they wont play like a sub in a regular box, but the frequency lost can be compensated for easily enough. My plan is not done yet, but the part i have confirmed is it will include a 12 inch Fi BTL (or 12 inch RE XXX if i can get one cheap enough...) or MAYBE a Fi Q if i have to. i just need to find the best place to put it.

Also, just go with one 12....like a Fi BTL. it will fit in the trunk no problem (well itll take some work, but airspace requiremnt-wise, itll fit) and easily out-do any pair of 12s that will fit in the trunk within specs.

or if you want something that takes a lot less praying and engineering, make something like this https://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum1/HTML/081470.html . my newest idea is to make something like that, but incorporating a custom built raised center console to get more air-space. there is more to it than that, but i dont wanna give away my entire idea lol

That is pretty cool sub setup there.... never seen one like that before. I would think it would not be that hard to make something similar to that for the car with my ten in it. Should be less intrusive and still sound pretty mean. I have been getting more acquainted with the fiberglass now that I have build a few projects. I kinda like to watch the show Unique whips to see how they make their enclosures, mostly it is an MDF ring and a stable form with material wrapped and then resin applied followed by a few layers of glass then filler to smooth it out. Pretty cool process and you could make about any shape you wanted that way.... I love to see how pros do things like that, gives you ideas that you might have not thought of before.. peace

Pete

Pete, i also watch Unique Whips and enjoy that part the most lol. i love watching nice custom sub boxed be designed and built.

[This message has been edited by faaaaq (edited 08-14-2010).]

quote Originally posted by jasedude: Why would porting the trunk into the cabin be any worse then a standard car with subs in the trunk? They don't even have a port, the bass has to go through the seat.

That's why it works - there's no port.
The trunk is an extension of the cabin.

quote Originally posted by jasedude: I understand its not for everybody...but being a teenager, I want what I had in my old big car, loud obnoxious bass, even if the quality isn't audiophile status.

Subs INSIDE the car will give you undistorted bass you can feel,
but that requires some skill in constructing a proper sub-box.

For what You want, this is probably the best solution.


------------------
My World of Wheels Winners (Click on links below)

3.4L Supercharged 87 GT and Super Duty 4 Indy #163

[This message has been edited by fierosound (edited 08-15-2010).]

I have a Fiero, and I play guitar and bass. I know a thing or two about Fieros and more than a thing or two about music amplification issues.

Your plan is flawed from the get go, unfortunately. When designing a bass enclosure you have to take into account the sound waves, and sound interval. You would find with your tube idea that there would be a sound amplification of a particular sound bandwidth so when certain notes were hit they would stand out above the rest of the sound.

Also, the interval of about 4' will distort the sound. You would hear some frequencies distinctly behind you and some others distinctly in front due to a whole mess of physical factors.

Let's look at servicing the engine. To make it work you need the ports (tubes) to be at least 4" across and probably 6". This means every time you change the oil or check a belt your have to deal with a big log in your way. They would also impede air movement in the engine bay, and this car does not need that problem.

For all the time and effort, it would turn out to be a big waste of time for you I am afraid. Try low profile 10" speakers. Cut the carpet for the speakers to mount on the firewall facing the engine. If they are bass speakers you will turn your cabin into a bass box. You'll likely have to turn the bass down on the stereo just to hear yourself think.

Good luck with it though. I like a guy who is willing to be creative.

Arn

quote Originally posted by faaaaq: i have many, MANY ideas for getting an insane sub system in my Fiero, including his idea. the tube wouldnt make it sound horrible if a PRO made it and got the port tuned. and engine noise is as easy to drown out as anything else....just use a CRAPLOAD of sound insulation. and anyone saying having the subs so far away will make it bad, what about the people with subs up front sealed and ported to the cab that think it sounds great? sure they wont play like a sub in a regular box, but the frequency lost can be compensated for easily enough. My plan is not done yet, but the part i have confirmed is it will include a 12 inch Fi BTL (or 12 inch RE XXX if i can get one cheap enough...) or MAYBE a Fi Q if i have to. i just need to find the best place to put it.

Yeah, it could be tuned to sound right, but it will cost a CRAPLOAD of money, and there really isn't enough room to do it in the Fiero engine bay. It's still a Fiero, rembmer.

I'm not saying just having it that far away will make it bad. I'm saying having it that far away, with all the other factors included, will make it bad. The boxes up front with ports to the cabin don't have to deal with all those factors. There's no engine. It's not open air. There are already several things which go through to the cabin from the front (blower motor, a/c condenser, etc…). In the rear, there's a single wiring harness port going through the firewall.

Also, 12s are pretty heavy. You'd probably want to mount it up front to bring the weight balance closer to 50/50, or try to get it as close to center as possible (which isn't a whole lot further rearward from the spare tire well anyway).

I don't know why people keep trying to shove a sound system with enough power to satisfy a fully packed theater, in their cars, anyway.

I've seen guys mount 6" or 8" speakers in the center console glove box panel. Its safer as you'll still have the fire protection and you won't mess with the cars structural integrity. if an engine fire develops with that big hole in the firewall, YOU ARE TOAST.

------------------
" THE BLACK PARALYZER" -87GT 3800SC Series III engine, 3.4" Pulley, N* TB, LS1 MAF, Flotech Exhaust Autolite 104's Custom CAI 4T65eHD w. custom axles, HP Tuners VCM Suite.
"THE COLUSSUS"
87GT - ALL OUT 3.4L Turbocharged engine, Garrett Hybrid Turbo, MSD ign., modified TH125H
" ON THE LOOSE WITHOUT THE JUICE "

quote Originally posted by Arns85GT: Good luck with it though. I like a guy who is willing to be creative. Arn

I will absolutely agree with the creativity!

I have seen the trunk used for the amplification and power units in Fiero's. I've built trunk shelves for my Fiero, just plywood and covering, I bet that a piece of clear plastic, maybe lexon (sp?) would really look cool and show off the equipment. Years ago there was a Fiero outside of a car stereo shop on Woodward Avenue like that, can't remember about the clear part though.

Question please? How much work upgrading the electrical system does it take to handle the power requirements of these big systems?

I just sent this to a member who asked a question about the theory.

On a bass reflex cabinet the design counts on the speaker cone projecting as much low frequency noise behind as in front. In the case of my Roland Blues Cube, it is a 3x10" cabinet with an open back. When setting up with the band's sound system I used the Blues Cube as a guitar monitor, however, it broadcast so much sound out the back that it interfered with the house system. I put 4" of foam rubber in the back to muffle the speaker. It didn't affect what was coming out the front.

This is particularly true of bass speakers. The high frequency pitches are broadcast from the center of the cone, so any low sound being broadcast is coming from the outer rim area. This means that an equal amount of air is moved both forward and back on a vibration.

So, you can, in fact, mount a sub woofer on a plate and rely on the back of the speaker to send sound out. In the case of the Fiero firewall, it carries sound vibration throughout the car. It acts like a big sound board on a piano. I have not done it on my car, but, I am confident that for bass notes, mounting the speakers solidly, with 8 screws each to the metal will result in absolutely solid bass notes.

Hope this helps.

Arn

Edit: you do need some vent. That is easy to do with spacers on the screws. The chassie of the speaker will transmit vibrations to the firewall.

[This message has been edited by Arns85GT (edited 08-15-2010).]

quote Originally posted by Arns85GT: So, you can, in fact, mount a sub woofer on a plate and rely on the back of the speaker to send sound out. In the case of the Fiero firewall, it carries sound vibration throughout the car. It acts like a big sound board on a piano. I have not done it on my car, but, I am confident that for bass notes, mounting the speakers solidly, with 8 screws each to the metal will result in absolutely solid bass notes. Hope this helps. Arn Edit: you do need some vent. That is easy to do with spacers on the screws. The chassie of the speaker will transmit vibrations to the firewall.

What about sound wave cancelation? The sound wave from the back of the speaker is opposite of the front. The 2 waves will cancel each other out resulting in poor lower end response. You experienced some of that from the sounds of it with your home speakers. The sound emitted out the back of you Blues Cube was the opposite phase coming from the front of your home speaker system, canceling each other out and causing poor sound. The 4" of foam reduced the soundwave emition from your Blues Cube reducing the cancelation effect and improving sound.

What you descibe above sounds more like a bass transducer, like those made by Aura. They vibrate what they are mounted to which I'm sure produces some sound but I can't imagine the flex in a steel panel is enough to create much sound. Transducers are made more for tactile feeling rather then hearing.

But then maybe I'm just not understanding what your trying to convey.

That sounds good in theory, but in practice it is a whole different ball game.

In the case of my Blues Cube, there was no sound degeneration, it was simply sound volume kicking out where we didn't want it. I needed a monitor and my main sound to the audience was coming through about a megawatt of house sound. The sound guy did not need my amp broadcasting to the front rows.

Yes the sound waves are exactly opposite, but they do not conflict. In the case I described, you would have the speaker mounted with maybe 1/8" spacers on the firewall. The sound coming out those cracks would be absorbed by the carpet liner. The sound transmitting from the speaker chassis into the metal would be consistent with the sound coming off the cone. If the speaker needs a vent, you consult the manufacturer's spec sheet. If you vent the speaker in the way I described, you multiply 1/8" x pi x Diameter. If you need more or less vent you change the 1/8"

Remember you are talking about 30-50 hz. for a woofer. The mids and highs that can distort are not part of the equation. It assumes you have a signal splitter and not all the sound going through all the speakers.

Given the distance between the dash and the back of the seat, there is virtually no noticeable time lag there.

There would be no distortion, however, you might get vibration in the car if you have loose panels.

Arn

quote Originally posted by dobey: Also, 12s are pretty heavy. You'd probably want to mount it up front to bring the weight balance closer to 50/50, or try to get it as close to center as possible (which isn't a whole lot further rearward from the spare tire well anyway).

also somethign i took into consideration for my many ideas lol. on sub i want is around 70lbs (another i think is heavier) and the amp i want is like 30lbs, and the speaker amp i want is at least 15. so thats another 115lbs id hope to be able to stuff up front
also, i should add, i had emailed Fi about doing a bandpass enclosure for either trunk space in the Fiero, and they said their Q model would be best, but the frequency response in the best possible enclosure (as far as bandpass) would be around 20 to just over 80 (thats not the EXACT frequencies itll play effectively, thats what Fi said the flat response would be). so youd need midbass. i can imagine a different sub getting much different results? thats one of my more favored ideas, but id need to get pods made for midbass speakers, them buy an amp for them and buy them :P

Just go to local **** store and get a couple of vibrators. Wire them to the battery and duct tape them to seat bottoms.

To me anyway, vibrations and rattles in my car are just annoying......but to each their own. Im happy with an indash AM radio and a 3 inch dash speaker.

Ok, I gave up on the rear trunk idea, BUT i have certainly not given up on getting bass in my car. I went to work on a behind the seat enclosure today for a pioneer 12" sub. The enclosure sticks a little under 5" out from the firewall. Ill have pictures soon. I haven't had time to put the seat back in yet, so I'm not sure how much Ill have to slide it forward. My next focus will be to put subs in the front. I had a look in there today and had some good ideas, but would it be possible to relocate the accumulator to the back of the car? If I could then I could gain valuable space.

quote Originally posted by jasedude: Ok, I gave up on the rear trunk idea, BUT i have certainly not given up on getting bass in my car. I went to work on a behind the seat enclosure today for a pioneer 12" sub. The enclosure sticks a little under 5" out from the firewall. Ill have pictures soon. I haven't had time to put the seat back in yet, so I'm not sure how much Ill have to slide it forward. My next focus will be to put subs in the front. I had a look in there today and had some good ideas, but would it be possible to relocate the accumulator to the back of the car? If I could then I could gain valuable space.

The A/C accumulator/condenser? No, not really. They're where they are for a reason.

FWIW, a good 6.5" sub, in a good enclosure, on a moderately good 80w rms mono amp, will produce more than enough bass to fill the Fiero cabin. There really isn't all that much space to fill with the low end. I have a JL 6w0 in a not so great box, powered by the factory amp, mounted under the dash, and it provides pretty good fill. The bass does get overshadowed when I crank up the volume, but I also have some really cheap 4x10s in my dash, and some OK 4x6s in the B-pillars. When I get rid of the dash speakers and go with in-door components, and build a better enclosure for the sub, and get it the right amount of power, it will sound a thousand times better.

you should get a pair of eD SQ10s and put one behind each seat. thats by far the simplest idea i have for my car (altho for me it would be a temp solution till i can fit the BTL )

quote Originally posted by jasedude: I understand its not for everybody...but being a teenager, I want what I had in my old big car, loud obnoxious bass, even if the quality isn't audiophile status. It's the same as Rim's, some people like big, chromed out flashy one's, others think they are gaudy. It's just the personal taste of my generation that sound systems should be VERY loud. I know there are other options, but I'm spoiled for two 12's and I don't know of any other way to get them in the car.

I guess I need to buy stock in hearing aids if this is a "personal taste of my generation that sound systems should be VERY loud." Wait until you double your age and pay for it (I wish I had taken better care now).

That being said, why not take the seat backs off, make a sub box that replaces them (since you aren't going to put anything behind the seat anyways), cover with padding (except the speaker) and cover it. "Back in the day" I set in an employees Tracer where he did this. The bass hit was so hard it felt like it was going to stop my heart. On the one hand it was awesome, on the other it was just stupid... I will give him credit though, he put dynomat everwhere so you didn't hear that irritating boom rattling the fenders of the car 10 feet away.

I think my main problem with (most) people adding bass is they just think "I want it cheap, loud and F whoever I bother." Do it right and sound proof your car first so the rest of us don't have to hear it...

LOL. I guess I got old somewhere along the way, it also bothers me to sit near people using head phones turned up so loud I can hear the music... It kind of defeats the purpose...

------------------
-Brian

My 87 GT Poly Suspension Upgrade (all pics) thread
Removing the roof panel

Idea:

Slide the passenger seat forward a bit and build a mini sub box to fit behind the seat.

I've seen it done before. Imo, Fieros just aren't the car to turn into ones that drive down the street and your windows on your house shake ... they're just not that kind of car.

I do believe, however, that a Fiero can have high quality sound inside the car.

quote Originally posted by MulletproofMonk: I think my main problem with (most) people adding bass is they just think "I want it cheap, loud and F whoever I bother." Do it right and sound proof your car first so the rest of us don't have to hear it...

I think that's the main problem. Most people who install these insane stereos in their vehicles, are more interested in just feeling the bass, and making sure everyone else can hear it, than understanding the lyrics in the music they're 'listening' to.

Dynamat in the right places, with the right size box, and the right amount of power going to a 6.5-8" sub will well more than fill the Fiero cabin with bass, anyway. Even with the busted box in my S-10 Ext Cab with a 6.5" and 80-100w amp, it's plenty of bass. Some dynamat and a better box, with maybe improving the mounts and baffling for the door speakers, and it will pretty stealthily amazing for what it is.