Where are the fuseable links on the starter wiring located? They're definitely NOT on the positive battery cable so I assume they're on the smaller wires that attach to the starter....Where exactly?


Thanks in advance!

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Correct. By the battey no the fenderwell. One of the two red ones

Okay, I'm trying to sort out a"no crank when hot" problem. I've replaced the starter & heatwrapped it, replaced the positive battery cable and STILL have the damn problem. I'm afraid to drive the car anywhere I don't plan on being for an hour or so. I was told to replace the fuseable links and that should cure the problem.

Am I on the right track or what? Any suggestions?

Replacing parts to guess fix a trouble should only be a last resort. You think the fusable link is going bad - and then re-joining when cold? Get the trouble to happen and check if voltage is getting to the control (small) wire when you turn the key. Also check and make sure the power wire still has constant power. IF you lose +12 at the control wire at start when hot - well then pursue the wring. If when the trouble IS happening you still have +12 when turning the key to start then it's not wiring/switches

quote Originally posted by phonedawgz: The fusable link down by the starter - sends voltage to the ECM when the key is turned to start.

There is also a fusable link (or maybe the same one) that feeds power to the cold start injector switch and injector when cranking (v6 only)

Matt

There's only one fusible link on the starter solenoid. Depending on whether you started out with a 4 cyl or 6 cylinder engine when you swapped in your 3.4, that fusible link either powers just the ECM (4 cyl) or just the cold start fuel injector circuit.

Regardless, it's not likely the cause of your problems. A fusible link either works or it doesn't since it's just a strand of wire. To help diagnose the problem better, you'll have to say whether you've got an automatic or a manual transmission, and whether your starter solenoid clicks or not when you say it won't crank.

quote Originally posted by Bloozberry: There's only one fusible link on the starter solenoid. Depending on whether you started out with a 4 cyl or 6 cylinder engine when you swapped in your 3.4, that fusible link either powers just the ECM (4 cyl) or just the cold start fuel injector circuit. Regardless, it's not likely the cause of your problems. A fusible link either works or it doesn't since it's just a strand of wire. To help diagnose the problem better, you'll have to say whether you've got an automatic or a manual transmission, and whether your starter solenoid clicks or not when you say it won't crank.

It's an auto tranny, the car was a 2.8 before the 3.4 swap, the present starter is a NEW one (not a rebuild), the problem has not been there until very recently, there's NO click at the solenoid and the car WILL start if I turn the key on, reach under the car with a long screwdriver and ground out the solenoid. But as you can guess, that requires lying down next to the car and reaching under it unless I carry my little floor jack around with me. The lights dim when I turn the key so there's a power drain somewhere when I try to start it. Normally it takes about 20-30 minutes for the car to cool off enough to start but yesterday it was 90 degrees here and it took over an hour. Luckily, I was at home. So I can only guess that the problem is getting worse.

I've read threads where guys experiencing a similar problem HAVE said the link may have been affected by excessive heat causing a drop in voltage to the solenoid when it heats up. Maybe a corroded wire going to the smaller solenoid terminal? There was also a suggestion that the "neutral safety switch" may not be closing when hot. Just out of curiosity, where is it located?

I'm almost tempted to put in a switch to ground out the solenoid when it happens but fear that may cause yet another problem. Besides, that's just "jury rigging" the problem, not solving it.

[This message has been edited by Doni Hagan (edited 07-05-2010).]

If the solenoid doesn't click when you try to crank it, then you're not getting 12V at the solenoid. So the problem lies in trying to find where the 12V is dropping off line. The circuit takes this path:

Power runs from the battery, to the battery junction block on a large red wire, through fusible link A attached to the junction block, down a large red wire to the ignition switch, then out the ignition switch along a large yellow wire to the Park/Neutral switch (mounted on the transmission), and then finally from there on a large purple wire directly to the starter solenoid.

If you've got a voltmeter or a 12V test light, you've got to get someone to hold the key in the CRANK position during one of those occasions that it won't crank. Then place the transmission in neutral or park, and starting at the purple wire connection at the starter solenoid, and working your way backwards through each connection in the circuit as above, locate where the voltage drops off. Be sure to leave the connectors connected... just back-probe the wires through the back of the connectors. That'll tell you where the problem is. If you get 12V right at the solenoid, then your new starter isn't working.

Okay, process of elimination. After reading a thread about faulty neutral safety switches, I disconnected mine, jumped the purple & yellow wires, grabbed my radar detector and went for a "well over 55" run to get the car heated up good. When I got home, I left it idling for an additional 10 minutes (just in case) and shut it off with the trunk lid closed to retain the heat. After 10 more minutes, it started right up!!

At this point, it looks like the neutral switch was the culprit. Apparently, they CAN fail when hot causing a "no crank" condition. Something else to put in the FieroCare database!! Since I have an auto tranny, I may just bypass the damn thing altogether.

Thanks for your suggestions and whatnot, guys!

[This message has been edited by Doni Hagan (edited 07-05-2010).]

FYI, the '84 was different. The links were mounted near the starter motor, not on the passenger side firewall.

Coming off the LARGE starter wire? then to the fuseable link and then to the body?

no, the large starter wire never has a fusable link on it in any year model car. The fusable link is on the solinoid wire.

There is no sense in putting the fuseable link at the end of a wire run. If there is one down there at the starter I am thinking its much like the later years - where a smaller wire runs off the solonoid control wire - to the ECM or like on the V6 - the cold start injector. Because the size of the wire is much less - the fusable link that is at the battery - that protects the starter switch circuit - is too big for the smaller wire - thus a smaller fusable link at the starter solonoid and then that smaller wire runs elsewhere.

Putting a fusable link at the end of a wire run, would only blow if the device itself shorted. Unless there is a fuseable link or fuse at the start - a short in the wire would result in the car starting on fire.

no crank when hot is one of 3 things:
bad starter
bad battery cables/bad connections
bad battery
and, usually its a mix of the above, not exclusively one

quote Originally posted by phonedawgz: There is no sense in putting the fuseable link at the end of a wire run. If there is one down there at the starter I am thinking its much like the later years - where a smaller wire runs off the solonoid control wire - to the ECM or like on the V6 - the cold start injector.

I know you understand what you're talking about, it's just that you've misunderstood how the '84's are laid out. On '84's, the two main fusible links A & B are at the starter solenoid, and they are attached to the battery lead, not the small solenoid lead as suggested by Toddster. They don't protect the starter, they only use the large battery lead connection to the starter as a convenient junction point just like the junction box on the later years.

quote Originally posted by phonedawgz: Putting a fusable link at the end of a wire run, would only blow if the device itself shorted. Unless there is a fuseable link or fuse at the start - a short in the wire would result in the car starting on fire.

While this is true, it's not the case for the '84's since the fusible links are at the beginning of the circuits they protect. Have a look at the diagram below and it'll become clear.

quote Originally posted by Pyrthian: no crank when hot is one of 3 things: bad starter bad battery cables/bad connections bad battery and, usually its a mix of the above, not exclusively one

Respectfully, that diagnosis isn't universal . There are certainly other factors to consider as I addressed all those areas and the problem remained. My recent experience tells me that the "no crank when start" can indeed be caused by something else. Mine was clearly a bad neutral safety switch that didn't close when it heated up.

Admittedly, I was wrong in assuming the problem was a fuseable link. Bloozberry was right in his statement that the links are either good or bad, broken or solid. It stands to reason that if it's burnt, it ain't gonna heal when it gets cold.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Bloozberry:

Well yes - if this IS coming off the LARGE cable - then that changes things -

Yes that IS the start of the wire run (the smaller wire run) and yes the fuseable link is at the start of that wire run exactly where it should be.

Yes that is why I asked about which wire - because while I haven't owned an 84, I do understand they don't have a power block.

I agree with you blooz - now that the wire issue is cleared up.