Hello all - I just acquired my first Fiero and it happens to be in non-working order. I would like to change this, as would my neighbors. If anyone can help me out on where to go next, I'd appreciate it. Here's the scoop:

Vehicle: 1987 Fiero GT, 75,000 miles, V6 / 5spd
Symptoms: Engine cranks but won't start. After a long soak period the car will start for about a second or two, idle about 2k, then just die out suddenly. After this I can crank forever and not get it to hit.

I thought it was the ignition, and some threads here showed some good diagnostics. PUC shows a little over 800 ohms. The coil appeared OK from some very basic resistance checks suggested by my Haynes manual. I have 12V on both the pink and white wire going into the ICM from the coil, which some have indicated as an issue. However, my tach functions normally for the brief startup times and during cranking (~500-600 rpms). I pulled a spark plug which looked fine, and cranked the car with this out and shorted to ground. It sparked OK, but I don't have much of a frame of reference of what it should look like. Should I follow the 12V on both ICM wires as a cause?

So then I went to fuel. I smelled gas after some bouts of cranking, so I initially thought fuel was OK. However when turning on the ignition I couldn't hear the fuel pump... is this typically audible from inside the car? I checked the FP fuse - OK. This was alive at 12V all the time, and showed some drop when the ignition was keyed on. I also thought I noticed a slight gain in voltage after the 2 second FP initial run. I couldn't find the FP relay, so I went to the oil pressure switch for access to the FP. I ran 12V to the white/tan wire with an ammeter, and pulled about 4 amps. Is this normal? Once again I didn't hear any pump running.

I don't have a fuel rail pressure gage, is there any other way to test for a working fuel pump? Besides depressing the schrader valve and spraying gas? (Hypothetically if I were to this, how powerful would 40psi of gas shoot out?)

I'm lost, I saw sparking and have tach, and smell fuel. Major mech issue? When it runs for the first 2 seconds it sounds good, and I would think with a major mech issue it wouldn't run at all.

I thought maybe the first run was off initial fuel pump pressure, and died out when the pressure bled down. However the ECM running-state FP relay would have to fail as well as the oil pressure switch (I build pressure during cranking), and the engine should still start whenever I key off then back on (no wait period).

Thanks all!

EDIT: I forgot to mention that the car has been sitting for for a few years (~3). The previous owner said it would start occasionally during this time but eventually got harder and harder to start, to the point where I am now.

[This message has been edited by ColumbusFiero (edited 03-16-2009).]

i would say its still your f/p you should notice the pump come on. with key being turned on....you can press the shrader valve... it wont hurt..lol most of the time i see the rubber line going from the fuel pump to the hard metal line deteriorate in the tank.. hence not enought pressure to run..

you could remove the feed line and just have the pump send fuel into an empty container. From there you could take measurements of how much fuel was sent out of the pump within a minute and see if it is getting proper flow. If it has proper flow then the pressure only comes from the resistance it gets at the regulator and injectors. This is something I use to do on old mechanical pumps with carbs... those had less flow though so I dont know how manageable it would be in this case.

I would drain the tank first, then replace the filter, then put in a couple 3 gallons fo fresh gas to start with.
you can run the fuel pump form the aldl connector that lives behind the cigarette lighte plate. you can supply 12v to pin g to run the pump, or you can put a meter on it to verify that 12v appears then when it should. it is a direct line to the pump.
you could have stuck injectors, or clogged injectors, a blocked filter, lots of causes.
A can of ether would be a nice test, spray some in the pcv port of the intake snorkle and see if that kicks it right off.
for ref, here is the aldl connector:

You have to check the basics.

1st is fresh fuel and a clean fuel filter.
2nd is the fuel pump working correctly - follow the above post to check by running the fuel pump thru ALDL.
3rd is check fuel pressure at manifold. Get a fuel pressure gauge. Trun on key - motor not running and you should have steady 40 plus psi. Turn key off and watch guage - should stay steady - if it drops quickly you have an injector / regulator problem.

If your fuel system checks out, get some help and some starting fluid. Start the car and try to keep it running by sparying starting fluid in the TB. If you can keep it running, your ignition is most likely OK and you still have a fuel issue - like stuck or gummed up injectors. It may be starting simply off of the cold start injectors and the other injectors are plugged.

I believe your problem lies in the fuel system. Get that going correctly first.

response to how powerful 40 psi is, you have 35 psi in your tires right? well push the valve in and compare your values. Best to use a fuel psi gauge and check the fuel values when the condition occurs. Also, do you still have spark when the condition occurs?

I say fuel also. If you have a Harbor Freight nearby just pick up their FI pressure tester. Usually only $15 ($10when on sale)
Well worth the money with FI engines.

Between low pressure and old gas you would get just what your seeing. Since seems to start and run a few seconds that would indicate fuel more than anything. You can also try the ether as mentioned...
If it fires that way then it's most likely your fuel.

Thanks for all your input guys. I chased down the fuel side more, and it is confirming what you have suggested. I checked the ALDL fuel pump pin @ key on... 12V. I pushed the schrader valve down, and it barely dribbled out (after keying on/off 3 times to run pump a bit). I then picked up some starting fluid, and she'll run a few seconds on that sprayed in the TB. Looks like no fuel.

I'm going to pull the tank and replace the pump, but just quick question before I start this... Is there a way to confirm the pump assembly is truely to blame, vs some injector stuck open and draining pressure instantly? I guess it would still run some if this were the case.

OK another question... can the tank be removed without an overhead lift? I plan to do this with jackstands, just wondering if I'll have the clearance.

OK one more question... anyone know where the cargo light switch is located?

Thanks again.

ColumbusFiero

The fuel tank can be pulled using jack stands. It's a bit tight but workable. In fact, that is the way I have pulled mine in the pass. As mentioned in replys to your question, purchase a fuel pressure gage. As indicated, they are cheap and will help in trouble shooting fuel pressure issues in the future. If once you have acquired a pressure gage and verify the pressure is either none existent or low you can then pull the tank. Good luck on your testing.

Oh, welcome to the forum and the madness

Mike

Cargo light - meaning trunk light? Switch is located in the latch assembly - trunk lid side. On the right side lid hinge is the wiring harness plug. Unplug this and the trunk light will stay off.

Before you pull the tank, make sure it is the fule pump. If you have the key on and you open the shrader valve you should have a steady stream of fuel and you should be able to hear the pump. It still may not be putting out enough pressure. Thats why it is important to get a pressure valve on there. Also could be your pressure regulator. Your pump may be running and simply flowing right back to the tank. Odds are its the pump but make sure that is the problem before tearing it apart.

Pat