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Death Wobble by Rolling Thunder
Started on: 12-04-2008 11:40 AM
Replies: 14
Last post by: Rolling Thunder on 12-05-2008 08:37 PM
Rolling Thunder
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Report this Post12-04-2008 11:40 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Rolling ThunderSend a Private Message to Rolling ThunderDirect Link to This Post
I'm almost finished making a Fiero road worthy that hasn't been driven in about 10 years. Yesterday was my first day to drive it around town and on the highway. There is a vibration that seems more than normal.

Symptoms:
May happen at the same rate the wheels turn
I lifted the car off the ground and found that the front tires have some play in them from left to right and that the steering rod isn't loose
Steering isn't precise, there's a small dead zone when steering from left to right

This might be me getting used to the car, but I'm pretty sure this didn't happen at the beginning of the day and got worse throughout the day (maybe something had deteriorated, like plastic). I've driven it around the block before yesterday and I didn't notice loose steering. I'll reattach the steering wheel to double check that it's not that.
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Pyrthian
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Report this Post12-04-2008 11:45 AM Click Here to See the Profile for PyrthianSend a Private Message to PyrthianDirect Link to This Post
sounds like pinion preload, worn pinion/rack, or bad u-joint in steering column
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spark1
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Report this Post12-04-2008 12:17 PM Click Here to See the Profile for spark1Send a Private Message to spark1Direct Link to This Post
If the tires sat in one spot for ten years, they should be replaced. Even if the car was on blocks the tires have aged and deteriorated. See http://www.safetyresearch.net/tires.htm
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Rolling Thunder
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Report this Post12-04-2008 01:27 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Rolling ThunderSend a Private Message to Rolling ThunderDirect Link to This Post
I replaced the tires... the old ones didn't hold air very long.

Are there any plastic or rubber parts in the steering system?

[This message has been edited by Rolling Thunder (edited 12-04-2008).]

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USFiero
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Report this Post12-04-2008 01:30 PM Click Here to See the Profile for USFieroSend a Private Message to USFieroDirect Link to This Post
Ditto on the tires being the likely culprit. Rear alignment is another biggie. Most shops will not know how to do the Fiero right... it may take them 2-3 attempts. Be patient with them. I've had alignment specialist offer to refund me a partial charge and go somewhere else after the second try. I insisted they try the once more, provided them printout of comments from this forum, and they finally got it right. A proper alignment is paramount on a Fiero!
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Rolling Thunder
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Report this Post12-05-2008 12:43 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Rolling ThunderSend a Private Message to Rolling ThunderDirect Link to This Post
Are there any plastic or rubber parts in the steering system?
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Primaris
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Report this Post12-05-2008 12:58 AM Click Here to See the Profile for PrimarisClick Here to visit Primaris's HomePageSend a Private Message to PrimarisDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Rolling Thunder:

...I lifted the car off the ground and found that the front tires have some play in them from left to right and that the steering rod isn't loose
Steering isn't precise, there's a small dead zone when steering from left to right...


Sounds like ball joints or tie rods to me.

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USFiero
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Report this Post12-05-2008 01:10 AM Click Here to See the Profile for USFieroSend a Private Message to USFieroDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Rolling Thunder:

Are there any plastic or rubber parts in the steering system?


All the factory bushings are rubber. I think there is some nylon in the steering rack, you can rebuild with a metal kit from Rodney Dickman. The rear cradle is bolted to the car with rubber mounts unless it is an 88 (solid mount) or a previous owner replaced them with polyurethane or aluminum (unlikely). The lower front ball joints are known to fail catastrophically without warning, so if they are original replace them. If you want to lower the front, get those from Rodney as well. He has a package deal on suspension parts. Sometimes the spring pads rot out, new ones are cheap. The rear upper mounts for the struts can rust out, I think you'd have to pull those out to get a good look at them.
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Rolling Thunder
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Report this Post12-05-2008 01:54 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Rolling ThunderSend a Private Message to Rolling ThunderDirect Link to This Post
I think that I'll tear apart the whole front end. The last owner gave me some poly bushings for the front that I have yet to install. I'll just knock out two in one. The Steering Rack Bushing from Rodney Dickman sounds right. The stock piece is plastic. It did feel like the problem worstened throughout the day. That would make me think that a deteriorated material wore quickly. We'll have to wait and see after I tear it all apart.
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Xanth
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Report this Post12-05-2008 05:45 AM Click Here to See the Profile for XanthSend a Private Message to XanthDirect Link to This Post
You shouldn't have play in the wheel and not in the steering, have you checked if the front bearings are snug? Assuming its not an 88 that is.
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Brocephus
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Report this Post12-05-2008 07:11 AM Click Here to See the Profile for BrocephusSend a Private Message to BrocephusDirect Link to This Post
Could also be a bad steering stabilizer.
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Rolling Thunder
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Report this Post12-05-2008 10:04 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Rolling ThunderSend a Private Message to Rolling ThunderDirect Link to This Post
It is an 88.

Where is the steering stabilizer located?
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squisher86SE
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Report this Post12-05-2008 01:48 PM Click Here to See the Profile for squisher86SESend a Private Message to squisher86SEDirect Link to This Post
Play could be in several places, depending on what's moving relative to what.

Tie rod ends are obvious culprits, outer OR inner (I had an inner on one side messed up that caused some wonky steering).

Worn out wheel bearings are another fairly obvious one. Same with ball joints.

You could have some slop in the rear suspension

You could have lousy alignment. Any toe out in the rear makes for a really WEIRD driving Fiero.

Or, as others have suggested, play in the rack itself or slop in steering u-joints, although that last bit is the least likely honestly.
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Xanth
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Report this Post12-05-2008 03:53 PM Click Here to See the Profile for XanthSend a Private Message to XanthDirect Link to This Post
With the 88 there is no steering stabilizer, and with what you've said so far I'm thinking along the lines of your inner tie rods.

Have you checked your control arms for play? When I first got my 88 the bushings had deteriorated to the point that I could wiggle the control arms around.
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Rolling Thunder
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Report this Post12-05-2008 08:37 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Rolling ThunderSend a Private Message to Rolling ThunderDirect Link to This Post
I fixed the wobble. The nut behind the steering wheel came loose.

However, I have some slop in the system with my inspections.

With both wheels in the air, there is about an eighth of an inch of play from left to right.

With one wheel in the air, there's less than that on each side. Both sides wiggle up and down very slightly with the passenger side being the worst.
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