i have been doing alot of researchover the past couple weeks, and, I have narrowed my options down to the two engines that were originally at the bottom of my list for a Fiero swap. My original plans were WAY too far out there, I can see that now and my secondary ideas were too far above my pay grade. So now, on my tertiary plan I think I may be almost ready to begin. I have narrowed my choices down to the 4.9L Caddy or the 3.4 DOHC for reasons of cost effectiveness and ease of install for a first time engine swapper. I am leaning more toward the V8 and, unless I find some sort of huge deal or advantage to the 3.4 (besides the obvious high RPM horsepower and the sound) I will be doing the Caddy swap. In my research I have found the following. I'm sure I have missed a ton of details and that's why i'm making this post. I have talked to people who have done many a swap already, looked at swapped cars in person and spend much time browsing the current forums and archives on this site and reading/watching others. So what have I missed?

4.9L Cadillac V8 out of the 1992-1994 cars.
AOD transmission is rather heavy (is it the 4T60?)
I prefer a manual Fiero Trans
Best trans for this motor is the 5 speed economy (Isuzu?)
I will need a custom flywheel or I will need to have one plugged and redrilled (Cavalier?)
I will want to upgrade to a stronger clutch (What are my options beside Centerforce?)
I will need new Transmission and Engine Mounts
The "dogbone" can be modified to fit the Caddy

Engine Upgrades:
Use Intake/TB out of an Allantra (can I keep the stock tune?)
Chip burned by Rockcrawler or FieroAddiction (pros and cons of each?)
Gasket Match/P&P Intake/heads
Can use 1.94" Intake valves (can the rest of the valvetrain stay stock with these?)
Comp can be bumped by shaving the heads
What is a safe shot of N2O to use on these motors? 75 hp?


I know that's alot to ask in one post and I'm sure I've missed alot. So help me out a little if you don't mind.

Thanks,

Travis

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Not a Fiero owner yet.

bump

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Not a Fiero owner yet.

quote Originally posted by AlabamaGuy: 4.9L Cadillac V8 out of the 1992-1994 cars. AOD transmission is rather heavy (is it the 4T60?) I prefer a manual Fiero Trans Best trans for this motor is the 5 speed economy (Isuzu?) I will need a custom flywheel or I will need to have one plugged and redrilled (Cavalier?) I will want to upgrade to a stronger clutch (What are my options beside Centerforce?) I will need new Transmission and Engine Mounts The "dogbone" can be modified to fit the Caddy Engine Upgrades: Use Intake/TB out of an Allantra (can I keep the stock tune?) Chip burned by Rockcrawler or FieroAddiction (pros and cons of each?) Gasket Match/P&P Intake/heads Can use 1.94" Intake valves (can the rest of the valvetrain stay stock with these?) Comp can be bumped by shaving the heads What is a safe shot of N2O to use on these motors? 75 hp?

To answer a few, ideally the stock transmission is the one you want (4T60E) - but if you want to use a manual, try the Getrag. I have the Izusu and 1st gear is very useless as the rpms climb too fast and out of the power band. The 4 speed is better for a 1st gear option, but it is a 'clunky' tranny (I have done both).

Flywheel: you need a custom one - that being one bought from LSC Performance or you have the Cavilier one plugged and redrilled

Clutch: would not recommend Centerforce - bunch of crap, mine didn't make it for long after the 'break in' period - would not hold. So far had good success with the Spec Stage 3 (3 years now - daily driver).

Tranny mounts, don't need if yours are good but couldn't hurt (will need if you use the auto). Engine mounts will be new as stock mounts will not be used.

Dog bone: does not need to be modified - HOWEVER, you will have to make a custom bracket for it. Easier to just use a trailing arm from another car and weld a bracket to the cradle to bolt it to. But, depending how you mount your engine, the dog bone may not be needed.

Rockcrawl is Fiero Addiction - Fiero Addiction is his web site, I would recommend getting your chip from him if at all possible. I would NOT recommend Aaron (aka Sticky Pony) - he has had 2 of my chips since March and I have not got them back yet (always some sort of excuse). So I am out 2 chips and the money

Engine performance - best option is to add some sort of force air induction, the 4.9 can't breath above 4000 rpm too well. I did not notice any real gains after I ported and polished the intake/heads/exhaust, Delta cam installed, shaved heads and bored throttle body. If you want performance I would personally recommend you got the DOHC route so you can get a higher rpm range out of the block - decided what you want to use the car for. The 4.9 is a fun car to boot around in, but it is not a 1/4 mile car.

quote Originally posted by AlabamaGuy: i have been doing alot of researchover the past couple weeks, and, I have narrowed my options down to the two engines that were originally at the bottom of my list for a Fiero swap. My original plans were WAY too far out there, I can see that now and my secondary ideas were too far above my pay grade. So now, on my tertiary plan I think I may be almost ready to begin. I have narrowed my choices down to the 4.9L Caddy or the 3.4 DOHC for reasons of cost effectiveness and ease of install for a first time engine swapper. I am leaning more toward the V8 and, unless I find some sort of huge deal or advantage to the 3.4 (besides the obvious high RPM horsepower and the sound) I will be doing the Caddy swap. In my research I have found the following. I'm sure I have missed a ton of details and that's why i'm making this post. I have talked to people who have done many a swap already, looked at swapped cars in person and spend much time browsing the current forums and archives on this site and reading/watching others. So what have I missed? 4.9L Cadillac V8 out of the 1992-1994 cars. AOD transmission is rather heavy (is it the 4T60?) I prefer a manual Fiero Trans Best trans for this motor is the 5 speed economy (Isuzu?) I will need a custom flywheel or I will need to have one plugged and redrilled (Cavalier?) I will want to upgrade to a stronger clutch (What are my options beside Centerforce?) I will need new Transmission and Engine Mounts The "dogbone" can be modified to fit the Caddy Engine Upgrades: Use Intake/TB out of an Allantra (can I keep the stock tune?) Chip burned by Rockcrawler or FieroAddiction (pros and cons of each?) Gasket Match/P&P Intake/heads Can use 1.94" Intake valves (can the rest of the valvetrain stay stock with these?) Comp can be bumped by shaving the heads What is a safe shot of N2O to use on these motors? 75 hp? I know that's alot to ask in one post and I'm sure I've missed alot. So help me out a little if you don't mind. Thanks, Travis

In reply to your post I will try to help out with some answers the best I can>

The 4.9 came from cars of those years 92-94.
AOD trannys are from Fords not GM it is called a 4T60.
There is no such thing as a best tranny for this engine as they have their pros and cons.
Isuzu has a better gearing than the Getrag for this motor but not as strong as the Getrag.
You can do either custom or redrilled never heard of a redill failing as some predicted.
Clutches are a personal choice ,some like Centerforce, Luk and vice versa some hate them thers is a lot of info here just do a search.
You will need to make new mounts or purchase them they are not hard to make if you have the skills and tools to do so.

Engine upgrades.

No you cannot use an Allantra (Elantra is Hyundai) tb but maybe you mean Allante by Cadillac as for tuning you will need to have a custom modded chip.
Rockcrawl and Fiero Addiction are the same operation.
Yes you can gasket match and port intake and heads.
1.94 intake valves would require extensive machine work to the heads and the rest of the vvalve train.
As for shaving heads it is not advisable to do this on this engine,you might run into sealing issues with the heads an intake manifold........not your typical Chevy.
As for Nos it depends on the condition and mileage of the engine, do a compression test first to see what you have before doing so.

You can find all the info on this swap by doing a search with all your concerns and hope you have a better idea now........................later.


edited for spelling

[This message has been edited by gunslinger (edited 07-15-2008).]

Which 5-speed has the 2.xx:1 Final Drive Ratio?

How is the performance market for the 3.4 DOHC?

quote Originally posted by AlabamaGuy: Which 5-speed has the 2.xx:1 Final Drive Ratio?

None. Getrag (MG2) is 3.61. Isuzu (MT2) is 3.35. The only way to get a 2.xx final without custom gear ratios is to use the stock caddy 4T60E 4 speed auto. This tranny comes attached to all 4.9's from the factory and has the best gear ratios of any for making use of the 4.9's power band.

There just is no ideal manual for use with this or any other V8 engine in a fiero.

quote Originally posted by Fieroseverywhere: None. Getrag (MG2) is 3.61. Isuzu (MT2) is 3.35. The only way to get a 2.xx final without custom gear ratios is to use the stock caddy 4T60E 4 speed auto. This tranny comes attached to all 4.9's from the factory and has the best gear ratios of any for making use of the 4.9's power band. There just is no ideal manual for use with this or any other V8 engine in a fiero.

I must have misread then. Any tips on finding shift kits for these transmissions? I imagine they have pretty sloppy shifting habits coming from a Cadillac which was meant for smoothness.

Edit: Will the 4T60e shift kits work in the 4T60 trans? Can it be manually shifted?

I really like the idea of a clutch, how bad are the fiero transmissions with the 4.9L? Not in terms of reliablility but acceleration wise.
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Not a Fiero owner yet.

[This message has been edited by AlabamaGuy (edited 07-15-2008).]

quote Originally posted by AlabamaGuy: I must have misread then. Any tips on finding shift kits for these transmissions? I imagine they have pretty sloppy shifting habits coming from a Cadillac which was meant for smoothness.

My understanding is that shift kits are available. I used a manual so I don't know for sure (currently isuzu but going fast, changing to custom 4 speed manual). However, the 4T60E is an electronic shifted transmission. Shift points can be set in your PCM for just what you want. Not to mention the availability of parts and options to change gear ratios and customize the tranny to your liking.

The only major drawbacks are the fact that its an automatic (big problem for me), and it's HEAVY.

For most swaps doing an auto is more expensive. This is not the case with a 4.9. They never had a manual from the factory so it takes some work to make it happen.

I have also been using the SPEC 3 clutch. Works well but only has about 900 miles on it at the moment. Very nice drivability and has never slipped on me. As for reliability of the fiero manuals... The isuzu will break, its not a matter of if, more like when. Some can make them last with proper shifting and RPM matching. The Getrag should last very well as will the 85-86 4 speed muncie. Both are strong trannies but you will still be puting more power to them then are rated from, though not a ton more. Any 84 trans probably won't last as it should either. They have weak cases that tend to split themselves with any decent amount of power. They were strengthened for the 85-86 ones. The good news is the internals can be mixed and matched to come up with some good gear ratios and even give better gas mileage then the isuzu if properly equipped.

If you want the best acceleration you can get without reguard for gas mileage or top speed you can build a good 4 speed manual with the 85-86 case, 4.10 final out of an 84 tranny. You won't do more then 110mph with stock wheels/tires but you'll get there in a hurry.

[This message has been edited by Fieroseverywhere (edited 07-15-2008).]

quote Originally posted by Fieroseverywhere: My understanding is that shift kits are available. I used a manual so I don't know for sure (currently isuzu but going fast, changing to custom 4 speed manual). However, the 4T60E is an electronic shifted transmission. Shift points can be set in your PCM for just what you want. Not to mention the availability of parts and options to change gear ratios and customize the tranny to your liking. The only major drawbacks are the fact that its an automatic (big problem for me), and it's HEAVY. For most swaps doing an auto is more expensive. This is not the case with a 4.9. They never had a manual from the factory so it takes some work to make it happen. I have also been using the SPEC 3 clutch. Works well but only has about 900 miles on it at the moment. Very nice drivability and has never slipped on me. As for reliability of the fiero manuals... The isuzu will break, its not a matter of if, more like when. Some can make them last with proper shifting and RPM matching. The Getrag should last very well as will the 85-86 4 speed muncie. Both are strong trannies but you will still be puting more power then then are rated from, though not a ton more. Any 84 trans probably won't last as it should either. They have weak cases. They were strengthened for the 85-86 ones.

I am not a fan of the autos in a car, but for my first swap would it be better for me to learn with the auto? I'm 17 and I am spending my hard earned money on this (I'm not a spoiled rich kid) and I do all my own work. So for me doing this, would I be better off with the 4T60?

By the way, I have local help (Cooter), who has already been an AWESOME source of information for me, if I get stuck, I will be giving him a visit. Thanks again, if you stumble on this thread!

I am now actively looking for the right car and donor car for engine/trans.

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Not a Fiero owner yet.

quote Originally posted by AlabamaGuy: I am not a fan of the autos in a car, but for my first swap would it be better for me to learn with the auto? I'm 17 and I am spending my hard earned money on this (I'm not a spoiled rich kid) and I do all my own work. So for me doing this, would I be better off with the 4T60? By the way, I have local help (Cooter), who has already been an AWESOME source of information for me, if I get stuck, I will be giving him a visit. Thanks again, if you stumble on this thread! I am now actively looking for the right car and donor car for engine/trans.

Its really up to you how you build your car. Either way it WILL be some work to get'er done no matter which trans you pick. I know axels are an issue on the autos but I haven't the foggiest idea of how to install one. With the manuals the flywheel is the biggest issue. If you have the money both of these can be overcome with little more then a phone call to the right person. Which do you prefer? How good are you with a manual?

quote Originally posted by Fieroseverywhere: Its really up to you how you build your car. Either way it WILL be some work to get'er done no matter which trans you pick. I know axels are an issue on the autos but I haven't the foggiest idea of how to install one. With the manuals the flywheel is the biggest issue. If you have the money both of these can be overcome with little more then a phone call to the right person. Which do you prefer? How good are you with a manual?

How much is the norm for the custom drilled flywheel? Can a local machine shop do it?

quote Originally posted by AlabamaGuy: How much is the norm for the custom drilled flywheel? Can a local machine shop do it?

Not sure myself. I've heard estimates of 250. WCF sells flywheels (steel or aluminum) for this swap for around 400 FYI. They drill new blank flywheels with the needed pattern. If you want to take one to a machine shop you can use an 88 fiero flywheel. It must be plugged and redrilled for the caddy crank bolt pattern. A centering ring needs to be installed also since the center bore is different (caddy is smaller). You can also use a flywheel from an 84-87 fiero but you have to cut off the counterweight and get them rebalanced, this is in addition to the plugging and redrilling. Doesn't matter which way you go its going to cost a bit. Plus you have the cost of the clutch to take into consideration. I think the SPEC 3 goes for around 300. Others cost even more.

[This message has been edited by Fieroseverywhere (edited 07-15-2008).]

quote Originally posted by Fieroseverywhere: Not sure myself. I've heard estimates of 250. WCF sells flywheels (steel or aluminum) for this swap for around 400 FYI. They drill new blank flywheels with the needed pattern. If you want to take one to a machine shop you can use an 88 fiero flywheel. It must be plugged and redrilled for the caddy crank bolt pattern. A centering ring needs to be installed also since the center bore is different (caddy is smaller). You can also use a flywheel from an 84-87 fiero but you have to cut off the counterweight and get them rebalanced, this is in addition to the plugging and redrilling. Doesn't matter which way you go its going to cost a bit. Plus you have the cost of the clutch to take into consideration. I think the SPEC 3 goes for around 300. Others cost even more.

I have a local source for a transmission out of a 1992 Cadillac Fleetwood with Electronic traction control with a 2.73:1 Final Drive Ratio for $300. Is this the 4T60? Will the Traction control work?

For you 4.9L guys, what about axles, do I need new ones or what mounts do I use?
Also, people seem to throw around the terms 4T60 and 4T60e alot on here. It is the 4T60 that comes with the 4.9, correct? Is it worth upgrading to the electronic transmission? Are parts interchangeable between the 2 shift kit wise?


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Not a Fiero owner yet.

[This message has been edited by AlabamaGuy (edited 07-15-2008).]

The tranny that comes with the 4.9 is the 4T60E ("E" = electronic shifting.)
The 4T60 (aka "late" 440T4) was pretty much all done by the end of the 90 model year. It used no electronic controls at all, unless you want to count the TCC lockup.
I suspect that the late 4T60 is probably as reliable as the 4T60E. Early versions (usually referred to as 440T4s) were a bit problematic. They got better every year.
The tranny that you have access to should work okay, but your acceleration won't be the best, with the 2.73s.
It should get superb gas mileage, however.

I'm with the others who suggest keeping the automatic tranny. At least for a while. The automatic really works well with the engine.
The manual, OTOH, is a whole additional bucket of work.
I've done several swaps, including an automatic to manual tranny swap in my 3.4 coupe, and I'd have to think really hard about doing a 5 speed swap into my 4.9.

I also don't think I'd bother porting or adding larger valves. I probably wouldn't even gasket match, unless I had another reason to go into the motor.
You'll end up spending a lot of money for only moderate returns. (You did say that you were on a budget... right?)

Cooter has a wealth of knowledge on the 4.9 and all that is involved. He's probably been deeper into this swap than most people here, other than Rockcrawl.

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Raydar
88 4.9 Formula IMSA Fasback..........................88 3.4 coupe -soon to be something other than red

Read Nealz Nuze! Praise the Lowered!

quote Originally posted by Raydar: The tranny that comes with the 4.9 is the 4T60E ("E" = electronic shifting.) The 4T60 (aka "late" 440T4) was pretty much all done by the end of the 90 model year. It used no electronic controls at all, unless you want to count the TCC lockup. I suspect that the late 4T60 is probably as reliable as the 4T60E. Early versions (usually referred to as 440T4s) were a bit problematic. They got better every year. The tranny that you have access to should work okay, but your acceleration won't be the best, with the 2.73s. It should get superb gas mileage, however. I'm with the others who suggest keeping the automatic tranny. At least for a while. The automatic really works well with the engine. The manual, OTOH, is a whole additional bucket of work. I've done several swaps, including an automatic to manual tranny swap in my 3.4 coupe, and I'd have to think really hard about doing a 5 speed swap into my 4.9. I also don't think I'd bother porting or adding larger valves. I probably wouldn't even gasket match, unless I had another reason to go into the motor. You'll end up spending a lot of money for only moderate returns. (You did say that you were on a budget... right?) Cooter has a wealth of knowledge on the 4.9 and all that is involved. He's probably been deeper into this swap than most people here, other than Rockcrawl.

The cam upgrade seems doable for me so while I'm in there I will check everything out. Would it be worth it to pull the heads to check the valves or should I just do a compression check and be done with it? Just replacing the cam I won't have to bother the rest of the valvetrain will I? I have been inside a 302 ford and an SHO motor so I'm assuming this will be similar to the 302 ford in basic design being a pushrod design. One of my problems right now is that local salvage yards have the engine/trans already pulled but don't have any PCMs/Harnesses availiable. I will give the DIY places a call in the morning.

Thanks again for putting up with these question, everyone.

Yes, I am on a budget but I do believe this is doable if I can find the right car.
Cooter is immensely knowledgeable and was able to answer any questions I threw out there. I'm lucky to have someone like him close by.

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Not a Fiero owner yet.

If someone has not mentioned it already.LSC performance flywheels out in Lake Elsinore, CA ,drills blank flywheels for the 4.9. Mine was around $300 shipped to the door.yours would be cheaper as I had some extra things done to mine.

I don't think anyone has had any trouble redrilling the caviler flywheels.However even though I do some machine work,I was a little shy to do it myself.I also could not find a machine shop in the area that was willing to attempt it.They said "thats crazy,it will fly apart and kill someone" I heard this phrase many times.however it is obviously not true.

Also if you are looking for a wiring harness.I have one from a 92 deville,it has not been cut and is in great shape,however I only have the part that goes on the engine and plugs in the firewall,, not the part under the dash.

I think I'm getting an idea of what I want, I found this 87 se and he has come down to $300 with wheels and other parts thrown in, looks like it's coming with the Duke so I can sell it...but it has a good interior! I am waiting on more information before I make the 2 hour drive to see it but it has a good titile and seemingly strait body.

http://atlanta.craigslist.org/car/746715852.html

Edit: I just got offered the 87 GT along with all the other parts for $500 (three transmissions total). It's mine! lol

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Not a Fiero owner yet.

[This message has been edited by AlabamaGuy (edited 07-16-2008).]

As I meantioned LSC Performance for a new flywheel and cheaper than WCF (although I would not really ever buy from them again - bad experience).

My flywheel has been plugged and redrilled - no problems with over 3 years of daily driving on it. I believe it costed me somewhere just over $100 to get done. If you have to pay $250 to get this done - I would just with a new one from LSC.

Cam - if the engine is good, stay away from pulling it apart, save money on the gaskets for only a very mild gain (personal experience - don't care what 'others' claim) - if your compression is good, leave it alone as you could create more issues (especially with dealing with the head gaskets).

The automatic needs different axles - the manual uses the original axles that are in the car.

quote Originally posted by Mickey_Moose: Cam - if the engine is good, stay away from pulling it apart, save money on the gaskets for only a very mild gain (personal experience - don't care what 'others' claim) - if your compression is good, leave it alone as you could create more issues (especially with dealing with the head gaskets).

I second this. Do not pull the motor apart unless you have to. If compression is good then don't worry about it. As for the cam change you can do this by removing the timing cover/waterpump assembly only. I did a full rebuild on a high mileage motor when I put mine together. I'm still having some head gasket problems. The 4.9 is unique in this area and not the easiest thing to take care of. I can't stress this enough.... MAKE SURE TO USE THE GM COOLING SYSTEM TABLETS FOR THIS MOTOR. They are important and necissary. If you don't open the motor you'll probably be just fine.

quote Originally posted by Fieroseverywhere: I second this. Do not pull the motor apart unless you have to. If compression is good then don't worry about it. As for the cam change you can do this by removing the timing cover/waterpump assembly only. I did a full rebuild on a high mileage motor when I put mine together. I'm still having some head gasket problems. The 4.9 is unique in this area and not the easiest thing to take care of. I can't stress this enough.... MAKE SURE TO USE THE GM COOLING SYSTEM TABLETS FOR THIS MOTOR. They are important and necissary. If you don't open the motor you'll probably be just fine.

Won't the lifters keep the cam from coming out like this?

quote Originally posted by AlabamaGuy: Won't the lifters keep the cam from coming out like this?

Doh! Sorry about that. Its too early.

Right. Heads can stay on, Intake manifold needs to come off also... which means everything off of it. I'm got pics from my rebuild if you are interested in how it all comes apart. Later

quote Originally posted by Fieroseverywhere: Good luck here. I can't seem to give them away.

it has Aluminum pistons, if that helps any...I know little to nothing about the Duke...

I guess it is early out there, I was woke up by the fiero owner's phone call, haha, so I wasn't too upset.

[This message has been edited by AlabamaGuy (edited 07-16-2008).]

quote Originally posted by Fieroseverywhere: Doh! Sorry about that. Its too early. Right. Heads can stay on, Intake manifold needs to come off also... which means everything off of it. I'm got pics from my rebuild if you are interested in how it all comes apart. Later

...um...you can probably do it without removing the manifold. Just remove the rocker cover and then the rocker bridge assembly as a whole. DO NOT REMOVE EACH INDIVIDUAL ROCKER ARMS - if you remove those bolts, you will need to replace them with proper bolts as the ones that are in there are self tapping and will strip out when you push the motor hard (they are ok if you don't remove them) - this is also from experience. Anyways, once the bridge assembly is out, remove the push rods and rotate the block upside down (of course it should be on an engine stand for this). The lifters will move out of the way enough so that you can pull the cam (been there, and done that).

I still would not waste my money on a cam if I was to do it again - even PBJ says this, he says you would be far further ahead if you just port and polished the intake/heads, and I would have to agree as I removed an 'massive' amount of material just to gasket match the intake/heads when I did this. But, hey it's your cash. I drove my car before and after and didn't notice a big difference.

[This message has been edited by Mickey_Moose (edited 07-16-2008).]

quote Originally posted by Mickey_Moose: ...um...you can probably do it without removing the manifold. Just remove the rocker cover and then the rocker bridge assembly as a whole. DO NOT REMOVE EACH INDIVIDUAL ROCKER ARMS - if you remove those bolts, you will need to replace them with proper bolts as the ones that are in there are self tapping and will strip out when you push the motor hard (they are ok if you don't remove them) - this is also from experience. Anyways, once the bridge assembly is out, remove the push rods and rotate the block upside down (of course it should be on an engine stand for this). The lifters will move out of the way enough so that you can pull the cam (been there, and done that). I still would not waste my money on a cam if I was to do it again - even PBJ says this, he says you would be far further ahead if you just port and polished the intake/heads, and I would have to agree as I removed an 'massive' amount of material just to gasket match the intake/heads when I did this. But, hey it's your cash. I drove my car before and after and didn't notice a big difference.

Yea. That should work... as long as the engine is on a stand. The only part I would worry about is the lifter hold down under the intake manifold. Don't know if it would leave enough slack to remove the cam or not. I had my engine in about 300 pieces when I changed the cam so I can't tell you for sure.

I too would agree with not changing the cam unless you have too. Especially if you are going with an auto. The standard shift points make good use of the stock cam. My cam had some slightly chewed up lobes so I felt it needed to be replaced. I would say just get the motor in a running before you decide whether you want/need to upgrade anything. Most likley you will be very happy with it without any "extra's". Keeping costs down on the initial install is a good thing. Leaves more money for future projects or to cover the occational "mistakes".

So Gasket matching is sounding very good for the money. What about minor head work?

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Not a Fiero owner yet.

I'm not sure how much you what to spend,but thats a nice engine for sale in the mall.

quote Originally posted by ChadTanner: I'm not sure how much you what to spend,but thats a nice engine for sale in the mall.

I saw that, but it's about 5x what I could get from a JY motor/trans locally. Just not worth it to me.

quote Originally posted by AlabamaGuy: I have been reading here on the forums for several hours now on the wiring for this sort of swap. I am still very confused. Once I have the Caddy PCM and harness...what do I do then? It seems that every thread I find doesn't start at the beginning. Why can't I install the Caddy harness back onto the engine while it's sitting in the Fiero then wire up things like the fuel pump? If someone could get me started, and explain the basics I think that I could follow the diagrams and instructions that i have found through searching. I just don't see the need to cut and re-pin wires on the original Caddy harness going into the original Caddy PCM. I know I will need to adapt the guages and all but for the engine wiring in itself, can someone get me heading in the right direction?

Start here...
http://www.fieroaddiction.com/caddy49d.html

Ask your questions after this to help narrow everything down. There are a few of us out here that have built their own harnesses.
Trust me on this one, its much easier then most make it out to be.

The 4.9 makes a fun driving car.
I know others are not much up on the mods, but I modded my 4.9 and it is very reliable.
Heads shaved 10.5-1 CR
Delta Cam .502 lift
Intake and exhaust gasket matched and polished.
Intake center divider removed.
Late Chevy 5.7 Valve springs.
Allante steel rocker bridges.
4T60E 3.08 final drive and adjustable modulator shifts very firm.
2600 RPM stall converter (to much, probably ideal around 2100).
True dual exhaust.
Rockcrawl chip.
Best time in the 1/4 was a 13.89 with a 1.80 60' time. I think with some changes to the converter, tires and suspension, it may be able to get close to a 13.50, but that is probably about it for an automatic 4.9.

I have since pulled the motor and it is going into a 1962 Lotus I am building (1500lbs).

Gene

quote Originally posted by Fieroseverywhere: Start here... http://www.fieroaddiction.com/caddy49d.html Ask your questions after this to help narrow everything down. There are a few of us out here that have built their own harnesses. Trust me on this one, its much easier then most make it out to be.

When I have been a member for the required length of time I will rate you positively.
thanks for all the help so far. I will read this through, maybe a couple times, to better educate myself.

quote Originally posted by AlabamaGuy: Is the adjustable modulator the Transgo Shift Kit? I will talk to my local machine shop about shaving the heads, get prices on a valve job, P&P intakes and whatnot. I just need to find a 4.9L in good condition.

The adjustable modulator is about 15.00 and replaces the stock modulator. It allows you to turn up the line pressure on the trans and takes 10 min to change.

I should add, that with the stock 4.9, I drove it thousands of miles on both long and short trips with no problem, but once I upped the CR and added the cam, I also had to upgrade the radiator. It just would not stay cool on hot days with the stock one.

Gene

[This message has been edited by scrabblegod (edited 07-17-2008).]

Hey Gene,
I sent you a PM

I sent the same message in a email to scrabblegod.com,,but was not sure if it went through.

quote Originally posted by Fieroseverywhere: Ask your questions after this to help narrow everything down. There are a few of us out here that have built their own harnesses. Trust me on this one, its much easier then most make it out to be.

Been saying that for a long time...

quote Originally posted by AlabamaGuy: I have been reading here on the forums for several hours now on the wiring for this sort of swap. I am still very confused. Once I have the Caddy PCM and harness...what do I do then? It seems that every thread I find doesn't start at the beginning. Why can't I install the Caddy harness back onto the engine while it's sitting in the Fiero then wire up things like the fuel pump? If someone could get me started, and explain the basics I think that I could follow the diagrams and instructions that i have found through searching. I just don't see the need to cut and re-pin wires on the original Caddy harness going into the original Caddy PCM. I know I will need to adapt the guages and all but for the engine wiring in itself, can someone get me heading in the right direction?

The stock 4.9 harness does not fit too nicely in the Fiero - better to take it apart and reroute the wires. This part is easier to do when the motor is out of the car sitting on the cradle but it can it be done in the car. Once you have the wiring routed, you then stick the motor in the car and finish the wiring.

First you don't repin any wires unless you are putting new ends on them. You also don't have to cut the wires going to the 4.9 PCM - but as I said the stock harness does not fit well into the Fiero - you cut the wires to simply make them shorter so you don't have an excessive amount of wires going to the PCM (some of the wires are really long). Some wires may also be too short and may have to be extended (depends on how you route the wires). When I do the swap, my goal is to hide the wiring as much as possible to make the engine look clean, so there is a fair amount of shortening and lengthing. There are many pictures on here of 4.9's with wires hanging all over the top of the motor, and then there are some where the people took the time to hide them. You have to decide what you want to do.

The 4.9 is really cluttered on the top as it is with vacuum hoses and cables, now when you add wiring to that it just looks like a mess...but that is just me...

All the info you should need is here (look for my post about 2/3 rd's the way down on page 1): https://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum2/HTML/079246.html

Ok, things are starting to get cleared up now. I am looking at several Fieros locally so maybe sometime soon I can find a car and get started.

The intake you want is off a Cadillac Allante, not a Hyundai Elantra. Far as I can tell, it's a good mod!!