I want to pull the middle and upper intake manifold pieces this weekend when I go to visit my car in storage (I bought a new cover for it and I am going to wax it). I assume I have to pull the fuel rail to get the middle off (I've pulled the upper before) how do I go about taking the fuel rail and injectors out? Also at this point how much harder is it to pull the lower intake manifold? Also what should I do to protect the motor while its missing part (or all of) the intake manifold for 2 weeks while I port them over the holiday season. I have the complete fel-pro intake manifold gasket set to re-assemble it so no worries there.

upper & lower plenum - and intake manifold
the fuel rail is held on by 2 bolts. you also need to undo the fuel lines. I usually seperate them where they go from rubber lines to metal lines - its near the battery. you can remove the fuel rail with the injectors still on it. and, the injectors will be stubburn coming out.
I usually just lay a rag or towel over the exposed ports. you can also put masking tape across the ports.
the intake manifold has coolant in it. you dont want to remove this untill you lower the coolant level. cant remember if you need to remove the distributer - I dont think you do.
but - the nasty part: in order to put a new intake maniold gasket on - you will need to lash your valves

Is fuel going to spew or am I not opening a line? Is there a way to relieve fuel pressure, remove the injectors, and then is there a way to clean them (something I can soak them in or something)? 19 years of fluid and they can't be at their cleanest. What is lashing valves? I have a new thermostat and new thermostat gasket to install, and I want to release some coolant because I used water to top it off. So I want to bleed a little coolant out of the system and add back some pure antifreeze. What's a good way to remove coolant from the system? If lashing valves isn't too bad and you don't have to pull the distibuter I will pull the lower too because I need more power!!! well all 3hp or whatever the gain is lol.

I don't believe you'll have to fool with your valves in order to remove the lower intake manifold. I bought and installed a new Grooms long block about 10 years ago and I did not have to touch the valves to install any of the intake manifold parts.

You can relieve fuel pressure at the shraeder valve on the fuel rail. Just be sure to have something to catch the spurt of gas. I use my fuel pressure gauge. It has a hose for that purpose.

Did you have to mess with the distributer? Do you guys think its worth it to port the manifolds as much as I can?

quote Originally posted by Mr.PBody: Do you guys think its worth it to port the manifolds as much as I can?

IMHO, I'd skip that and just get a Trueleo intake manifold ( http://www.trueleo.com ) since it's been shown to register some impressive dyno-proven power gains, which evidence themselves via noticeable increases in both the height and the length of the engine's horsepower curve.

However, if installing a Trueleo intake is not an option either because of financial constraints, or simply an interest in keeping the Fiero engine's intake appearance looking as stock as possible --- which the Trueleo intake definitely does not do --- then this thread, "Improving Stock Intake Plenum," may be of interest to you: https://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum2/HTML/069539.html

As for the appearance of a different aftermarket intake manifold, the "High Performance Intake Manifold" offered by West Coast Fiero, I think it looks somewhat more like the stock Fiero intake manifold than does the Trueleo intake manifold. However, I expect that performance-wise, that actually is a disadvantage relative to the Trueleo, partly because the six runners of the WCF intake seem to employ essentially the same, torturous-looking, near-90-degree turns into the engine as does the stock Fiero manifold. On top of that, the WCF intake manifold is more pricey than the Trueleo intake manifold, but unlike the Trueleo, I've not seen any dyno tests published regarding the WCF manifold.

In any event, no matter what you decide to do, good luck with your project!

WCF is crap and I won't touch it with a 10 foot pole, but thats a different thread for a different time. This is about free horsepower without welding. I just want to know how hard it is pull the middle and possibly lower manifold. And even with the trueleo you still need to port the lower manifold.

To pull the lower manifold, you'll have to remove the valve covers and the distributer. The gasket that goes between the intake and the heads has the valve pushrods going through it, so you'll need to remove the pushrods, too. Some folks have just cut the intake gasket to get it around the pushrods, but that can create problems if the gasket slips during or after installation.

------------------
Rod Schneider, Woodstock, Ga.
"You can't have too many toys!"
1988 Fiero GT
1966 Porsche 911
Van's RV-6 airplane-under construction

valves adjustment


This may help take the guess work out of vavle lashing.
Heres the old thread --I only copied out the method I
used as not to get things to confused. Another note is
you can switch the colors as I did after this and
changed the widest groove to white, for timing
reasons--non the less--you can change the colors
before you start or after for timing reasons, just
make sure that you change all 3 colors in a clock wise
rotation and write then down for later reference..

I did find out something interesting while I was
doing this, and that is you can mark your dampner with
3 colors to take out the guess work while lashing
vavles. There are 3 grooves on dampner, the widest one
is your timing groove, heres what I did allthough I
can see when #1 is TDC.

* . Find TDC for # 1 by hand cranking --look for # 1
lifters to stay motionless , then you`ll see # 6
lifters/pushrods just start to move up a little, look
at dampner and you`ll see the widest groove is very
close to --0--.On the timing tab, Mark that widest
groove with Black, turn clockwise and mark next groove
white, then next groove red. Then make a full 720
rotation to get back to # 1 TDC starting point.

1. Adjust # 1 with dampner at 0 and Black mark
showing.

2. Move black to white ==adjust # 2

3. move white to red=====adjust # 3

4. move red to black=====adjust # 4

5. move black to white ===adjust # 5

6. move white to red=====adjust # 6

Move red back to black and your at TDC for #1 which
was the first one you adjusted *Your Done*


Did it and it work perfect

Unh yeah I will just be doing middle and upper for now. Anyone got pics on how to releive pressure from the fuel rail? And can I clean fuel injectors with something?

With out special pressure gauge with drain hose .place rag arond valve just press down and spray into a 18 ounce plastic peanut jar.. You should NEVER submerge the injectors.you can place the bottom in fuel injector or carb cleaner.it will have a small effect the best way to clean is to send in to a company that specializes in cleaning injectors, the next best way is to pour a can of chevron injector cleaner in to your tank..#3 seafoam and other forum methods . Chevron techron,,,this product is very effective..proven in independent testing...most of the products priced over $3.75 are effective.. you can not clean these your selve there is a company in MICH that has an excellent record.. will look up the name.. to remove=disconect battery,use back up wrench to loosen fuel line..remove bolts and nuts..rotate injector retaining clips.use a lifting gentle side to side rocking motion to pull injectors ..Some fieros will have injectors from grand am 2.8 use small screw driver to lift and pop off spring clip.. unplug electrical connector of course.""label each injector as removed"",,have new o rings and one spare retaining clip, the orings are cheap insurance do not skimp here. best to take your time this can get expensive if you damage injectors.I did not list all parts to remove.. some are obvious,,,do not forget cold injector o ring//Top best superior injector cleaner ,best#1 cruzin performance.com michigan .. the 2nd best injector cleaning service is witch hunter.com in WASH state >> the fiero injectors in the V6 are the BEST..some V6 go over 200,00 miles.. the average injector is worn out at 80,000 to 100,000 miles..If you have them professionally cleaned. you can expect longer service.. the internall parts spings,pintle ,electronics get worn out you can pressure inject clean but nothing works as good as the cleaning service...95% chance your car will be faster after a cruzin performance clean I am interested in any negative reports on these 2 services mentioned

[This message has been edited by uhlanstan (edited 12-16-2007).]

Alright thanks, well I will probably just soak the tips in cleaner for now and port up the middle manifold, eventually I will send them out to get cleaned.

Anyone got pics of how to releive the fuel pressure and how to remove the fuel rail? Your descriptions helped but I wouldn't mind seeing a pic or two.

Bump for the early crowd I am about to go outside and start pulling this thing apart. Uhlanstan you make some pretty informative posts, but if you broke it up with capitalization, punctuation, and spellcheck they would be so much better. + anyways for you and others.

[This message has been edited by Mr.PBody (edited 12-09-2007).]

I don't know how far you are but I have pulled the fuse for the fuel pump and cranked it over, that has worked for me also. You can also use a simple wood dowel on the center pin of the schrader valve with a light tap hammer. (wood won't spark )

If you are pulling the lower intake, use a sharp putty knife to seperate through the head to intake gaskets, it's tough, I know, use a block of wood as a fulcrum and a prybar on either end to pry up. Double check with the manual to make sure you have removed all fasteners, I've missed one before too. There are 4 studs, one on each end of the lower intake manifold, remove those nuts. The lower intake must come straight up off those studs. Some folks have pulled the studs off first, I never had luck with that, PB Blaster is your best friend here.

Since you're working over a period of time, you may want to take some photos along the way, helps when you need to reassemble, at least it helped me, I'm old, helps me remember the sequence of parts.

Good luck.

------------------
jetman
Silver 86 SE 2M6 4-speed, with "check wallet light"

Yeah when I go back to work on it I may pull out the middle of I will just put it on the back burner and deal with it later.

if the car has set for more than 4 hours - you probably have no fuel pressure to worry about.

Well the car has the battery disconnected, the upper plenum removed, as well as the TB. So theres nothing going on in there. I won't see it again for 1-2 weeks, when I go back up there can I just disconnect the two lines at the rail, and the metal line that is on the left that runs to the intake manifold? Also do I need to remove the clips from the fuel injectors to get the rail out? If so whats the best way to go about that, I couldn't get mine off, but I didn't try too hard because the last thing I wanted to do was break it.

I usually leave the injectors on the rail. them clips are a b!tch.
I undo the 2 metal lines - either at the rubber/metal joint, or at the fuel rail iteself - doesnt much matter which.
then, undo the 2 bolts on the fuel rail.
finally - undo the cold start injector.
now, the injectors will likely be stuck.
with a pry bar/hammer handle/wrench, I roll the fuel rail one way, then the other way untill it starts to come up.
maybe some light/thin oil on the injector ends to help loosen them up.

Alright thanks again, +'s all around (my treat) I am headed up to dayton in the next 20 minutes to try to get this thing out. My porting of the upper manifold neck is coming along well. Is there still a market for the Darrell Morse style intake? If mine turns out well I can post pictures of what the all the porting looks like and I could do up some for you guys. I am not working full time right now so a little cash on the side is never bad.

MELON FARMER I just drove an hour up to dayton and forget my freaking Fiero keys!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

A second set of keys(cheap insurance) is one of my pet peeves,especially if car is in a separate location. Just put in glove compartment,Every one hates my writting style,my computer can not spell(really)and it places sentences where it deems best and I do go back and correct.I plan a short post and as I type I often think of something that will assist in the post,my post are waayy to long..and I have a tendency to clip the sentence..adds to my new lengthy red bar..And I often aim at the complete novice.. R C injector engineering(california is also a good source of cleaning not sure if they are still in business,they are expensive but been around a long time ,not sure of thier present reputation... I forget the tools!! Use new o rings,if you can possibly afford it send your injectors to cruzin performance,this is WORTH it..... The wages of sin are high ,but you get your money,s worth

[This message has been edited by uhlanstan (edited 12-17-2007).]

When I lost my original keys and had to pull the ignition tumbler and trunk lock a while back I had 3 new sets made. I later found the original set at my moms house. So I have 4 sets of keys for the 88. After I posted that I left my keys, my grandma handed me a bag of about 200 keys, and in there I found a never used GM door key. My first reaction was BS grandma, you've owned like 30 gm cars, no way the ONE key is for the 88 Fiero... sure enough went outside... click... trunk opened right up. Pwn3d by grandma. So I pulled the middle manifold and brought it home and have been porting. I need to dip the injector tips into some cleaner, they didn't look too good. And BS on not alot of gas being in the rail lol, I ruined a craftsman glove.