we all know the stock coolant pipes are way too small.
Has anyone fabricated a larger diameter system ?
Im thinking 2" copper pipes and elbows etc (the copper pipes will add to the cooling)
or maybe going all out and doing a stainless setup

id love to see pics.

I have been told by a few ppl that an aluminium rad is easier..
but in my mind the stocker is fine... the problem is the plumbing.

please be constructive with your comments

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GT just waiting for the conversion
84 Fiero Turbo Vortec 4300 Phantom GT
L35 block, Syclone Intake and ECM
T31 turbine with T04B S3 compressor
super T61 waiting for next winter
www.cardomain.com/id/vortecfiero
Murphy's Constant Matter will be damaged in direct proportion to its value
Murphy's Law of Thermodynamics Things get worse under pressure.
Arthur C. Clarke "Any significantly advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic"

The only proplem that I can see with using copper is that is is a soft metal, and will bend easily. If you did use copper, you would have to use a very heavy schedule to be able to withstand the abuse it would take from being under the car. Even 2 in schedule K (if I remeber correctly from whenI ran a 2 in water line) can be bent and flared by hand. This is all I can tell you from experiance and working with copper. I think if you want to install a better cooling system, I would get a high performance radiator, and then go ahead and install the larger ID pipes using stainless. Just my 2 cents worth. Hope it helps.

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Hmmmmmmmmm.......now if I can just talk the Army out of an engine, I bet I can get it to fit hehehehehehe >:)

To be honest with you I dont really see a reason to do it. Even if you increase the size of your coolent tubes from ~1 1/4 to 2 inch, all your hoses that go from the radiator and engine are still only ~1 1/4 big. With that being said I dont see where your benifit is coming in. If anything I could see it causing some turbulance in the tubes because you wouldnt have enough output from your hoses to match the supply in the tubes. Ive really never seen a problem with the stock cooling system and if there is its usually because its because of poor maintence.

With all that aside, If I was going to do it I dont think I would do it out of copper. Like thumper said, copper can be very weak and its not like copper is cheap by any means anymore. Especially the wall thickness you would want would be expensive. Copper elbows can also wear holes in them with a lot of flow. I used to work on a building maintence crew and the copper elbows after circulating pumps would end up wearing out and developing pin size holes because of the constant high flow of water hitting against them. I would probobly look into stainless aspect.

Jason

Is there a plastic material that would withstand the high temperatures? If so, it might be cheaper, stonger, and easier to work with.

quote Originally posted by BrewCheese: To be honest with you I dont really see a reason to do it. Even if you increase the size of your coolent tubes from ~1 1/4 to 2 inch, all your hoses that go from the radiator and engine are still only ~1 1/4 big. With that being said I dont see where your benifit is coming in. If anything I could see it causing some turbulance in the tubes because you wouldnt have enough output from your hoses to match the supply in the tubes. Ive really never seen a problem with the stock cooling system and if there is its usually because its because of poor maintence. With all that aside, If I was going to do it I dont think I would do it out of copper. Like thumper said, copper can be very weak and its not like copper is cheap by any means anymore. Especially the wall thickness you would want would be expensive. Copper elbows can also wear holes in them with a lot of flow. I used to work on a building maintence crew and the copper elbows after circulating pumps would end up wearing out and developing pin size holes because of the constant high flow of water hitting against them. I would probobly look into stainless aspect. Jason

i guess i didnt mention that i would go larger on the hoses as well
i have been using 1/2" copper pipe for my oil cooler lines up to the front of the car for 8 years and have had no issues.

You MIGHT be able to use 2" CPVC piping; however it is not rated for continuous duty above 200 F. Looking at the pressure tables I think it may fail in our applications if you heat up over 240 F. A better choice may be aluminum tubing / piping, but I have not been able to find the pressure tables on that yet.

[edit to add] I am referring to schedule 80 industrial CPVC piping.

[This message has been edited by RTNmsds (edited 01-07-2007).]

We had an 86 with a 3.4 pushrod in it, the previous owner had replaced the coolant tubes with Hydraulic hose that was 1 7/8 OD. The tubing was ty wraped were the old tubes ran. The lines worked very well and could stand up to anything that the road could through at them, also they are crush proof. He bought the hose at a local Hydraulic hose shop.

Just more info

Joe Sokol

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85 SE 2.8 - beater coupe-
86 SE 3.4 -in progress 3800 II SC -
88 Formula GT 4.9 5 speed beast
Enough parts outside for another one
-And a 3.4 push rod for sale in the mall Go and look-

quote Originally posted by Fieroking: We had an 86 with a 3.4 pushrod in it, the previous owner had replaced the coolant tubes with Hydraulic hose that was 1 7/8 OD. The tubing was ty wraped were the old tubes ran. The lines worked very well and could stand up to anything that the road could through at them, also they are crush proof. He bought the hose at a local Hydraulic hose shop. Just more info Joe Sokol

A guy from a shop called Midwest Hose who fabricates for the oil pump industry helped me fix my clutch line and he said he could begin fabricating a whole new clutch and thermal system (coolant tubes under car) and a local radiator shop said they could graft a larger diameter set of in/out stems the key is the engine where it comes out is a set volume and size to each motor so he recommended no larger than 2.25" unless it is a v8 with a bigger port from the engines outlet... but he said he'd discuss the cost of the parts with me later.

on a bonus they are flexible and the clutch/trans lines he would be making would be roughly 40$ for a fully flexible line so I couldnt break it like I did the last one(factory) and it would be routeable through wherever I choose to run it.. a direct route

I will be doing the coolant upgrades soon though...

I dont see the tubes as being a hinderance. Its pretty much been proven time and again that the stock Fiero cooling system is capable of cooling about any engine you can throw at it, provided its in good shape. The only issue with the underbody cooant pipes is if they get pinched. They are by no means "way to small". The only issue you might run into is the radiator not being able to disapate the heat. Until you have a massive 4 core radiator, the tubes are not going to be the pinch point in the system. The stock pipes are stainless, and impervious to pretty much anything, but an idiot mechanic with a jack. Replacing them with fragile plastic or rustable steel is only going to cause trouble down the road, and you're not going to see a cooling improvement with a reasonable radiator, and probably not without a special waterpump.

[This message has been edited by 86GT3.4DOHC (edited 01-10-2007).]

When the Rat was at B&B getting screwed up.. Chester had them close off the ends of the underbody X-Brace and put nipples on the end for A/N fittings for the coolant system..





The X-Brace is the only thing that B&B did right.. but then again, B&B didn't make it, they just installed it.

Even if you increase the size of the hoses theres still your thermostat housing and your water pump that only have ~1-1/4 openings. It just seems to me that no matter what you do theres still going to be a "pinch" in the system. Dont get me wrong, I think its a cool idea but I think your just going to spend a lot of time and money and not see any difference what so ever. Think about it like this...if you have a funnel and you poor water in it as fast as you can, no matter how big the top of the funnel is it will only flow what the bottom hole will let it. So no matter how much coolent you can throw through the tubes the ~1-1/4 inlets are still only going to flow what the ~1-1/4 inlets will flow.

Jason

[This message has been edited by BrewCheese (edited 01-11-2007).]

Exactly. You can up-size the pipes all day long, but in order to do it right you need to see what the maximum flow is that the engine block will sustain and match the entire system to that flow. And every component needs to be matched otherwise you just created restrictions and turbulence which are detrimental to flow. It's not a bad idea, just difficult to implement without some fabrication.