Here is the start of my SBC refresh project, I bought the car 4.5 years ago with a pretty standard roller cam 350 SBC, on a dyno back in 2004 it had 201bhp and 290lbft of torque at the rear wheels. So last weekend I started taking it apart, the intent is to get to about 300 bhp at the wheels, with the following parts, Vortec heads, Edelbrock perfformer with a 625cfm Road demon carb (already on the car when dyno'd), comp cams magnum 1.52 roller tip rockers and either a ZZ4 cam or a comp cams 264 or 270 hydraulic roller cam, still not sure about the cam yet. Once I get it back together I will get it dynoed to see the results, provided I can get it back together, first time I have done such a big project. Anyway here are a few pictures showing progress, I am by the way a slow worker, and I am in no great hurry as long as its done by the summer. before I started
------------------ 84SE, aero body, 5 speed and a 350 V8
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06:52 PM
PFF
System Bot
fieroguru Member
Posts: 12590 From: Champaign, IL Registered: Aug 2003
I am sure you are aware of this, but just in case, the Vortec heads need to be machined for the higher lift on the ZZ4 cam and should be converted to screw in rocker studs.
Depending on what you want out the engine, the ZZ4 cam produces good power, idle and hwy fuel ecomony. It is a very good all around cam. I am running a sbc with 10:2 CR, vortec heads, ZZ4 roller and a Ramjet efi unit. It was first installed with a 600 edelbrock.
I look forward to seeing more pics!
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07:15 PM
Feb 7th, 2006
mafv8 Member
Posts: 558 From: Northville, Michigan, USA Registered: Aug 2001
Thanks for the advice Guru, I got the heads off E-Bay, rebuilt to order with uprated springs and screw in studs to match the ZZ4 cam, I have just been investigating other cams to see what alternatives there are. So if anyone has any suggestions, I would appreciate input, I am not really after 'maximum' power but a little lope on the idle would be great. For the exhaust manifolds I am using 2.5 " ram horns modified by Brzezinski Racing, they open up the passages to the 2 outboard cylinders to maximise flow, they are supposed to be the best cast iron manifold out there, they charge almost $500 for a pair, again I got them off E-bay for a lot less, we will see how they perform
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06:13 PM
Alex4mula Member
Posts: 7410 From: Canton, MI US Registered: Dec 1999
Here is a small update, I had a 1/2 day off yesterday and the weather was warm! about 30 degrees The engine stripped down awaiting new parts The growing pile of old parts
------------------ 84SE, aero body, 5 speed and a 350 V8
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07:11 PM
Mar 27th, 2006
mafv8 Member
Posts: 558 From: Northville, Michigan, USA Registered: Aug 2001
Engine almost back together And hopefully this week I will get the correct SPEC clutch with the hub bearing the correct way round, and perhaps get the engine and trans back together, my progress slow but sure, I hope.
------------------ 84SE, aero body, 5 speed and a 350 V8
[This message has been edited by mafv8 (edited 03-27-2006).]
progress continues, I eventuaaly got my SPEC stage 3+ sorted out so I could assemble the engine and trans and finally back in the car, now to connect everything back together and see if it works !
------------------ 84SE, aero body, 5 speed and a 350 V8
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06:55 PM
Fiero2m8 Member
Posts: 1930 From: Niagara, Ontario, Canada Registered: Feb 2006
I'll be watching since I hope to do the same thing to my SBC right after my 3.4-install in my SE.
Was your engine an LM1? It sounds like LM1 numbers.
Would that happen to be a Home Depot furniture dolly your cradle is sitting on?
Cheers!
The engine was from a late 80's Caprice, when I had it dynoed it was internally stock, with the Road Demon on a performer, 2" Rammhorns, and a hotter coil in the HEI. And yes it is a Home Depot dolley, highly recomended, for engine removal and furniture moving
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07:21 PM
Apr 15th, 2006
mafv8 Member
Posts: 558 From: Northville, Michigan, USA Registered: Aug 2001
Today was a big day for me, I completed the final install of my engine project, I still have to replace the heater matrix and add coolant plus a few other things, but I was ready to fire the engine. So with bated breath I primed the carb 3 strokes of the accelerator, and here we go, it fired up pretty much instantly. But boy was it loud!! I have a temp exhaust hooked up using a little muffler from Miejers, sort of works, do not want to upset anyone, once I have had a chance to get it running a bit I will get my Flowmaster hooked up. Here's a picture of the engine, just before it came to life
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05:15 PM
luvin_my_fiero Member
Posts: 437 From: sneads ferry,nc usa Registered: Feb 2005
be careful with just firing it up for a second or two like you say...once you fire it, you need to keep the rpm's around 1800-2000 to let the oil splash up and break the cam in. looks great in there though...and thats a very nice looking notchback!!!
be careful with just firing it up for a second or two like you say...once you fire it, you need to keep the rpm's around 1800-2000 to let the oil splash up and break the cam in. looks great in there though...and thats a very nice looking notchback!!!
I believe you need to do that with a non-roller cam, but as mine is a roller I think it should be fine, I drove the car round the block today just to make sure it all worked prior to driving it to the muffler shop. It is currently real loud with the temp exhaust leaking in a few places, so I could not get any real idea of any performance improvement. Although so far no leaks, either oil or water and the clutch seems to be working OK, real nice engagement (SPEC stage 3+) feels just like the Centerforce I had before. Only problem is the carb now sits about 0.5" higher due to the new manifold, enough to foul the air intake horn on the hood, so I will have to finally fit the mustang scoop I have had for the last 4 years.
------------------ 84SE, aero body, 5 speed and a 350 V8
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07:14 PM
Apr 22nd, 2006
mafv8 Member
Posts: 558 From: Northville, Michigan, USA Registered: Aug 2001
On thursday I took the car down to the local Tuffy for its new exhaust, I had spoken to them prior and they seemed confident they could make up the exhaust for me, I am re-using the Flowmaster and the tips that came with the car. Friday I picked it up, new system all looked pretty good, better than the old system, especially for park brake cable clearance, it does sound good, maybe a bit louder than before but not 100% sure. However there was an issue, the battery was not keeping its charge, so the journey home was a little tense, it would run, but if it stopped I would not be able to re-start. Anyhow I made it ok and found that I had not connected the alternator correctly so now thats sorted, I am still fighting with getting the heater to work properly, but it should not be to difficult to cure.
------------------ 84SE, aero body, 5 speed and a 350 V8
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05:20 PM
Apr 23rd, 2006
mafv8 Member
Posts: 558 From: Northville, Michigan, USA Registered: Aug 2001
A couple more updates, got the heater sorted out blows nice and warm now, coolant temp pretty steady and the rad fan is now working well. I added the angled spacer I got from E-Bay to level out the carb, works great the carb is now dead-level side to side, only problem is the filter is now way through the hood, the Mustang scoop will not cover it, any ideas ?, here are some pictures.
If you're handy with fiberglass, you could increase the depth of the 'stang scoop... otherwise, have you considered a taller scoop (like Tina's Mopar 6-pack style)?
Well the floor was really clean when I started, its now less clean, but hopefully it should clean up well with a little scrubbing. I used some floor expoxy from Home depot, worked great and oil etc wipes up real easy, worth the time and trouble to do.
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07:24 PM
mafv8 Member
Posts: 558 From: Northville, Michigan, USA Registered: Aug 2001
Here is an update on the clearance issue for the air filter, inspiration from Orief, I used a shaker scoop from a Trans-am, and molded it to the decklid, offset the the passenger side, I really like how it turned out, you can still see a few little ripples up close but I acn live with that. Here a couple of pics
------------------ 84SE, aero body, 5 speed and a 350 V8
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05:18 PM
ltlfrari Member
Posts: 5356 From: Wake Forest,NC,USA Registered: Jan 2002
What kind of exhaust do you run on your car. I'm running a bit behind on my V8 swap and have'nt decided on a muffler yet. I was leaning toward the Flowmaster 80 series for the Camaro or possible the Super 40 but I'm concerned about being "too loud". I want it heard that's for sure. but I'm looking for something that is very Deep, Deep, Deep without being obnoxious when Iput my foot in it. I'm leaving the Gear Drive in this engine so although I want the exhaust to be heard over it but I don't want it to be drowned out.
Just curious as to what you are running.
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01:00 AM
mafv8 Member
Posts: 558 From: Northville, Michigan, USA Registered: Aug 2001
What kind of exhaust do you run on your car. I'm running a bit behind on my V8 swap and have'nt decided on a muffler yet. I was leaning toward the Flowmaster 80 series for the Camaro or possible the Super 40 but I'm concerned about being "too loud". I want it heard that's for sure. but I'm looking for something that is very Deep, Deep, Deep without being obnoxious when Iput my foot in it. I'm leaving the Gear Drive in this engine so although I want the exhaust to be heard over it but I don't want it to be drowned out.
Just curious as to what you are running.
I have a Flowmaster, I believe the same as fitted to Camaro's, it depends on your definition of loud, there is no mistake that its a V8 (which is good!), my wife thinks it is too loud, see a pic below of the exhaust, the front pipe is hidden by the car.
That looks like and 80 Series Flowmaster for a F-Body alright.
Lound is fine with me. If I have to, I can use the flowmaster sound reducer cones or a high flow converter if I have to.
Is the sound pretty deep? I know what an 80 series sounds like on a Camro / Firebird but they have quite a bit more exhaust pipe and usually a converter.
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05:30 PM
Mr. Pat Member
Posts: 1860 From: Melbourne, VIC Australia Registered: Apr 2003
What kind of exhaust do you run on your car. I'm running a bit behind on my V8 swap and have'nt decided on a muffler yet. I was leaning toward the Flowmaster 80 series for the Camaro or possible the Super 40 but I'm concerned about being "too loud". I want it heard that's for sure. but I'm looking for something that is very Deep, Deep, Deep without being obnoxious when Iput my foot in it. I'm leaving the Gear Drive in this engine so although I want the exhaust to be heard over it but I don't want it to be drowned out.
Just curious as to what you are running.
On my swap I have a cat and 2 resonated tips. Its very deep and throaty, and at idle it is quieter than my V6 was witht the borla. WOT is a different story though If you go to my hometown webpage in my sig theres a picture of the exhaust setup. Its very simple.
------------------ 1986 GT, LT1/4T60E. In the middle of cam/port, new interior, paint and waiting on new wheels. Itll blow you away!! http://hometown.aol.com/ptfiero/index.html build http://dtcc.cz28.com/Customer/LT1Fiero/index.htm
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06:42 PM
3084me Member
Posts: 1035 From: Bucks County, PA Registered: Apr 2005
I actually ran across your AOL page awhile back. (Nice car and nice swap you have there). My last V8 Swap dyno'ed at 411HP at the wheels and like you mentioned on your page: "Sounded like Satan" at W.O.T.
I'm trying to keep this one a little more "Tame" (around 290-315HP). That's why I'm thinking about actually using a muffler on this one. I'm thinking about going with the flowmaster (don't need a converter but I think I may need one to keep the sound down a little). My last setup was similar to yours with a converter and 2 resonators. Sounder pretty good to 1500 RPM or so but then got pretty obnoxious. W.O.T was Insane. To add another twist, this current motor still has the gear drive installed so I'm sure my passengers will be "happy" with that screaming behind their head....
I'll probably have to experiment a bit.
[This message has been edited by 3084me (edited 07-04-2006).]
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10:58 PM
Jul 5th, 2006
Mr. Pat Member
Posts: 1860 From: Melbourne, VIC Australia Registered: Apr 2003
I actually ran across your AOL page awhile back. (Nice car and nice swap you have there). My last V8 Swap dyno'ed at 411HP at the wheels and like you mentioned on your page: "Sounded like Satan" at W.O.T.
I'm trying to keep this one a little more "Tame" (around 290-315HP). That's why I'm thinking about actually using a muffler on this one. I'm thinking about going with the flowmaster (don't need a converter but I think I may need one to keep the sound down a little). My last setup was similar to yours with a converter and 2 resonators. Sounder pretty good to 1500 RPM or so but then got pretty obnoxious. W.O.T was Insane. To add another twist, this current motor still has the gear drive installed so I'm sure my passengers will be "happy" with that screaming behind their head....
I'll probably have to experiment a bit.
Oh so you had the same setup as me? Is it alot louder with a big cam? Mine was stock and actually very mellow. But im pretty young and like a bit obnoxious now and then!
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05:33 PM
mafv8 Member
Posts: 558 From: Northville, Michigan, USA Registered: Aug 2001
That looks like and 80 Series Flowmaster for a F-Body alright.
Lound is fine with me. If I have to, I can use the flowmaster sound reducer cones or a high flow converter if I have to.
Is the sound pretty deep? I know what an 80 series sounds like on a Camro / Firebird but they have quite a bit more exhaust pipe and usually a converter.
Yes the sound is deep, the new cam also improved the sound, I believe the California Kid has a Flowmaster, he did have a sound file on his sig if you can find it.
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07:04 PM
3084me Member
Posts: 1035 From: Bucks County, PA Registered: Apr 2005
I used to love Lound cars but at 38 years old, I'm a little more "mellow now". My last setup similar to yours was pretty decent sounding but I thought got pretty loud when I got on it. That's why I'm thinking about the 80 Series flowmaster on this one.
mafv8,
Thanks, I'll see if I can track down that sound clip. I think the 80 series may be just what I'm looking for. I may have to experiment a little bit but It's got to be better than what I've had before. I just want a nice very deep sound that stays deep and does'nt get "Raspy and Insane" as I accelerate.
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10:00 PM
California Kid Member
Posts: 9541 From: Metro Detroit Area, Michigan Registered: Jul 2001
I think you should be able to meet that power goal with that combo. Keep us posted.
