quote Originally posted by FastFieros: Now, the advantage to me really in the long run is the 5 speed transmission. I did not realize until very recent the LSJ 2.0 Supercharged engine only came on the MU3 5 speed. The automatic is not on the LSJ engine. If you read alot about where this transmission came from, it is designed for power and heavy loads. Then there is the OEM support behind this transmission. I favor the 4T65eHD because GM is behind this transmission to make it strong and handle power. When I call various race shops to talk about whats in development, its about what GM is supporting in the racing programs. Currently GM is allowing two types of upgrades in the Cobalt SS and Ion redline. Stage 2 is said to be 250HP at the tires. GM is allowing an LSD to be installed. These are things that still carry a factory warrantty. Can you imagine the testing that was done to see when it really breaks to allow upgrades and RPO ordering on these types of items.

now what would us sbc guys be looking at to get one of these trannys on our engines, i know ya havnt really got a chance to look at the tranny but i would be very, very interested in this tranny for my sbc. as i think alot of others would also. thanx and keep up the awsome work! actually, im finding myself interested in this 4 cylinder

I OWN PAGE TWO!!!!

[This message has been edited by hiller21c (edited 10-27-2005).]

quote The EcoTec PCM is not hacked at this time. Meaning fuel management will have to be done like it was with the 3800SC PCM's before HPTuners and Powrtuner came around. There is however a product about to be released in 2 weeks that does replace the OEM PCM and it is user tuneable via laptop. Very reasonable priced.

Can you tell us who is going to be releasing the stand alone PCM for the EcoTec?

quote Originally posted by tampalinc: Can you tell us who is going to be releasing the stand alone PCM for the EcoTec?

Not at this time. The company is working directly with GM Racing. The hardware is actually already in use today. It will be released at SEMA next week if all the agreements are made with GM corporate. The controller is Delphi made. The interface was cracked and a client software package was wrote to interface with the PCM. The wiring harness, controller, and client software are going to be about $1800... Not a bad price for all 3 items in one place. The controller can run 4,6,8 cylinder applications with just software change.

I still think the EcoTec PCM will be cracked. I am working on it now by myself. I have 2 PCM's on the way. I have tried to find information on the P12 PCM, but no luck. I need to know the chip architecture set it is using, the processor, and flash chip. I will have this info once one of the PCM's shows up. I just purchased them Monday. If I am lucky, it will be the HC58 chipset, and the 68332 processor, and the flash chip being the 28F400.. If it is, I can flash the PCM. HP Tuners will be back to hacking on PCM's and the 2.2L rated higher in demand than the 2.0L SC.. So, I guess they will do the 2.0L sometime next year.

SEMA has all the big players flying out there for the next couple weeks. No one wants to talk this week I have found. I will be glad when SEMA is over and all the anounancements have been made. GM is suppose to release those upgrades for the Ion and Cobalt. Those are called Stage 1 and Stage 2 for the dealers to install. Takes a stock 2.0L to 250HP at the tires for Stage 2. Both stages get a PCM flash. I will be getting those updates for the SPS software once it is released. Then I can compare the stock files to those upgraded flash files and find the RPM tables. I want to turn at least 8000RPM, and I have read that Stage 2 only bumps the RPMs to 7000 - 7200 shift points.

Its nice engine, I cant wait to play with one.

Loyde

quote Originally posted by Jncomutt: I'd prefer a Stronger 5speed over the 'socal cooness' of the 6th gear anyday. LMK when that adapter is ready for the 5speed

agreeed, plus one with taller 1st and 2nd gears, so we arent spinning in place all day long..

Loyde - Can you get information from the Isuzu MK7 found in cavalier/sunfire 96 2.2???

I manage to get one of them to my +96 DOHC. So far I can say it hold like a damn bull. My engine is moded, not sure how much hp or tq is doing. Besides I dont lunch @ 7k rpms, Basically 3k to 4k to avoid wheel spin.

So far these is waht i can tell

80lbs
2nd gear use 3 shyncros instead of 2 like in the Fiero
Instead of gear propelled speedometer it use magnetic
When I rotate the shaft where the clutch engage it feels like half of the force I have to do use over the Fiero Isuzu(i have one as spare).

I can say that the acceleration is awesome.

I just OWNED Grand Natinal with a mean V8(you know, pratapaa pratapaa paa hot rod V8) LOL. I was scared to be blown by him but was all Fiero ownage. I did it twice, wining both of them. Beside I have raced 4cl turbos and they really dont look that fast. I can pull as much as 3 or 4 cars to them in sec gear, at least the civics turbo. I raced a DSM 2nd gen spyder, I manage to pull like 3 cars or more. Cant be sure was dark and going over 120mph.

I want to know more info of these transmission. I really like it, could use a better 3rd and 4rth gear for race but are not bad ether.

Thanks

Dre

grand national is a V6, its a bad ass V6 for sure kinnda sounds V8ish though, or did you actually see it was a V8

Dre, that's some nice ownage. Nice job representing.

Loyde, sorry if I've missed something around PFF, maybe there's another thread, but is there anything new on this tranny project? How's it going with the Ecotec computers?

Nothing new really...

I own 2 EcoTec 2.0L supercharged engines. 2k miles, and 8k miles.

I own 3 MU3 (F35) GETRAG 5 speeds. (2) have ZERO miles, 2k on the other.

I have everything worked out but 1 small issue, and one large issue...

Small issue is the shifter and cables. The big issue is the PCM cannot be hacked at this time. I hate this. If I am going to spend my time installing an engine from one car to another, it is not a perfect world usually, and you need to be able to tune it. HP Tuners saids someday, and I have to buy 2.x hardware. DHP saids in weeks, but that is a wait and see....

I would rather spend my time installing an LS1 to the F35 and getting this part worked out. I cant even do that however because I have 4 3800SC installs to do at this time.

Loyde

For me, wide ratio strong 5spds.

------------------
85GT 5spd ,93 Eldorado 4.9 Dual O2 Custom Chip, Archie Clutch. Custom Exhaust. MSD Everything 245/50/16's Cant wait for Dyno Time and Track Results. Not Your Average 4.9 Capt Fiero Com --- My Over View Cadero Pics Delta Cam and Allante Intake Soon.

oops

[This message has been edited by Boosted2003 (edited 05-05-2006).]

quote Originally posted by Boosted2003: Hey loyde. I talked to few days ago. May 1st or so about the 3.8l. Since the saab 4 cylinder tranny works. I wonder if the saabs v6 manual tranny will work in the fiero with out an adaper plate. Hell why not swap in a complete 2.8l V6 turbo motor from a saab 9-3 sport sedan. 250hp stock and 258 ftlbs of torque. Or get the 9-5 aero motor with 2.3l engine with 260hp stock and 5 speed tranny.

the 2.8 DOHC turbo engine is to be the new global engine. I dont think finding one of those cheap is going to happen in the next 3-4 months. However, rumor is that is will be the M6 pattern (same as Fiero and 3800sc ).

Saab uses the EcoTec 7 degree pattern. I am not 100% sure it is really called 7 degree, but everyone at GM I had talked to 5 months ago called it that.

Loyde

Time to start looking for totaled (rear ended) saabs turbos. HEHEH from about 2001+

This is the new 2.8 DOHC engine. It is an 06 release.



Link to its specs.. http://media.gm.com/us/powertrain/en/product_services/Spec%20Sheets/HFV6/2006%20HFV6%20(LP9).pdf

See, it is getting the F40 which we know is the M6 pattern.. So, this 2.8 DOHC will be M6...

Loyde

Keep us posted on the eco swap (Like we already know you will...)

I am growing rather fond of those motors myself, even though they replaced the Quad 4.

If (when) my 2.8 gives up the ghost, I have a feeling I'll be giving you a call.

If i could choose what ratio transaxle i could put in my fiero it would be a 4 speed transmission, (with all those low end torque motors who needs a bunch of gears!!!!

first gear would be 3.00
second would be 1.70
third would be 1.10
and 4th would be 0.66

if i could choose a ratio set thats what i would go with, Not sure what that would make the final drive of the transaxle, but with a 3800 v6, or 3800 supercharged engine, 4.9L or northstar v8 and all SBC motors they have enough torque to be able to drive those gears longer and harder and if you have a fairly flat torque curve or steady curve, you should be able to keep it into a powerband, shifting from 5000-6000 RPM going up a gear and hitting 2500 RPM-3000RPM

it would be excellent cruising also, probably want something around 1700-1800 RPM at 70MPH in 4th

matthew

Obviously new here but my love of cars goes far beyond 20posts as does my love of fieros. I was wondering first if there is anywhere to get more info about the possibility and speedbumps on the road to the ecotec swap.

Very few swap options have ever struck my fancy. I'm not a V-8 kind of guy. Lets face it, everyone has their "thing". I LOVE the feel of 300hp from a 4cyl with forced induction. My "other" car is an Iroc R/T daytona, anyone that knows it probably knows #1 it had 224hp stock and #2 it's far from reliable. Mostly because of the lack of production (hard to find good replacement parts when something tears up). With the craze behind the ecotec it's unlikely it will fall out of glory for a while, giving a ton of aftermarket parts (mostly overpriced rice, but a fan base is a fan base and allows for good products to be sold also).

The idea of a 4cyl with 300hp, reliable, easy to find parts for, and easy to upgrade (i do my own work as 99.9% of you all do) would definately make me question if i wanna build up my newly purchased fiero's engine much or wait for it to crap out.

BTW, you are all fired for giving me one heck of a good reason to procrastinate studying for my drug chem final tomorrow.


Now a couple questions...I've tried to use this board's search but honestly it hates it, gives me errors or freezes almost every time i use it

#1, how much friggin wiring would be involved? This is my #1 concern, wiring a carb'd v-8 is fun, 8,000 sensors and constant fault code fighting is not. Obviously this is something you'd have to approach, but are you looking at climbing a hill, or trying to jump over the alps?

#2, have we seen any reports to say how reliable this engine is past 100k? I can pick about any engine and google to find reports of crazy high mileage, but i don't care about being able to hit 300k, i'd rather know i'm going to hit 150k and not have any problems.

#3, Will i be able to work on the engine? With the SC on the back(ooops, front?) Is it going to give arm room to get around to ...well anything. This question is vague but hidden 02 sensors or stuff like that can be a problem (and a reason to go with a differnet engine IMO)

-edit- for sc placement

[This message has been edited by Vladd (edited 05-05-2006).]

quote Originally posted by Vladd: Obviously new here but my love of cars goes far beyond 20posts as does my love of fieros. I was wondering first if there is anywhere to get more info about the possibility and speedbumps on the road to the ecotec swap. Very few swap options have ever struck my fancy. I'm not a V-8 kind of guy. Lets face it, everyone has their "thing". I LOVE the feel of 300hp from a 4cyl with forced induction. My "other" car is an Iroc R/T daytona, anyone that knows it probably knows #1 it had 224hp stock and #2 it's far from reliable. Mostly because of the lack of production (hard to find good replacement parts when something tears up). With the craze behind the ecotec it's unlikely it will fall out of glory for a while, giving a ton of aftermarket parts (mostly overpriced rice, but a fan base is a fan base and allows for good products to be sold also). The idea of a 4cyl with 300hp, reliable, easy to find parts for, and easy to upgrade (i do my own work as 99.9% of you all do) would definately make me question if i wanna build up my newly purchased fiero's engine much or wait for it to crap out. BTW, you are all fired for giving me one heck of a good reason to procrastinate studying for my drug chem final tomorrow. Now a couple questions...I've tried to use this board's search but honestly it hates it, gives me errors or freezes almost every time i use it #1, how much friggin wiring would be involved? This is my #1 concern, wiring a carb'd v-8 is fun, 8,000 sensors and constant fault code fighting is not. Obviously this is something you'd have to approach, but are you looking at climbing a hill, or trying to jump over the alps? #2, have we seen any reports to say how reliable this engine is past 100k? I can pick about any engine and google to find reports of crazy high mileage, but i don't care about being able to hit 300k, i'd rather know i'm going to hit 150k and not have any problems. #3, Will i be able to work on the engine? With the SC on the back(ooops, front?) Is it going to give arm room to get around to ...well anything. This question is vague but hidden 02 sensors or stuff like that can be a problem (and a reason to go with a differnet engine IMO) -edit- for sc placement

Number 1 - Its easy for me is about all I can say. I cannot offer a wiring harness at this time until I have configured at least one my self for me, or someones project in house.

Number 2 - The engine comes from the Saab. It has been tested in racing from at least 98-02. It is used in at least 4 drag race teams that make over 900HP. I would say the engine is the typicial at minumium of GM type stuff and will last 150k no problem. Heck there are 2.5 Fieros with 200k on them.

Number 3 - From my measurements, the engine fits great, easy to work. The oil filter is not in a great place, but there are tools to get this out. Right tool for the right job makes life easier.

I own a wrecked 2005 Cobalt SS. It only has 1651 miles. Then I have one engine with 8k miles. I have 3 brand new transmissions. I will get to this project one of these days.

Loyde

I'm sold. I'll be watching, reading and researching this topic for awhile. Good work!

My electrical quesiton wasn't so much aimed at a wiring harness adapter as it was the full integration of the systems when it's done. Of course thats more of a future quesiton since there's not one together. :-D most of those problems aren't realized until they occur i suppose.


I will definately be waiting for any kind of updates though, seems like a great idea, wish i had the resources and intelligence to tackle such a job.

bump for a new month

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Low Original Miles at 35,875!!!
19x8.5(f) and 19x9.5(r) Drifz 520b's
235/35 & 245/35 Nitto NT555s
Otherwise stock for now ;)

Bump for curiosity.

Bryce

Nothing?