Hey everyone, I've been working on this Archie V8 swap for a long time now and we finally got to test fit the motor today. Bolts for the cradle went right in no problem. Alternator has plenty of clearance with the belt and tensioned. No problems there. Looking at the balancer/pulley and its touching the frame rail. We'll need to notch it a little bit. Now to the electric waterpump. We've got a CSR water pump because this is the one you use because you won't need to cut anything and in extreme cases you might have to dent the inner fender sheet metal but no big deal right? WRONG!!! We are INCHES off. There is no way it is fitting. From the port on the motor nearest the shock tower we have about 2" and the minimum we need for that 'leg' of the water pump is 3 3/4". The center of the waterpump needs a good 4 1/2" of clearance we might have 3" if we're lucky off the front of the motor. What are we missing? We chose this waterpump (and paid good money) because it would require little to no 'hacking' of the stock sheetmetal. Our motor has the sheetmetal timing cover and the balancer/pulley couldn't get any tighter on the crank without touching the cover. Anyone have any measurements for a V8 car that could help us in figuring out that our motor is where it should be or our frame rails aren't way out of whack or something? We did all the adjustments to the tranny mounts and measured from the crankshaft to the front cradle mount hole those are all good. But is there some way we can check it? What happened to the "no modification" on the water pump? I hope someone can help us out with this. I'll post a picture, it isn't very good but you might be able to see what I mean. Thanks everyone...sorry for the ranting...

-Tim

can you get a pic from the under side of the Kmember.
i want to see where your tranny mount studs come through at to compair to mine.

and i want to see a pic of where the tranny case and the body almost touch from the top and kinda level from the back.

i'm suspecting that you can go a lot farther to the left.

Alright I think I got what you wanted but it also gave me a different perspective on it. The tranny mount holes in the frame are slotted about 1/2" just like archie says and they are using all of that slot. The tranny case is a finger width away from the frame rail so the most I could gain to the drivers side would be 5/8" to 3/4" which might allow us not to notch the frame for the balancer but that waterpump isn't working no matter what. Where did all this talk come from of the electric's fitting with no problem? Obviously they don't! Is there anything else that would help buddycraigg? I appreciate the help from anyone else as well. You now have a plus from me. Thanks again.

-Tim

I have always heard that you DID have to cut some sheetmetal in order to run an electric waterpump unless it was remote mounted.

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give me a sec to rotate the pics a bit so i can get my bearings.

I dont see how you are going to use that pump and not cut a little of the sheet metal out. My pump motor sticks about 2 inches into the wheel well but its not the same brand.
I also notched the frame rail so I could change the belt without dropping the motor

I did expect to cut or dent some metal. I thought it would be the inner fender stuff in front of the shock tower. Not the shock tower itself. I'm not touching the shock tower. That is structural on a uni-body car and it isn't acceptable to me to even dent it, let alone cut a hole in it. I've decided to go remote with it and put the pump where the battery used to be. I've started another thread about this very issue but any more help on the other clearance issues are greatly appreciated. Thanks folks!

-Tim

i can tell that the tranny is not an 84, the slave is not an 84, what about the body?

Sorry, I guess I forgot to mention. Its a 86 SE with all stock components until I got my hands on it for all I know. I've searched a little harder for V8 threads and they look about the same as mine with the water pump and balancer issue. I guess I just underestimated the clearance issues in these places. Oh well, too late to turn back now. Remote water pump here I come. Anything else buddycraigg?

-Tim

quote Originally posted by Jefrysuko: I have always heard that you DID have to cut some sheetmetal in order to run an electric waterpump unless it was remote mounted.

Same here.
I have not read anywhere that the electric water pumps would fit, with out cutting the metal. The only way to avoid this, is the remote method, as you already said you are going to do.

Kevin

I asked about the year of the body.
I seem to recall that archie said that the later years had a “dimple” in the body frame for the hump in the transmission.
I’m pretty sure I’ve verified this looking at different cars out at www.thefierofarm.com but cant say 100% yes cause i cant remember.

On my setup, 84 body.
I’ve had an 84 4speed,
86 isuzu
and now an 85 4speed.

Everything is pushed over to the left so far that the transmission will rub on the body. Right about where a brake line is.

One thing that you will not have to fight is the bolts that hold the waterpump drive system on the HMB.
Until I put in the poly Kmember bushings these bolts would grind against the body frame under hard acceleration.

I say drop it back out again and make your slots longer.

One question.
You did drill the new hole in the tranny bracket? The one that goes between the rubber mount and the tranny case.

Thanks everyone for the input, especially you buddycraigg. Yeah its an 86 and I know what you mean about the dimple in the frame at the end of the transmission. But, there is only about 5/8" gap there and I don't want anything rubbing so I think I'll leave the motor where it is and notch the frame for the balancer and run the remote pump. Yes I did drill out the hole and move the mount over. I'm running solid mounts in the rear but the adjustment still applies. I think I've figured out my situation but I need to get my remote WP all setup before I move forward. Too bad too, I thought I was really close. Oh well, thats why we call them projects. Thanks everyone!

-Tim

I had my motor in three times before it fit. I used archies remote waterpump assembly. It went in fairly well. I did have problems getting clearance to the frame rail. I finally have about 3/16" between the bolts on the pumpdrive and the frame rail. It took elongating the trans. mount holes a little beyond his half inch measurement. But when all said and done, my engine does not sit quite straight in the engine bay. I am taking the motor out one more time to fix a slight oil leak in the timing cover seal and then I will put in solid trans. mounts and try to get the motor aligned better in relation to the trunk bulkhead. Don't give up, it will go with a little more fiddling. I had never done any engine swap before, so it can be done.

I had to cut a notch for the harmonic balancer to clear and used the hole that was already cut for the old shaft on the original belt driven pump to gain clearance for the end of the CSR. I drilled access holes because its a bit-- to get the pump out without them when the engine is in the car. Not sure if I could have beat a dent in the fender liner to gain enough clearance for the CSR.

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Tom Corey
Melbourne, FL
87 Green T-Top GT 5Spd SBC ZZ3 V8

[This message has been edited by Tom Corey (edited 11-21-2005).]

The only e-pump setup that I have seen that requires no cutting at all is this one but for non Archie kits and pre 88 cars. I'm using it but remotely mounted.

It goes upside down as shown here. With the smaller balancer it fits ok and the outlet is in the right position.

This is where I mounted mine remotely as I needed the battery tray area for my TPI intake.

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Palm Beach Fieros
http://pbfieros.tripod.com