I've heard of people using the SBC rockers, but you have to change out the studs. The required studs are metric on one end to fit the head, and SAE on the other end, to fit the SBC locknuts. Kind of a PITA.
I put Comp Cams 1.6 rockers on mine. They are roller tipped, but still use a pivot ball. Loyde's price is good. I paid ~$160 for mine, new. The part # is 1414-12, IIRC.
If you want full roller rockers, they can be had from Crane, but they're kinda spendy.
------------------ Raydar 88 3.4 coupe........... Coming soon... 88 Formula, presently under the knife. Read Nealz Nuze!
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11:35 PM
$Rich$ Member
Posts: 14575 From: Sioux Falls SD Registered: Dec 2002
haha.. I was hopin you took that as a joke, and not a burn at what you were askin.. Good to see there are some light-hearted people around this place still...
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11:41 PM
$Rich$ Member
Posts: 14575 From: Sioux Falls SD Registered: Dec 2002
Raydar is right. I hear it is a PITA. I got the full roller one from crane cams. I got them from JEGS part #027025759-12 . I paid 382.99 + shipping. Kinda alot of $$$$ but you can't take it with you, LOL
I have roller pivot rockers from the late model aluminum head V6 installed on cast iron heads. I had to grind the two tabs away on the base that they ride on before installing them. They fit in place of the studs. I'm not exactly sure what length pushrod you will be able to retrofit on the hydraulic cam. I have the cast iron heads on a roller cam block and if I remember correctly I used either the short or long push rods from the late model roller V6, which runs different lengths between the exhaust and intake valve, It is also possible that I used the push rods from a roller V8 which also differ in length from the standard V8 length due to the roller cam. I have been running the rockers for about 2.5 years now without a problem. The rod length is more crucial here because they are non adjustable since they screw into the OE stud hole in the cast iron head as an assembly. It is also possible I used washers as shims to help with proper adjustment. It wasn't very difficult, I just made sure I had a little preload with a plunging effect after they were tightened down. I also used the variable rate springs with the cast iron style retainers to make them work. DO NOT USE these SPRINGS with a hydraulic non roller cam, the added pressure will ruin the cam. So far the setup has worked wonderful behind the turbo 3.1 with the dished piston found in the aluminum head engine. I will be away from home for a few more months and do not have access to the pictures.
I have roller pivot rockers from the late model aluminum head V6 installed on cast iron heads. I had to grind the two tabs away on the base that they ride on before installing them. They fit in place of the studs. I'm not exactly sure what length pushrod you will be able to retrofit on the hydraulic cam. I have the cast iron heads on a roller cam block and if I remember correctly I used either the short or long push rods from the late model roller V6, which runs different lengths between the exhaust and intake valve, It is also possible that I used the push rods from a roller V8 which also differ in length from the standard V8 length due to the roller cam. I have been running the rockers for about 2.5 years now without a problem. The rod length is more crucial here because they are non adjustable since they screw into the OE stud hole in the cast iron head as an assembly. It is also possible I used washers as shims to help with proper adjustment. It wasn't very difficult, I just made sure I had a little preload with a plunging effect after they were tightened down. I also used the variable rate springs with the cast iron style retainers to make them work. DO NOT USE these SPRINGS with a hydraulic non roller cam, the added pressure will ruin the cam. So far the setup has worked wonderful behind the turbo 3.1 with the dished piston found in the aluminum head engine. I will be away from home for a few more months and do not have access to the pictures.
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10:02 AM
PFF
System Bot
Oreif Member
Posts: 16460 From: Schaumburg, IL Registered: Jan 2000
I've heard of people using the SBC rockers, but you have to change out the studs. The required studs are metric on one end to fit the head, and SAE on the other end, to fit the SBC locknuts. Kind of a PITA.
I put Comp Cams 1.6 rockers on mine. They are roller tipped, but still use a pivot ball. Loyde's price is good. I paid ~$160 for mine, new. The part # is 1414-12, IIRC.
If you want full roller rockers, they can be had from Crane, but they're kinda spendy.
This is correct. The SBC rockers are SAE size (I think it's 7/16" or 3/8") and the 60* V-6's use a 10mm stud. So to go to roller tipped rockers (1.52 or 1.6) You can use the Comp Cams rockers. If you want true full rollers or to use SBC rockers you already might have, then it's the Crane Cams with the metric/SAE studs.
As for springs, Going from 1.5 rockers to 1.6 rockers changes the cam spec from .394/.410 to .420/.437, The stock springs are good for around .420-.425 lift, They are rumored to bind with lifts over that. Not sure if anyone has added rockers and not changed springs or what the results were.
I've heard of people using the SBC rockers, but you have to change out the studs. The required studs are metric on one end to fit the head, and SAE on the other end, to fit the SBC locknuts. Kind of a PITA.
its no pita at all.. its not like the ball nuts are attached to the rockers.. I used 1.7:1 sbc rocker arms with the stock fiero ball nuts on my 3.4 pushrod.. using stock springs with no binding.. I've heard that it was the same cam as the fiero and that it was less than the fiero don't know which is true.
[This message has been edited by Kohburn (edited 03-16-2005).]
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10:13 AM
Raydar Member
Posts: 41168 From: Carrollton GA. Out in the... country. Registered: Oct 1999
Originally posted by Kohburn: its no pita at all.. its not like the ball nuts are attached to the rockers.. I used 1.7:1 sbc rocker arms with the stock fiero ball nuts on my 3.4 pushrod..
By PITA, I meant changing the studs, just to change rockers. Regarding mixing rockers and ball nuts, I always thought they were manufactured to fairly exacting (matching) specs. I'm not terribly surprised that other ball nuts can be used. I am surprised that SBC rockers (SAE) work with Fiero (metric) ball nuts. Only because it seems like they would be machined (or cast or stamped) using a different set of parameters. Ya' learn something every day.
quote
...using stock springs with no binding.. I've heard that it was the same cam as the fiero and that it was less than the fiero don't know which is true.
After quite a few hours of research, I discovered that the 3.4 Camaro cam is identical to the Fiero cam with the exception of a tab behind the front bearing that triggers the cam position sensor (required by the DIS). The part # is 10166324 if anyone wants to research it further.
I installed 1.6 rockers on my 3.4 with no trouble whatsoever. Still have the stock 3.4 springs.
the rollor rocker swap is a huge pita, grinding is required, ive done this, youl need parts from sevral different vehicles, hey try to beat 15$ for this fully rollor rocker swap, me and my best friend did this, we didnt finish, but we went far enough to see if it would work or not, and it did beautifully, i may have pics il have to look.
OR you could save 140$ and do it my way, but its ur call, id recomend doing it the right way, but my way works just as well when your hard on cash, which if you own a fiero.....im broke too so dont feel bad
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08:26 PM
FastFieros Member
Posts: 2698 From: Dallas Texas USA Registered: Nov 2000
As for springs, Going from 1.5 rockers to 1.6 rockers changes the cam spec from .394/.410 to .420/.437, The stock springs are good for around .420-.425 lift, They are rumored to bind with lifts over that. Not sure if anyone has added rockers and not changed springs or what the results were.
The lift figures that Oreif quoted for 1.6 rockers with the Fiero cam are the same as I've seen elsewhere (and calculated myself.) The Camaro cam specs out the same as the Fiero cam. If the Fiero engine uses the same springs as the Camaro engine (which would make sense), there shouldn't be any issues. In any event, I installed 1.6 rockers on my Camaro engine without any 'spring' issues.
I'm sure others can expand on this. That's the best I can do.
Realistically, .420/.437 is doesn't seem to be a great deal of lift. It's not even as much as the cam that comes in the 3.4 crate motor (.427/.454.) If that counts for anything. Maybe not.
[This message has been edited by Raydar (edited 03-17-2005).]
Thats pushing it as far as lift on a stock engine. Lots of lift means you have to start worrying about the springs not being stiff enough (solution: stiffer valve springs) and with enough lift, you run the risk of hitting the piston, in which case you'll need to get your pistons dished so they clear the valves.
I don't know for sure if the amount of lift you're talking about qualifies, but I'm sure its getting close.
I'm not sure if they are worth the effort if you're not running a turbo, N.O. or one our intakes you not going to see really high rpms (with good HP) where they would be more useful. Now I could be all wet on this one and will stand corrected if someones cares to address my point.
