Here's one where I'm kicking myself in the ass. I should have done something about it when I was having problems getting the door to close. ( Had to pull the door handle a few times to get the latch to operate.)

Now, It won't open. I have the inner door pannel off ( which was a pain in the ass.) I still can't get the door to open. Is there any way to remove the outer skin of the door while it's closed without breaking anything?

Any advice that doesn't involve a sledge hammer or crowbar?

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Assuming no malfunction or damage other than the handle mechanism is broken/disconnected....

If you've got the inner panel off, crank your window up. Try reaching into the hole above the support bar that is riveted in above the plate the armrest screws into. Feel around until you find the vertical rod that is (was?) connected to the door handle and to the lever in the latch mechanism. Follow it down to the mechanism. When you can feel the lever piece (where the rod is connected), push down. It should move and actuate the latch mechanism, allowing you to push the door open.

Let me know how this works for you.

-fh

I'm thinking pictures would help here.

I'm gonna see if i can get a good shot of what you are talking about. The linkage is attached for the inside handle. I have tried pulling the inside handle and then forcing things to keep moving in the direction it pulls them to no avail. The outer door handle moves a rod vertically (downward movement) this rod has a lip on it, and a spring. there seems to be a piece missing. The rod is not attached to anything, but will hit a tab with a hole in it with it's lip. I have tried pushing that tab down with one of the headlight door spring rods that i removed because i don't like rebuilding headlights, and a single spring hold the door about the same as two.

Picture soon.

If you push down on that tab with the hole in it and the door doesn't unlatch, the mechanism is either broken or in locked condition.

JazzMan

Yeah, that's going to be a tough one alright. Man, I wish I had some ideas that would minimize damage. I've got an '84 dismantled at the shop but I won't be able to get there until later this week. I'll look at the latch (I've already removed it from the door) and see if I can come up with a procedure or idea for you.

JazzMan

bump

While waiting for JazzMan to dissect his latch , here's a last-resort option.

An assistant with small hands, a Dremel or RotoZip with a flex-shaft attachment, and a few cutting bits or discs. If the latch truly is FUBAR, you're not going to lose anything by slicing little pieces out of it until it lets go of the striker bolt. At least then you'll be able to unbolt the old latch & replace it after you get the door open.

good luck!

Looks like it is sticking in a downward position. Try this Pull up hard on that TAB then push it down. If it gets stuck like that the Sping on the door handle will compress and not pull it back up fiddling with the door handle probibly made it pop back up so now that the rod is off you may need to pull it back up then press it down to open the door. It's probibly worn to the point that it may be sliding past the latch release on the inside so you may have to push at different angles to get it to catch it and release it.

I took some pics last night, just now posting (first time using PIP), here goes:

Edit: oops, pics out of order, first and last show lever/tab with the latch not pulled and pulled, respectively.

[This message has been edited by fierohobby (edited 07-14-2004).]

Seems my latch is really fubar. Possibly if I can get that lever back onto the post with the spring it will be lined up properly. It looks to me like that lever is hitting the one that locks the door, and basically locking the door every time i pull the handle. Pulled out and onto the post, it should pass over the other lever. When it wasn't closing properly it was probably catching on the top side of the lock linkage.

Very good camera work there by the way. Thanks. (=

[This message has been edited by Azriel (edited 07-14-2004).]

You're welcome. Ain't much to it if the door is already disassembled (and will open!).

-fh

Ok, I disected a latch tonight, very interesting how they engineered that to work, simple and yet complicated at the same time.

Pictures to follow, maybe tomorrow night, though I'll try tonight, it's 11pm my time.

JazzMan

Ok, sorry for the delay, was not able to get home until 1 this morning. So sleepy.....

Now for some pics:

In this picture looking down at the top of the passenger side latch assembly (the driver's side is a mirror image of this) you'll see a bellcrank outlined in yellow with two rods attached. This is your lock actuator. The two rods to to the key cylinder and the inside lock slider. When the car is locked and unlocked this bellcrank rotates. See the notch at the top? More on that in a moment.

Here's another view of the bellcrank from below. You can see the notch and the part that fits into the notch and gets rotated as a result:

In this picture I've separated the mechanism. This is not something you can do on the car as it requires grinding rivets that are up against the door skin struture. The left half of the mechanism shown in this picture goes against the door, the right piece folds over on top of the left piece. You can see the rotating piece that is actuated by the bellcrank, it in turn slides part A back and forth. Part B stacks on top of part A, and the upturned tab at the right end of part A fits into the square slot of part B. Sounds like the stereotypical children's toy assembly instructions, eh? Anyway, part B is the part that you push on to release the door latch.

Here's another view:

Now on to how the lock works. Part A has a point that sticks out to the right past the tab. That point moves back and forth as part A moves back and forth, they're one piece. When part A is moved to the right it engages a tab that stick up from the actual latch, as shown in this picture:

As you can see, pushing down on the left end of the latch release lever, part B in picture four above, the right end of the lever rotates up, that in turn pulls up on the right end of part A, which in turn pulls up on the latch itself, releasing the latch and allowing the door to open.

Here's how it locks. When you lock the car the bellcrank rotates the part that makes part A move to the left. When it does the end of part A no longer engages the latch tab. The tab in part A still sits in the slot in the latch release lever, part B, and part A still moves up and down, but since it's not engaged to the latch it does nothing.

to be continued...

[This message has been edited by JazzMan (edited 07-17-2004).]

Nice work, Jazzman. That's a lot of effort, and some great info/photos provided, for something so mundane. But I guess it's just like anything else- you don't need it 'til you need it, and when you need it, you need it bad.

-fh

It's still not open, taking jazzman's Pics a dremel and a few assorted prybarz to the shop. Will let you know what happens.

thanks (=

If you got the inner door panel off with the door closed, and without damage, my hat's off to you! At this point you should be able to unscrew the door latch post (that's not the right name for it - can't remember what it's really called) and the door will open without messing with the latch mechanism. I believe it takes a Torx 45 or 55.

Alternatively you can take off the fender in front ot the door, then remove the bolts for the door hinges and have a helper swing the front of the door outward while you unscrrew the door latch post with ease. I had to do it this way when some jerk crunched my door in a parking lot and jammed the mechanism.

Paul McKibben
Norcross, GA

quote Originally posted by paulmckibben: If you got the inner door panel off with the door closed, and without damage, my hat's off to you! At this point you should be able to unscrew the door latch post (that's not the right name for it - can't remember what it's really called) and the door will open without messing with the latch mechanism. I believe it takes a Torx 45 or 55. Alternatively you can take off the fender in front ot the door, then remove the bolts for the door hinges and have a helper swing the front of the door outward while you unscrrew the door latch post with ease. I had to do it this way when some jerk crunched my door in a parking lot and jammed the mechanism. Paul McKibben Norcross, GA

The latch mechanism captures the head of the stud. Are you saying to have the hinges unbolted and then unscrew the stud?

I'll try it tomorrow. My latch is so screwed that nothing is working so far.

Hey Jazz... plz PM me a price on that mechanism. I wants it.

Hey Jazzman - got any more of those door latches laying around? I could use a driver's side latch that isn't worn out around the latch pin opening...

That's the only one I've got right now. However, most of the banging is due to a compressed rubber block in the latch rather than a worn latch groove itself.

The job of that rubber bumper is to hold the head of the latch pin up against the sloped metal plate above. When that rubber bushing gets hard and compresses it removes the tension needed to keep it from bouncing up and down, thus making the doors rattle or bang when going over bumps with the windows down. Replacing the bumper isn't really practical because it requires both a source of new bumpers and the means to reweld all the rivets that have to be ground off to get the latch apart for access to the bumper. If you have access to free/cheap welding, it might be possible to weld a 1/8" shim under the rubber bushing to close up the gap between the bushing and the top place, and I may do that to mine eventually.

JazzMan

Replacement bumpers MAY be available; GM used that type of latch extensively - and may still do so. If I recall correctly, the bumper has a couple of mounting "prongs" that press fit into the housing to mount it, so it should be possible to change it without disassembling the latch.