I have read alot about how other cars (modified or not) can out handle a Fiero (modified or not). I know the 88 gt's are supposed to have the best suspension of any Fiero. Lets just say I wanted to build a 88 Fiero to out handle most anything out there with in reason (no full blown race cars) How would I do it? I know to use poly bushings and good tires. What else can you do? What is/are the down falls with the type of suspension the car has on it now? Would moving the battery to the front help? There must be a reason another car can out handle it. Do coil overs help? If so what kind. The reason I'm asking these questions is because so many people talk about there cars handle like there on rails, mine does too by the way, and I have driven some of these other cars that are said to handle WAY better and I'm sorry but I was not very impressed. I'm not trying to start a flame war or anything, I just want to know HOW CAN I MAKE MY CAR HANDLE as good as say....a slightly modified Mazda Miata or something similar without making it unlivable on the street? I bet there are others that would like to know too.

Take some "driver's education" classes at a track near you. This just came up in the general thread, and I suggested the same thing. I've seen all kinds of cars handle better than others because of the driver. Examples. I went to an autocross where a guy who normally drives a Pantera, had to use his stock rental (about a '95 some years ago) Thunderbird (!) because his Pantera was broken. Stock Thunderbird. Not supercharged, SC or anything. Did really well! Repeating my comment on the other thread, I kept up with a Viper on a turn at a racetrack in my '87 GT. And, finally, I have a Porsche Boxster, also, which I autocrossed at a Porsche event. Experienced drivers in a new Porsche Cayenne SC beat my times by a comfortable margin. Beaten by an SUV! With street tires!

So, driver's ed will speed you up. As for mechanical stuff, sticky tires help a lot. Rear sway bar if you have a pre-'88. Then the ride gets rougher. There are no free lunches, because as you tighten up the car, ride quality goes down. Urethane bushings, bigger sway bars, look at books on sports car handling for the usual things.

Driver's ed and tires, rear sway bar on pre-'88's.

Few things you can do, and if your not satisfied after these then buy a go-kart.

1.Poly
2.Lower your car 2 inches all the way around
3.Koni ajustable shocks and struts
4.Moog balljoints
5.Tubular a-arms
6.Front and rear swaybars with poly (1 inch up front and 7/8th in the rear)
7.Make your weight as close to 50/50 as possible(so as you were saying moving the battery upfront)

I did most of those upgrades on a pre-88 and the difference between stock and performance is amazing. Tires are really important too.

I'd also like to throw in... if you do not have the WS6 springs, or springs of equal rating.. you should get them. They will make a huge difference. When both my cars were stock, and both were running awesome... the 84 Fiero 2m4 SE could out-handle my 87 Fiero SE / V6 any day. I have the full WS6 package on the 84, but only the Y99 heavy duty package on the 87. The WS6 springs make a world of difference.

My 84 had all original shocks and struts and springs (WS6) and it had over 105k miles at the time.

My 87 had KYB Shocks and Struts, and original Y99 springs and only 80k miles.

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Todd,
1997 Pontiac Grand Am GT
1987 Pontiac Fiero SE / V6 (3.2L)
1984 Pontiac Fiero 2m4 SE
1981 Pontiac TransAm (sbc 350)
1973 Volkswagen Type-2 Transporter

Forgive me if I use the terminology incorrectly, but aren't the WS6 springs only 25lbs tighter (?) than the stock springs? (Comparing the '84 SE to the '84 coupe) I dunno how that makes a big difference.

quote Originally posted by 82-T/A [At Work]: I'd also like to throw in... if you do not have the WS6 springs, or springs of equal rating.. you should get them. They will make a huge difference. When both my cars were stock, and both were running awesome... the 84 Fiero 2m4 SE could out-handle my 87 Fiero SE / V6 any day. I have the full WS6 package on the 84, but only the Y99 heavy duty package on the 87. The WS6 springs make a world of difference. My 84 had all original shocks and struts and springs (WS6) and it had over 105k miles at the time. My 87 had KYB Shocks and Struts, and original Y99 springs and only 80k miles.

quote Originally posted by Ed: Take some "driver's education" classes at a track near you.

Good advice. My father used to tell me when modifying a car to go faster, start by tightening the loose nut behind the wheel.

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I understand about learning to drive to compete with other drivers. I'm mainly wondering adout the cars set up. For example, my car is not a daily driver its only a toy for the weekends so if it rides a little rough it does'nt matter. My car is an 88 gt so it has a rear anti-sway bar. Do tubular control arms matter that much? I already have new ball joints in the front, new KYB's all around and new poly bushings in the back. I rebuilt the stock rack but I wonder if the design of the rack might be one of its week points. If it is what other choises do I have? What are its other weak points? Someone on this forum once said "even the 88's suspension is old technology and can't compete with new performance cars". What are the differances? How come the 88 does'nt stack up to say a Lotus Esprit turbo as far as suspension goes? Is it's suspension totaly different? Can my Fiero be made to out handle one? If so, how? If not, why?

I also would like to know the answers to these questions. So this thread is bumped back to the top..
experts, enlighten us please.

[This message has been edited by fiero-iwan (edited 06-27-2004).]

If (big if) the suspension is in good condition and all four wheels are aligned properly - and you've got decent tires on it, your Fiero is capable of a level of handling well in excess of what the average driver can manage effectively.

I'm sure that those reading feel they're better than average drivers and that their cars are in great shape. Are you sure? What you don't know can hurt you...

Step one: Fix the car. Those ball joints, etc. are pushing 20 years old and need help. Then get a real alignment from someone who knows what he's doing - not your local national brand tire store. Now, put some decent tires on the car. When all this is done, you're ready to:

Step two: Learn how to drive the car. Not that u-turn and parallel parking stuff, the "drive it at the limit and stay in control" stuff. You don't get this from driver's ed or a book - you'll need some practice on a closed course at the least, better yet get some driving lessons from a racing instructor.

Now, if you're completed those steps and find that the car just isn't handling well enough you can consider specific mods to improve specific characteristics.

Avoid the temptation to make shotgun improvements in hopes of compensationg for questionable driving skill. And be aware that not every well-meaning suggestion made by forum members is good advice. I'm sure that some feel that their modified Fiero is the cat's meow but I'd be scared to get behind the wheel of some of them.

Understand what each mod does and why before you bolt it on; some of them interact with each other, and some are downright dangerous to the unwary driver.

ummm.....let's see...the reason it cant handle like that? first, it wasnt meant for it, second, your engine is in the back so you got rack+pinion instead of power steering. lower profile tires are good too, less sidewall to flex when you turn. iunno if fieros have them or not never really paid any attention), strut towers up front. if they do, find some braces for them.

the easiest way to make a fiero handle great is to do what is done in Destroys Sig. LOL

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'86 Fiero GT

www.KylesFiero.tk www.XoticRydz.tk

You have to remember that "handling" is not a generic thing. You may set your car up to zip around your favorite set of twisty streets, only to find the suspension so tight that it's nearly unmanageable on a Freeway in need of paving. Think of it this way; on any weekend you can see a race on TV where the best crews in the world have set up the fastest cars of their kind for a specific track, yet there may be huge differences in the way the cars "handle". Not only that, but these are cars that will be running the same kind of tires, and very similar chassis.

I agree with the poster who advised "fixing" the car first. If the suspension is in good shape, properly aligned, and properly inflated tires, you should have a very good handling car. Remember too, handling is a subjective thing; road surface, tread design, and driver skill all factor into the equation.

There is no bolt-on piece in the world that can turn an inept driver into a Formula One hero. If you're not modifying your car for actual racing conditions, it will probably be a PITA for normal driving.

I see this thread came back from the dead. One of the new posts states that the biggest and best thing you can do is freshen up your suspension with new parts like ball joints and stuff. I agree totally. I guess what I was meaning is why are other mid and rear engine sports cars supposed to be so much better? What is the real differance in the suspension on one of these other cars than on a Fiero (88)? I know alot of people give credit to a name when they have no idea about the car itself. I have driven a few cars that the mere mention of its name stikes fear and envy in the heart of every supposed car guru there is. One was a 66 427 Vette, one a older 911 among other lesser autos (82 T-A, 84 HO Z28, 91 300ZX) You might not believe me but the best handling car of all these was the 82 T-A and this was a 135 or 140 HP slug. There are some people on this forum that believe a Fiero could never out do any Porshe, Lotus, Dino, horse, bull or anything else for that matter (Almighty MIATA). These people are narrow minded and probably not as good a driver as they think. With the right amount of mods you might not be able to out do some of them but you can damn sure run with them. I am not in any way a racer or anything so you out there that might want to, just keep your challenges to yourself, for everyone else keep up the good work and keep plugging away at the suspension. Like one of the new post said practicing you driving skills is as important as the car itself.

Good luck to everyone

Yes, the Lotus Esprit Turbo suspension is different! It was designed by a suspension wizzard for a high performance sports car costing 15 times what a Fiero did. Regardless, your 88 with a few tweaks can make it have to work hard to pull away from you on a good tight road. Sounds like you've done the main things other than heavier sway bars and a really good set of sticky tires. You didn't mention if you have gone to a wider rim/tire.