Who is running a 3800 SC with a 5spd getrag manual transmission. If so what mods are done and what kind of clutch are you running most importantly. I really want to choose the best clutch I possibly can to hold up for a while and make it so I dont go through clutches every 10,000 miles. Thanks.
------------------
Maroon 1987 GT 5 spd: 2.8L Ferrari Red 1988 Formula 5 spd: 3.4L
I'm also interested in hearing if they find the first gear too short as some have mentioned getting better times starting in second, although it is rough on the clutch.
------------------ 1986 Pontiac Fiero GT Auto, soon to be 5 spd Getrag from 88 z24, 0-60 low 8's. Best 1/4 = 16.1 at 85mph, mods, wires, CRX intake, and power pulley. Planning Turbo 3800 swap.
Bought for 2500$ Canadian.
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04:56 PM
Rare87GT Member
Posts: 5088 From: Wichita, KS USA Registered: Oct 2001
I just want something reliable for everyday driving. I mean obviously with this engine I am going to want to get on it every once and a while. I am not going to abuse it at all. I would like to take it to the drag strip a few times Im sure for some numbers but most of my driving will be highway and in town here and there. I know with this engine the clutch is not going to last as long as a normal clutch but still I would like to get around 30,000+ out of one. Anyone had any luck yet with a 3800 SC or a V8 or even Northstar. What clutch setup, that's the question. I plan on having a 3.0" pulley, a supercooler, exhaust. I plan on maybe having around 275hp and 310ft/lbs of torque with the motor. Nothing crazy extreme for a 3800 like others I have seen.
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07:34 PM
NSAN1T Member
Posts: 698 From: Marble Falls, Texas, USA Registered: Mar 2002
revin is running a getrag. I think he told me heas running a clutch from centerforce... I may be thinking wrong though.. he gave me his stock one
From experience it has seemed that most people that used the Centerforce clutch have blown them out pretty quickly. I just want something that is going to last me like 30,000 miles or more with driving it good but still having fun with it.
I am. I am using a west cost fiero clutch. The version one step below the cindered metal cluth. I will be replacing it this winter though, not sure with what. It slips in higher gears under full throttle.
First gear is a total waste. One quick burnout is about all it is good for and then the shift to second and then the race is on. It is honestly the worst aspect of this conversion. First gear is just way to short.
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09:53 PM
Mosinee88GT Member
Posts: 212 From: Mosinee, WI 54455 Registered: Jan 2002
I recently put in a 9 3/4" clutchnet 6 puck unsrung hub with a gm 90 grand prix 9 5/8" pressure plate. I'm still breaking it in so it chatters some. It holds great so far.
------------------ Ivan Andrewjeski 88GT 3800sc
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10:08 PM
skitime Member
Posts: 5765 From: Akron, PA, USA Registered: Aug 2000
I have a 3800 intercooled & supercharged with V8Archie clutch. It is my second year with the clutch but probably only 4000 miles on it. It has not slipped yet.
------------------ Red 88 GT T-Top 3800 INTERCOOLED SUPERCHARGED White 88 GT Stock Please give me a rating if you appreciate my contribution. History of Skitimes Car UPDATED 6-20-03
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10:40 PM
LoW_KeY Member
Posts: 8081 From: Hastings, MI Registered: Oct 2001
well its about 2 weeks (guessing) before mines done.. should have 280 HP at the wheels. I'm using a SPEC Stage 3 clutch, been researching SPEC on mustang forums nothing but good things about them.
Most of the mustangs running them are running 300-450 HP. Told the guy at SPEC what I was doing he said the stage 3 clutch will be capable of handling 350+ HP
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11:23 PM
Jul 10th, 2003
mcaanda Member
Posts: 3652 From: Grand Junction Colorado Registered: Mar 2003
Originally posted by LoW_KeY: I'm using a SPEC Stage 3 clutch, been researching SPEC on mustang forums nothing but good things about them.
I too am in the "midst" of this conversion, and have decided that the stage III is going to be the clutch of choice that I will put in my 88GT.
I hope that the good words that I have heard are going to be true when I get it all togeather.
BTW: Tell them that you are apart of the Fiero Forum. The guy on the phone that I talked to, at length I might add, said that there is a discount < cha-ching > that can be applied to save you some Moo-la.
EDIT: I cant spell.
[This message has been edited by mcaanda (edited 07-10-2003).]
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02:18 AM
crzyone Member
Posts: 3571 From: Alberta, Canada Registered: Dec 2000
revin is running a getrag. I think he told me heas running a clutch from centerforce... I may be thinking wrong though.. he gave me his stock one
Ya... but if i remember correctly didnt he blow out 4th gear on that tranny or somethin? but the tranny was out of a 117k mile 88 formula that is sitting in my drive... hehe...
I have the 3800SC SII / Getrag setup. I went with the factory 2.8 clutch (mfg by luk). I did this primarily to save the transmission from all the torque of the engine and figured I would have slippage if I really got on it. NOT TRUE. After a proper break in (500 gentle city street miles), I can launch as hard as I want and it doesn't slip. I have no problem breaking the rear tires loose if I really want to and launches are just solid. The only place there is slippage is a 3-4 power shift. It takes a sec for the clutch to lock in 4th under those conditions (I would assume I would have the same problem in a 4-5 power shift, but I haven't found a place to be able to take it up to a fast enough speed to test). I just take that shift easier and it is no problem. I have 2,000 miles on it so far an no problems. As for longevity, I would expect 25-40k miles out of this clutch. Now when I go to the intercooler and head porting this winter, I will go ahead and put a stronger clutch in because I only assume the 3-4 shift slippage might drop down to a 2-3 shift slippage, but for a fairly stock 3800 SC setup, the stock Fiero clutch works just fine.
I know I've touched on this before but it's been awhile and I never did get a satisfactory answer. Why does everyone on this forum insist on calling the 5 speed Muncie 282 a "Getrag?" It is not a Getrag. It was not built by Getrag, it was not designed by Getrag, and Getrag claims to have no knowledge of the trans. Okay, I'm done with my rant for the day.
[This message has been edited by MikeE (edited 07-11-2003).]
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06:03 AM
StansGT Member
Posts: 914 From: Schoolcraft MI, USA Registered: Jul 2001
I know I've touched on this before but it's been awhile and I never did get a satisfactory answer. Why does everyone on this forum insist on calling the 5 speed Muncie 282 a "Getrag?" It is not a Getrag. It was not built by Getrag, it was not designed by Getrag, and Getrag claims to have no knowledge of the trans. Okay, I'm done with my rant for the day.
I don't know what your sources are, but it IS a Getrag design. GM bought the design and set up production in the Muncie plant, hence the common Muncie-Getrag designation. In '93 after some revisions to a few ancillary parts of the design (mechnical to magnetic VSS, dipstick/oil fill changes, and hydraulic release bearing) it was redesignated NVG-T550 and production was moved to the New Venture Gear plant (or the Muncie plant was renamed New Venture Gear, I'm not sure which).
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09:13 AM
mrfixit58 Member
Posts: 3330 From: Seffner, Fl, USA Registered: Jul 99
.... In '93 after some revisions to a few ancillary parts of the design (mechnical to magnetic VSS, dipstick/oil fill changes, and hydraulic release bearing) ....
Will,
Do you know if the later hydraulic release bearings fit on an older Getrag or Isuzu transmission?
Hi Will, Sorry I took so long to respond, I've been very busy. Thank you for the response. Although I have Broached this subject before, I have only gotten responses similar to StansGT's response which is fine as far as it goes but it still doesn't give me a why. From all I've seen and heard, having a trans built or designed by Getrag is certainly nothing to brag about. It's more like having a black sheep in the family that you always have to apologize for and would rather keep secret. I would be very interested in your source for furthering my knowledge. My source was a fellow on the 3.4 DOHC forum a few years ago. He called Getrag trying to get parts for his Getrag 284 in his Z34. Getrag said they could not distribute parts due to a contractual arrangement with GM but could rebuild on an exchange basis as long as the cases were still good (for a lot of $). He inquired about the so-called Getrag 282 and Getrag claimed to have never heard of a Getrag 282, a Muncie 282, or a 5tm40, whatever that is. He concluded that the 3.4 DOHC guys have the true Getrag, which appears to be true according to your post too. Again, that seems a rather dubious honor since those guys have had nothing but problems with their Getrag 284s and every other Getrag I've ever encountered was also a piece of junk.
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06:31 PM
Will Member
Posts: 14303 From: Where you least expect me Registered: Jun 2000
Do you know if the later hydraulic release bearings fit on an older Getrag or Isuzu transmission?
No, I'm pretty sure not. The bellhousing in the immediate area is different (an alignment pin to hold the bearing, for instance), and the input shaft inner bearing is also different.
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07:41 PM
PFF
System Bot
Will Member
Posts: 14303 From: Where you least expect me Registered: Jun 2000
Hi Will, Sorry I took so long to respond, I've been very busy. Thank you for the response. Although I have Broached this subject before, I have only gotten responses similar to StansGT's response which is fine as far as it goes but it still doesn't give me a why. From all I've seen and heard, having a trans built or designed by Getrag is certainly nothing to brag about. It's more like having a black sheep in the family that you always have to apologize for and would rather keep secret. I would be very interested in your source for furthering my knowledge. My source was a fellow on the 3.4 DOHC forum a few years ago. He called Getrag trying to get parts for his Getrag 284 in his Z34. Getrag said they could not distribute parts due to a contractual arrangement with GM but could rebuild on an exchange basis as long as the cases were still good (for a lot of $). He inquired about the so-called Getrag 282 and Getrag claimed to have never heard of a Getrag 282, a Muncie 282, or a 5tm40, whatever that is. He concluded that the 3.4 DOHC guys have the true Getrag, which appears to be true according to your post too. Again, that seems a rather dubious honor since those guys have had nothing but problems with their Getrag 284s and every other Getrag I've ever encountered was also a piece of junk.
I don't know who you talked to, but EVERYTHING I've ever read about the trans supports what I told you.
Yes, the 284 is a Getrag built transmission instead of just a Getrag design, which means that it's a huge PITA to do anything with.
I don't think Getrags are bad at all. The Autobahn gearing is a bit annoying, but the 282's stand up to 400 HP engines with a surprisingly good reliability record. I've been thrashing one with my Northstar for 15,000 and have had no problems.
If Getrags really were junk, nobody would ask the company to design anything. But EVERY BMW manual transmission is a Getrag, the 6 speed in MkIV Supras is a Getrag, the AWD transaxle used in 2nd gen 3000 GT VR4's and Stealth R/T's is a Getrag, the dual layshaft 6 speed in the Ford SVT Focus is a Getrag, the C5 Corvette differential is a Getrag, etc...
I use a 6 puck 6 sprung disk one side kevlar one side ceramic from clutch masters. lots of ppl like the spec clutches. I would go that way as they are alot cheaper with good results. My clutch works perfect for me it has never slipped with exception of power shift at full throttle just for a split second which I like so the driveline doent get massive loads. Im running a getrag 284 in my 3800sc and I love the trans, no gear noise at all at full throttle, gear spacing is more even between 1-2. Also has larger axles and dif as well as massive webing around diff area for strength.
[This message has been edited by dabadfiero (edited 07-22-2003).]
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01:06 AM
triksterut Member
Posts: 114 From: Layton, Utah, USA Registered: May 2000
I am also doing a 3800 SC conversion. I have an MR2 Turbo as well....I would REALLY like to get the tranny from my MR2 into my Fiero <G> That gearing is much better for the kind of power the 3800 puts out. Do you think we could make it fit??
Jeremy
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05:50 PM
StansGT Member
Posts: 914 From: Schoolcraft MI, USA Registered: Jul 2001
I am running a special clutch myself and a Clutch making company sat down and came up with. I wont say because I am hopefully will be selling them before to long on the forum. I just want to make sure they hold up to what we made them to be. First of all, it is a Kevlar and Ceramic 3 puck disk. It is bigger than a stock fiero clutch, its 9.687 in dia. Plus it is cheaper than a Centerforce and Spec in price. I will be selling them for 350.00 if and when I find out if they hold up. I told them it had to handle upto 300 horse and 325 foot pounds of torque. I have talked this clutch over with StansGT and GT-X. It will provide some slip but not like the slip out of an organic clutch. Plus there is NO break in period!!! Put it in and go!!! I am running this behind a Isuzu trannie aswell. Some minor mod's to some of the parts but, it will be worth it. I have had people tell me the Isuzu wont hold up, all I can say is tell that to Archie. He uses them in his cars and he says they work just find. And if you can't trust Archie then who can you trust. Am I right? Of course I am. But there is my .02 cents worth.
Korey J
------------------ "88" 3800 SC V6 Coupe 84 parts car
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03:48 AM
crzyone Member
Posts: 3571 From: Alberta, Canada Registered: Dec 2000
look at their website I posted earlier in this thread, they have prices to their clutches. Just have to choose the flywheel your using and match a clutch to it.
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12:21 PM
triksterut Member
Posts: 114 From: Layton, Utah, USA Registered: May 2000
As far as the MR2 tranny. It's better in both respects. The stock/tranny clutch setup is good for at least 350hp (I know from experience and 15k miles of me driving it). Also first gear has much more "range" as the car has more power even bone stock than the Fiero had. I'll go drive tonight and get shift points Do you think it would fit?? Well within a reasonable budget anyways
Jeremy
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03:56 PM
Will Member
Posts: 14303 From: Where you least expect me Registered: Jun 2000
just remember its not HP that makes a clutch slip - its torque and your cluth is least likely to slip in 1st gear most likely to slip in high gears when its harder for the engine to turn the tranny shaft..
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05:05 PM
PFF
System Bot
Jul 24th, 2003
triksterut Member
Posts: 114 From: Layton, Utah, USA Registered: May 2000
Go to the section titled "Toyota MR2 - MKII Turbo (1989 - 1994)". They are about right on. 1st gear is good to about 35 or so. The car has enough torque to break the tires loose just about anytime I want and no slippage
Jeremy
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12:06 PM
hoola47 Member
Posts: 526 From: London, Ontario, Canada Registered: Feb 2003
What does the Fiero Getrag 5 speed 1st gear run to before shifting at say 5500 6000rpm, 30 km, 35, 40, 45? I'm just interested?
------------------ 1986 Pontiac Fiero GT Auto, soon to be 5 spd Getrag from 88 z24, 0-60 low 8's. Best 1/4 = 16.1 at 85mph, mods, wires, CRX intake, and power pulley. Planning Turbo 3800 swap.
So maybe I am incorrect in assuming that gear ratio is better suited. Since I can go 35 in 1st on the MR2 but I had not taken into account that I do that at about 7k RPM's. The 3800 SC is 6k redline I think. Well it was worth thinking about anyways
Jeremy
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01:03 PM
hoola47 Member
Posts: 526 From: London, Ontario, Canada Registered: Feb 2003
Ok are you saying 35 km/h , or 35 mph? getrag 1st and second max at 6000rpm speed in Km/h would be great
------------------ 1986 Pontiac Fiero GT Auto, soon to be 5 spd Getrag from 88 z24, 0-60 low 8's. Best 1/4 = 16.1 at 85mph, mods, wires, CRX intake, and power pulley. Planning Turbo 3800 swap.
really not bad at all.
