hey rogergarrison,
just thought i'd enlighten you on how many NASCAR driver's actually run champions. true, some may wear the sticker for show, but i work personally know the engineer resposible for designing and releasing these plugs to the teams. i'm sure i could get you an actual list if you would like that?
but i know for a fact that joe gibbs' Nascar and NHRA cars run them.
it's amazing! i've never seen so many people so adamant about NOT using a spark plug. oh well, maybe we deserve it.
seems to me that anyone interested in quality wouldn't be screwing around with a engineering f***-up like the fiero. c'mon guys, let's be truthful. they are kinda fun to drive, but i've been restoring an 87 GT for a YEAR now (from the ground up). and i drive an 84 SC. i am VERY familiar with these cars inside and out and, well, they're kinda crap. it's basically a chevette on steroids. saying that you won't use a plug because it's supposedly "crap" in a car that definitely is... in the words of another member, " putting a performance plug in a fiero is like hooking up cerwin vega speakers to an AM radio.

i'm sure this will p*SS some people off, but let's face it if we could be driving 'vettes or lamborghini's why would we mess with these things?

just a thought,

vinny

p.s. i still enjoy driving and working on my fiero, just wish i could afford a REAL sports car.

------------------

vinnywolfe (or whatevey your name is). I'm sorry to see that you have sunk so low that you have to get your point across by using foul mouthed trash. If you have had any public speaking training, the one thing they tell you is that anyone that has to use profanity, are not confident in their point of view and use it to bolster themselves. I would not put up with that kind of stuff from my kid. Now go sit in the corner like a good little boy untill you can behave.

[This message has been edited by wkayl (edited 07-20-2000).]

vinnywolfe, I just want to add a simple retort to your debasing comeback to rogergarrison.

You sir take things amazingly personal. Who cares who runs what plugs, I prefer Rapid Fire, others Bosch, you obviously prefer Champion.

But you amaze me with the comment regarding the restore of the Fiero. If you think it is a piece of crap, why in the world are you spending your money and time restoring it? This is the height of hypocrisy(sp).

Please, realize you speak with forked tongue when on the one hand you trash the fiero and then state that you own two, a resto and a driver. Give me a break.

If you truly want a "real" sports car, stop spending your money on fieros (saving that money for your "real" sports car) then sell your fieros (giving yourself more money) and then go buy your "real" sports car.

------------------
Gold-86SE (Fiero Collector)

[This message has been edited by Gold-86SE (edited 07-19-2000).]

And by the way, VW, thanks for the misquote! What I said was that enhancing the plug without upgrading the rest of the ignition system was like adding big speakers to an am radio. That would be in any car, get it? I was not putting down Fieros.

I can only offer one bit of advice... get some counseling.

Well this is a matter of being "truthful". If I was to have a choice between a Corvette, Lambourghini, and a Pontiac Fiero, I would still go for the Fiero. Has been and always will be my favorite Car. Yes, the other cars may be Superior Sports Cars (and you wouldn't have to break my arm if ya wanted to give 'em to me) but the "Plastic Little Chevette on Steroids" will always be MY first choice. As crazy as it sounds, I love that little piece of crap, and if someone wants to trash it, I GOT TWO WORDS FOR 'EM........BATMOBILE and BOOMTASTIC!

Vinny, don't take stuff so personal dude, initially, nobody meant anything as a personal slam and somehow it got way out of hand. Whadd'ya think? On the job stress? Maybe it's time for a well deserved vacation!
You get the Beer, I'll bring the Babes

Cruisin' On,
Coconut

------------------

Umm... I'm using NGK V-power plugs and haven't had any problems... so, uhhhhh, my car is better than yours. <sticks out tongue> pbbbbbbbbtt
<runs away before someone nails him with a spark plug>

------------------
Mike -- Golden Valley, MN
Black 86.5 GT 5 Spd, 147,000 miles and counting!

I personally dont use spark plugs..... I just take the boot off the wire and shove it down in there......saves a buck or 2!!!!

Maybe we should change the subject; how about those Flowmaster mufflers?! Yuk, yuk.

no offense,but there's an awful lot of folks
with not enough to do(me included)
1. ngk=no good krap
2. champion=lawnmower plugs
3. platinum anything=can you say sucker?
4. all the rest-buy whatever you got a coupon
for they are all about equal

Coconut, man thats a nice thing to say about the fiero! Don't get me wrong i love my car, But if you got a 2000Vette or Diablo laying around i'll trade ya! I'll even deliever my car! and i even have a parts car and tons of parts i'd throw in.

New topic- Distributer caps! I use 24karat gold ones, with porcilin termals so that it distributes the spark well.

Dear Lord.... Look what you've all become! It's my turn. Just for you're info Vinny-Woof, I've already had a "real" sports car that was paid for('94Z28) and I sold it to have more Fiero money. And yes, Champion stuff is crap. In fact, the last time I was at the auto parts store the clerk specifically recommended that I stay away from champion components because of the complaints they've had of poor quality. And I can't believe you would say that about the Fiero. Jeezus, give it to me you ungrateful little steaming pile of beaver poop. If you're Fiero is slow and un-sportscar like, that's your own problem.

Fiero is crap???

Excuse me while I go outside and polish that turd

BTW, what the hell is a sparkplug anyhow?? Do cars need them and where do they go??

boo freakin' hoo.
mr. wykal and stinky (or is it stimpy), you turds, i HAVE had public speaking courses. in fact, i probably have more of an education than your entire families. anyway, those courses are for addressing an audience with an IQ of 120 or higher. a crowd, of which, i'm sure you two are not part of. with that in mind, i have two words for you rhode scholars. get bent!

to mr. 86-se (sorry about your luck), i REALLY do enjoy my cars. but, they ARE cheaply made (hence, it's affordability) and
realistically, not THAT fast. i've been told that i am being hypocritical. and that's no spelling mistake. i looked it up in the dictionary (for wykal, that's the real thick book on your shelf with dust all over it and a brand new looking binding) for driving and working on fieros and saying something negative about them. i can't AFFORD to own or maintain a real sports car. you can't just go to the junk yard for 'vette or viper parts. but i can get just about anything i need for my fieros. don't get so bent outta' shape. sorry, but the sooner you accept the truth the easier it will be for you. (ha). it's just NOT a sports car. it's a sporty commuter.
and you, you BASTARD, i mean GT BASTARD. if you think that a z28 is a REAL sports car, YOU SIR, ARE ON CRACK! and as for the nice gentleman working at the parts store, let me guess. Autozone, no wait, Murrays? i'm sure he know as much about plugs (to make a recommendation) as you. NOTHING. don't run champions. i don't care. but don't base the reason for NOT running them on what an ignoramus making six dollars an hour says. (hearsay).

there i'm done, Damn you guys got me so bent out of shape, i'm going to have to double up on my prozac.

later,
vinny

You just gotta love it when a guy's only retort is "Oh yeah, well I restore pieces of crap!" (picture My Cousin Vinny lurking around a men's room hopefull of finding his next "project")

How on earth did all this arise out of freakin' spark plugs? Can't we just stick to less divisive topics like abortion, gun control, or capital punishment?

PS I've been using AC Delco Rapid Fires and I like 'em. That's all that matters, folks.

hey boomer, did i say restore? i meant "getting it up an running. can you actually restore a fiero? i mean, don't you restore a 57 chevy or a 55 'vette?
a fiero you just slap together and go have fun with it. when it breaks, it's time for another trip to the junk yard.

vinny

------------------

[This message has been edited by vinnywolfe (edited 07-20-2000).]

Okay, my 2 cents: It is a simple matter of doing some math. If you, and every other intelligent person with a 120 and above IQ, buy a set of "Brand C" plugs and they last 10,000 miles, then you get another set. All us uneducated folks buy another brand of our choice and run them 30,000 miles before replacing them. You put in 3 sets for every one of my sets, so your plug can honestly claim to be the best selling BECAUSE YOU REPLACE THEM MORE OFTEN!!!! The best spark plug is the one that doesnt foul when the weather isnt perfect, the fuel system isnt perfect, the air filter isnt perfect. . . My crew loves to put in Champs because we know that pretty soon we will be doing it again and charging the idiot that requested them. Big deal if race teams run them- they are not over the counter plugs. And they have an on staff expert to read the plugs and adjust the carb and heat range as necessary. Most of us dont have that type experience so we want something that doesnt have to be checked after 2 laps and replaced after only 500 miles (as in a qualifying or Cup race)

quote Originally ranted by vinnywolfe: boo freakin' hoo. mr. wykal and stinky (or is it stimpy), Ok, what the F did I say about public speaking, or champion plugs for that matter? you turds,oooooh, burn! i HAVE had public speaking courses. in fact, i probably have more of an education than your entire families.Yeah, whatever. HONORARY BS DEGREE FOR SURE! anyway, those courses are for addressing an audience with an IQ of 120 or higher. a crowd, of which, i'm sure you two are not part of. with that in mind, i have two words for you rhode thats Rhodes Scholar, thank you very much Mr. GED!scholars. get bent! and the bullshit goes on and on...until don't run champions. i don't care. but don't base the reason for NOT running them on what an ignoramus making six dollars an hour says. (hearsay).now if you really don't care, why all the frothing at the mouth? I haven't heard such irrational personal attacks like this since Lyndon LaRouche ran for President! there i'm done, Damn you guys got me so bent out of shape, i'm going to have to double up on my prozac. I'm sure we'd all be willing to pass around the hat for donations later, vinny

------------------

Ever heard of choosing your battles Vinney-boy? Talk about going psycho over nothing at all...

AND GOSH-DARNIT, NOTHINGS GONNA MAKE ME STOP GETTING MY OIL CHANGED AT WAL-MART!!!!!!

------------------

Well Mr. vinnywolfe (or whatever your name is) you can't even copy another person's name correctly. And for all that egimacatun you have it sure hasn't taught you any communication skills. I may spell a word wrong now and then, but I don't have to revert to name calling and foul language like a 5 year old. Now back to your corner, and no milk and cookies for you.

p.s. As for the rest of the Forum Members, thanks for not sinking to profanity and name calling as some with (as they claim) high IQ's but no social skills.

yes, lets change the subject to something less contravercial like the legality of disconnecting your EGR valve.

------------------
....but Officer, I wasn't speeding. I was qualifying!

"did i say restore? i meant "getting it up an running. can you actually restore a fiero? i mean, don't you restore a 57 chevy or a 55 'vette? a fiero you just slap together and go have fun with it. when it breaks, it's time for another trip to the junk yard"

When you actually stop and think about it, what do you think people were doing with '57 Chevies and '55 Corvettes back the late '60s - early '70s? That's right, slapping them together to go have fun with and making another trip to the junk yard when they broke. After all, wouldn't someone into REAL sports or muscle cars be more interested in a something along th lines of a new big block Corvette, a V-12 Jag, or any of Detroits pavement pounding muscle cars of the time instead of some clunky old heap from the '50s that most likely needed a serious amount of work to keep running?

Furthermore, I doubt that either of those cars enjoyed the aftermarket support that the Fiero does at it's relatively young age, either. I honestly believe that in 30 years a V-6 Fiero in good condition is going to be just as desireable a collectors car as those old Chevies and Corvettes are now. Even if it isn't, who cares, I'm still having a hell of a lot of fun with mine. And to me, that's what a "sports" car is all about. Not some fancy schamncy high dollar name. Yes, it's unfortunate that GM's bean counters watered the Fiero down in the first place and then killed it just as it was beginning to reach its potential, bad that doesn't mean it should be excluded from the sports car definition. I suppose you would also exclude other inexpensive yet fun little cars like the MG, Triumph, Austin Healey, etc from short list of snooty "real" sports cars, too?

Maybe if a lot of those cars hadn't been ruined by their neglectful, cheap owners using those crappy Champion sparkplugs, we'd have more of them around to enjoy today. (Please don't let the sarcasm and facetious nature of that escape you)

PS Don't be dissin' the BNSF or I'll have to come kick your a$$!

Champion Spark Plugs are only one item in a long list of things I wld not use in my dogs ass. This includes little green army men, crosstown busses, Tootsie Pops, my car keys, a rutabega, shaving cream, the May issue of Popular Mechanics, a celphone, neckties, Faberge eggs, real eggs, Christmas tree ornaments, a Partridge Family tin lunchbox with matching thermos. I suppose the list could go on infnitely because I wouldn't stick anything in my dogs ass.
I'm sure Mr. Wolf will adamantly go forth about the benefits of sticking things in the ass, it is a personal choice and one should not feel pressured to stick things in the ass, either their own or of their canine companion. I can merely relate the lack of success I personally have had with sticking things in my dogs ass. I may not have the knowledge and technique of Mr. Wolf (wow, stick Lenny up your dogs ass! and he's a pretty big fella. You must spend a LOT of time training your dog to accept large items rectally) but the best I've ever seen is suppositories at the vet.
Well, anyway, have a really Nice Day everybody!

------------------

<comes out of hiding>
<sticks champion sparkplug onto end of ignition coil wire of his GT>
<sticks aformentioned sparkplug up Vinnywolfe's ass>
<attempts to start car>

Is she gettin' any spark Vinny? Good spark? What? You like that?
Guess Champion's good for something...

<grabs his GT and goes back into hiding>

------------------
Mike -- Golden Valley, MN
Black 86.5 GT 5 Spd, 147,000 miles and counting!

this is not about spark plugs anymore and i am not going to try and defend a product i believe in with a bunch of idiots! (mr. wkayl,bastard, stinky, standard and boomer). it's like getting into a battle of wits with an unarmed audience.
that subject is old. and i do value MOST of the people's opinions and info on this forum.

so let me just go by saying that you little digusting freaks, (you know who you are), sure do have a lot of balls sitting at your computer running your disgusting sewers. maybe we could continue this discussion at an upcoming show or meet. just let me know.
i have a life outside wasting my time with you homosexuals (mr. wkayl, bastard, stinky, standard and boomer). you guys are probably the nerd balls i see riding around in your RACE cars with your nasty little pocket protecters in your shirt pocket and the bandaid on your glasses thinking your so cool. well excuse me for telling you what the guy in the corvette next to you is thinking.
YOU SUCK! (almost as bad as champions HA!)

oh yeah, mr. wkayl, you mom is so fat when she jumps into the air, she gets stuck. how's that for tact you little weiner!

[This message has been edited by vinnywolfe (edited 07-21-2000).]

I got something in my pocket and it's a protector, but it doesn't hold PENCILS.

How do we get rid of this guy?

Vinnywolfe~~

Haven't you said enough by now? Or do you really have to have the LAST word?

Why do you all insist on dragging this on forever. GROW UP!!

You guys really have nothing better to do than bicker back and forth like children?

There is nothing wrong with having a disagreement, or debate for that matter, but this has gone way beyond that.

Why is everyone getting so offended. I really don't care what vinnywolfe thinks of the plugs I use. And I could careless what he thinks of the Fiero. Should it really matter what someone else thinks of what you do? NO...As long as you are happy who cares. Why waste your time and energy on something so STUPID.

Everyone has opinions and yes sometimes I think someone's opinion is wrong but there is no need to act so childish about it.

JUST MY .02

------------------

Here, check out what the little "boy" had to say to me.

You have shown your education right in your last email. Thank you for pointing that out. As far as BOILERMAKER is concerned, that is my call-sign on the forum. Maybe you should do a little research every once in a while before you jump to assumptions.

The more and more I think about it, I agree with everything everyone has said about you on the forum. I just have the common courtesy to not use the four-letter F-bombs in email to other members of the forum.

As far as the degrading of forum members is concerned I believe that I read it as being pointed at everybody and not just WKAYL (whatever his name is).

Thank you for showing your age, education, and state of mind to me. It's always nice to know one's enemies.

BOILERMAKER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
----- Original Message -----
From: wolfenbarger
To: Charles Hornsby
Sent: Friday, July 21, 2000 4:44 PM
Subject: Re: Fiero

HOW DARE YOU! to send me email about the sujects on the forum you SPINELESS BATARD! first of all, i was insulting (as far as intelligence goes) JUST wkyal. if that is you then you can SUCK A FART OUT OF MY ASS!
I only think a few of you geekballs are morons. anyway, about my education, how about an associates in automotive engineering and a bachelor's in computer science (UT).
if that "boilermaker" at the end of your message is your occupation, then YOUR education level can't be past the sixth grade and you are a STUPID PUSSY! if that's not your occupation and you put it there thinking it was cool, well then your just STUPID.

let me know what you think, you ASS GOBLIN!

vinny

: Charles Hornsby <mike.hornsby@mindspring.com>
To: wolfenbargers@provide.net <wolfenbargers@provide.net>
Date: Friday, July 21, 2000 8:05 AM
Subject: Fiero

How dare you make generalizations as to IQ's of Fiero owners. I haven't even added any conversation to the spark plug thread on the forum and you call pretty much every Fiero owner a turd or stupid.

HOW DARE YOU!!!!!

I seriously doubt that you will ever have the education that my whole family has. In fact, I doubt that you will ever get close to the education that any single person in my family has.

There, I guess that is what I get for trying to keep my mouth shut on a subject, but when you go and insult my whole family and everybody else's family, that is way over the line.

I have said my piece and all I have to leave you with is the fact that you have no right to judge other people that have been keeping out of the flame wars.

Mike
BOILERMAKER

i think this has been dragged out long enough. i also don't think that posting that email was necessary. i'm pretty sure everyone here already thinks im as a-hole on their own and you don't need to prove it to them (i assume that was your intention).
but that is why i EMAILED it to you and didn't post it here. like we need anymore crap on this post (unless, of course, it pertains to the original topic). and i'm not EVEN gonna go there.

the END...

I guess you should have thought about that before you wrote me back.

------------------
Mike
86 Black 3.1 GT
87 Gold GT

Man o' Man ! I have never seen this since being on the forum.

1st .....Kudos Gt Girl you are right

2nd .....Vinny man its just spark plugs!

You will have to excuse the members on the forum here. They just get a little upset when someone comes to the game and sits on the wrong side of the bleachers and cheers for the wrong team

Basically lets clarify here

I know that this has been blown way out but what did you expect? these guys love their cars. Everybody has the right to choose what they want and what they like. Thats why they put that little place on the title that says OWNERS NAME:

Plugs are Plugs. That have a certain job they do ! and they all do it ! or they would not be in business. To what degree they perform that is really questionable.
I use rapid fires. Why? I think quality may be better and since my cars are GM I tend to stay within AC Delco. THATS IT ! The performance gained by any of the ones mentioned is small at BEST.

The other comment about piece of crap citation is really an untrue comment.I believe most of the parts you refer to were gone in 88 yr. But anyway alot of cars swap parts bends within GM. To save money and time. The fiero did eventually become a True sports car by 1988. You first have to define true sports car. A car that goes 0 - 60 in 3 seconds flat but can't handle a corner is not a TRUE sports car. Handling has to come into play. Here the fiero does a very commendable job.

Also your comment about compared to a new vette !?!? well of course not ..it is not a fair comparison. Lets be fair and compare it to a 88 vette. Now a 88 vettes could handle and go fast but had all kinds a quality issues. many people complained of interior piece falling off and stalkes on the steering column coming off in less than 10,000 miles on the odometer. That is quality problem. But look at the cost of a vette back then compared to a fiero GT. a HUGE difference for a car that if had the engine upgraded could more than likely hang with it for half the cost! Many experts had theories that one of the reasons the fiero never really saw full potential was because it would steal sells from the vette. Now how could that be since its was such a piece of crap? Another point of why these guys are fans.

I have a car that total I have spent $11,000 on :that includes the 3.8 sc conversion. everything else is stock. the car itself only has 54kmiles on the body.
never had any problems other than minor maintenence and it will run rings around the same model year vette. and it looks better in my opinion than alot cars on the road.

I had a manager of corvette connection here in FL offer me 15k for it. I would say he knows a thing or to about Sports Cars.

Alot people bought fieros for their looks and you know what they still look good today!

Not slamming you just clarifying....

OUT !

------------------
Robert
88GT Top 3.8 SC t top
88GT T top 55k for sale
http://fullspeed.to/NorthFLFieros

quote Originally posted by vinnywolfe: this is not about spark plugs anymore and i am not going to try and defend a product i believe in with a bunch of idiots! (mr. wkayl,bastard, stinky, standard and boomer). it's like getting into a battle of wits with an unarmed audience. that subject is old. and i do value MOST of the people's opinions and info on this forum. so let me just go by saying that you little digusting freaks, (you know who you are), sure do have a lot of balls sitting at your computer running your disgusting sewers. maybe we could continue this discussion at an upcoming show or meet. just let me know. i have a life outside wasting my time with you homosexuals (mr. wkayl, bastard, stinky, standard and boomer). you guys are probably the nerd balls i see riding around in your RACE cars with your nasty little pocket protecters in your shirt pocket and the bandaid on your glasses thinking your so cool. well excuse me for telling you what the guy in the corvette next to you is thinking. YOU SUCK! (almost as bad as champions HA!) oh yeah, mr. wkayl, you mom is so fat when she jumps into the air, she gets stuck. how's that for tact you little weiner! [This message has been edited by vinnywolfe (edited 07-21-2000).]

At this point of the topic, it sure seems to me that Mr. Vinny has lost sight of the totally absurd humor involved here and has turned to idle threats. Are we to infer that he means some physical altercation at the next Fiero meet? If that's the case, then bring it on! Tell me where you are going to be and when. Just so you know, I am NOT a buck-o-nine weakling with a pocket protector. I am actually 6'6", 290lbs and carrying around a shitload of pent-up rage. You really want to meet me?

Looking forward to our date,
stimpy

Hey ! if thats the case Stimp could you send pics of that altercation ?

also uh how the H-e-(( do you sit in your car.!?!?!? Man !

------------------
Robert
88GT Top 3.8 SC t top
88GT T top 55k for sale
http://fullspeed.to/NorthFLFieros

Ok, well, this is the first time I've seen this thread (I got a little suspicious when a thread with the subject "Spark Plugs" got so big so fast) and really, I don't want to read 73 posts to see what's going on. I've got better things to do (check the Announcement section real soon).

So enlighten me... Is this thread worthy of closing?

Well, being that I have now discovered that I am an idiotic, freaky, sewer mouthed homosexual that has a pocket protector and a band aid on my glasses, then yes, I'd say this thread has run it's course and is dire need of a padlock.

Boilermaker, I have to admit, I've been judging you by your name and assuming that to be your occupation, too. Did you name yourself after a stiff drink?

Vinny as a college student, I have also taken a public speaking course( as most college studeant do). I was NEVER instructed to use obsceneties or insult those who you are convversing with. If an instructor teaches this please check his/ her credentials.

By the way, I tried Splitfires with no apparent gain. Went back to good old AC Delco's.

[This message has been edited by FieroJon (edited 07-21-2000).]

[This message has been edited by FieroJon (edited 07-21-2000).]

Cliff,
Please delete this thread!