What differences to performance good or bad will removing the cat. converter, muffler, and EGR do to the car? Also if it's bad, what combination would be best? (such as having a cat but no egr or muffler, or having the egr but no cat and muffler etc)

right now i've got no cat or egr but i have a muffler, but i'm thinking of either removing it, or getting a flowthrough muffler.

no EGR???

Yup
my egr tube was cracked. I have a replacement, one of the aftermarket ones that wont crack and is flexible. But i didn't have time to fool around with the whole thing, so i disconnected the egr completely. car runs fine without it, takes an extra second to start up, but i'm just wondering what running with no egr does to my car....other than getting into legal issues

After taking the cat off of my Ex-SE (86) i lost a little torque (read on a Dynojet Model 248c) but gain in the cool sound was worth the torque loss. 2.5" flowmaster with no cat sounds sweet. doesn't burn valves and has great torque as long as you have stock ported manifolds. as for the EGR you will gain throttle responce BUT the EGTs and combustion chamber temps will be ASTRONOMICAL! it can melt a piston, your NOx output will be way high (bad for environment, well thats what "they" say) who ever they are. but your throttle responce will be better and you highway crusing will be TOAST with out the EGR...

[This message has been edited by 1FST2M6 (edited 07-10-2000).]

what do you mean by TOAST on the highway?

so far i've had my car running like this for over a month with no problems. I noticed the little bit of torque loss without the cat, but i love the new sound so i couldn't care less. I'm not into racing all that much. I'm more into having a nice sounding, looking, sporty unique car

My first 86 SE had the EGR disconnected for 63,000 miles with no problems. To help reduce head temps caused by EGR removal I advanced my timing by 2 degrees. My second SE is just like my first SE.

that's good to hear then
if i change the timing on my car as well, would i notice anything different? my fiero right now shoots off like a rocket. I've got an automatic, and the thing doesn't change gears until the 4600-5000 mark on the rpm meter which i like.

Lots of old discussions about the pros and cons of running without the EGR valve, do a search for more info. I'm not sure I would remove the EGR on an ECM controlled engine. I'd trash that EGR in a heartbeat if I was running a carb and no computer.

advancing the timing will increase engine/head temperature. thats a main component of the aftermarket chips... and thats why they use lower temp thermostats and fan switches.

too bad we have crazy emissions testing here in canada!! sucks

I eliminated the EGR on my Grand National over 5 years ago.I've never had any problems because of it.My car passes emissions testing here in New Jersey with no problem.

shain
i'm here in toronto and running no cat converter or egr
but i already had my car emission tested before i did all that
if it ever has to go get tested again, i'll just put it all back on again temporarily

So, what do i need to remove to eliminate my EGR??? Thank's Steve

When the EGR is active, the spark advance is increased up to 9 degrees depending on the calculated EGR flow. If you remove or block the EGR, the advance may be too much and the engine will ping. 92 octane should cure it, but not always.

Either run higher octane gas or the EGR spark advance has to be dropped to 0.

Terry

so how do i do it?
steve

Make a plate to block the EGR flow at the EGR. Take it out and cruise it. Give it some extra throttle (not WOT) and listen for pinging. If it's pinging, raise the octane. If that doesn't solve it, it's chip time. That's the only place the EGR spark advance can be changed.

Does anyone sell these blockoff plate for the EGR??? What do I do about my EGR sel. ?

You'll have to make one. I used a few layers of thick aluminum.

Removing the solenoid will set a code. Maybe you can ground the diag line back to the ECM and it won't care.

I used a freeze plug.

You can get a chip From Joe Wynman that elimantes EGR operation. Mines been off for 20K miles. I sell egr block off plates for the exhuast manifold, you remove the EGR valve and bolt this 1/4 inch thick painted steel plate on in it's place. Also put copper permatex under the edges of the plate. As for the intake manifold, i sell them too, but you could also use a copper freeze plugs if you can find ones that fit. 20 dollars shipped in US for both plates.

Mike LeCompte

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Mike LeCompte
86 Fiero GT 3.2L w/ nitrous