Or other R-12 substitutes...

Manufacturer claims will work with existing hoses, dryer and compressor and will outperform R12...

Seems too good to be true...might be a better alternative to an R134 retrofit depending on cost and availability.

I'm just exploring all the alternatives before I start working on my air. Thanks for whatever opinions anyone can provide.

I just did this to my Fiero yesterday.....uses same oil and there is no need to change out anything. Besides the fact its cheaper, it does actually work better than R-12. I wouldn't even worry about R-134.

DANGER!!!! Many "drop in" replacements for r-12 are not legal for use in motor vehicles!! The say that the products will work, but lots of them are flamable. Check out the EPA's website for complete info on these products.

Freeze-12 is designed as a direct replacement for R-12. Its supposed to be a little more enviromentally friendly and all of that.

I've been working on cars and computers for over 20 years. I've done extesive research on this. I would only use R134a on my car.

The ONLY EPA and USDOT certified refrigerant is, unless something has changed recently, R134a.

R134a is also the only manufacturor approved refrigerant.

Many of the "alternates" are flamable, even explosive. Thay are banned in many areas because of this. This includes ALL hydrocarbon refrigerants.

GM's corporate policy on R134a is that is it safe, requires minimal refitting of the system, and is stable in all GM systems WITH EXISTING HOSES.

GM does recomend replacement of O rings on most of the older cars. This is common sense. The old freon leaked out some place. O-rings are cheap.

GM recomends replacement of the ACC/Dryer on all car over 5 year old not matter wether R12 or R134 is used for charging. (The entire auto AC industry recomends this. The desicant won't last forever.)

GM agrees that residual mineral oil is not a problem even when PAG is used with the new oil. GM testing has shown residual mineral oil will settle into the ACC/Dryer and maybe a small amount in the compressor sump. PAG or Ester must be used with R134 because mineral oil will not circulate with R134.

Industry, and I believe EPA, testing has shown repeatedly that R134 is stable in existing hoses. It is recomended that if hoses are replaced that "barrier" hose material is used.

DO NOT use an R11 flush on a system to be charged with R134.

SAE allows up to 2% of residual R12 in a system refitted for R134a. By the time you replace the ACC/dryer and the Orings there should be less than that with no problem.

[This message has been edited by theogre (edited 04-02-2000).]

Supposedly Freeze 12 is approved for mobile use and does not contain any flammable hydrocarbons (it contains R134 and R422 plus a stabilizer and lubricant).

Just out of curiousity, where did you get Freeze 12, Diggity ? And do you have to have the EPA license ?

Check the USEPA web site. I do not believe any blend is yet approved. Unless the Freeze-12 people can provide you with verfiable EPA aproval I would not use it.

the link below goes directly to refrigerant data.

USEPA & MVAC refrigerants

[This message has been edited by theogre (edited 04-04-2000).]

As of this year, I heard it was illegal to sell R-12 up here in Canada. I guess it's convert to R134 or go without now.

Last summer I recharged the a/c on 2 of my cars and the R12 was $60 per poung
It cost me $500 for the 2 cars!!! The mechanic said that R134 was only $12/lb so it was cheaper to switch over in the long run.