[This message has been edited by troyboy (edited 12-19-2011).]

Oh wow. I got to say, I say this thread coming but didn't realize it would come in this manner.

I think that the whole issue of what it means to build a kit car has been missed entirely. The name "replica" is slightly misleading - even I will admit that. While there is a finite difference between "kit car" and "replica," it's a line that can be drawn in various ways. People that build replicas don't build them to fully 'replicate' what they're trying to build. They just don't. If that were the case, then 99% of every replica builder has utterly failed.

Again, not everyone who owns a modified Fiero with some sort of kit car or replica car body on it just assumes they are utter failures because there may be multiple issues that aren't right. Do you think Ferrobi is upset that in the back of his F40 replica resides a stock 2.8L. No... well, he probably wants a bit more power. I can guarantee you however that pretty much everyone that looks at his car, whether it's going down the road or sitting at a car show, shows massive appreciation towards it. Even further does this appreciation extend to those who have done similar types of work and can understand the amount of effort and time it takes. Then you have things like the Mera/308. Are they anything like the real thing? Not really. The body on these cars is rather off compared to a real 308. Then you have the major variances that such cars carry. Do you think that people that own a 308 kit/replica care what others think of how their car looks? No. Obviously one just has to look at the enthusiastic Mera group that is part of PFF and can immediately see major variances in there cars, despite them essentially being the exact same thing. Should they be bash or lambasted because their cars are not like the real thing. Nope. I personally think the 308 replicas and Meras are one of the best things to happen to the Fiero kit community, despite most of them carrying nothing in common with the real thing. I love Batousai's enthusiasm with his Mera. I know he enjoys it, just like every real Mera owner and every 308 kit car owner does. Again most of their cars are not like the real thing. However that simply doesn't matter.

Another thing you have to realize is people don't have $6,000+ to spend on wheels. People don't have the tens of thousands of dollars that it takes to have serious body modifications on their Fieros made. I would seriously guess that 90%-95% of the currently active forum cannot afford Archie's widebody kit. I can - belive me I can. Do I want to buy it? No, I don't. Do I respect it? Of course I do. Archie and his crew put a tremendous amount of work into it's construction. Do I bash it. No. Is it my thing? Not really. I'm one of the ones that realize at the end of the day no matter how much you modify a Fiero, it's still a Fiero, and I can see better things that two grand could go to on my car.

The above is why such a large variance in the quality of cars exist out there, both Fiero, kit car, and replica. Kit cars and replicas are "easy," in that the major work is already done for you. All the end builder has to do is figure out a way to mount it properly, finish the intricate body work needed for paint, then paint. Of course there will be those that cut corners. Is that a problem? No. It's understandable. Building a kit/replica is nowhere near cheap (something everyone needs to realize) nor can it be completed in a timely manner.

Somebody said above that "kit cars are the best and worst thing to happen to Fieros," and I'm inclined to agree to a large deal. Part of constructing a kit car or replica is the joy of building the car from something that it is originally not. It the same thing you have done with your cars Madcurl and thus at the utter core of the matter makes you no different that whomever built the yellow Enzo that you bash. They took a vehicle, using components not originally made for it, and constructed something different out of it. Honestly for you to bash any sort of modifications done in any way to a Fiero is like you bashing yourself.

Here's a good case in point:

http://www.fiero.nl/forum/F...1/HTML/084032-3.html

quote Originally posted by Dehning:

quote Originally posted by madcurl: Whoever design this crap must've looked at ever ricer mold made and thought it would work on a Fiero. NOT!

Then you post Alex's car on this same page above;

quote Originally posted by madcurl:

While I'll admit the Plazma (Laura) is a very nice body on the Fiero, why do you not bash it? It carries that same "ricer" mentality as any other "ricer" does. Metal plating? Check. Spoiler? Check. Body kit-ish looking body work? Check. Don't even get me started on the other comparisons that could be drawn. Sure it's got a good amount of power to back up it's looks, but in all honesty at the end of the day the type of visual modifications done to the car are no different that someone taking a VFiber kit and putting it on their Fiero.

Don't get me wrong. Alex did a tremendous job with the car, and I feel that it's legacy will long live on in the Fiero community, as new potential Fiero enthusiasts come into the game and inquire about the car. I really respect what the man did to make the car his and I know more than anyone that the time and money that was placed into it was tremendous. Honestly, I believe it's more of an influential car to the Fiero community than even the choptops will ultimately become. However, at it's ultimate core it's on the same visual level as those so called "ricer" modifications that could be done to a Fiero. Thus if you're willing to bash that then you should bash the Plazma as well.

I have to say as a fellow Fiero owner and enthusiast I'm rather disappointed. As you obviously have the ability and means by which to afford these vehicles that see excessive modifications, you should be one of the first individuals to accept all modified Fieros in all their forms, whether they be kit/replica or standard modified Fiero. Yet it seems from the posts lately and obviously here there is a certain "standard" of sorts that just shouldn't exist in this sort of small community, especially as Fieros dwindle more and more in numbers daily. It's as if for you to accept any modified Fiero, they have to have a certain set of modifications that place them into the same realm as your cars - choptop, widebody, big wheels, modified engine. Not everyone is like that, modified Fiero or kit/replica or otherwise. If I were in possession of a highly modified Fiero(s), I would be the first to offer the most constructive criticsm I possibly could in every situation, rather than limit my responses to praise for those individuals I deem within the "sphere" of advanced Fiero ownership and bash everything else. You should be one of the more exclusive examples of where Fiero ownership can take a person, and yet more and more it appears as if instead of example it is a pedestal that no one can transverse atop.

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1986 Fiero GT... with REALLY high mileage

WOW where did all that negative come from curly?? (no bashing from me, just saying)
Pointing out flaws are no fun for anyone (well maybe for the person saying it). Most have done THEIR best at customizing stuff. either 1st time trying or done it for a while.
Non professionals can make a mistake here and there in the bodywork or in the custom parts. Flaws happen.

Kit cars VS. custom cars where do you draw a line? Some would look at your car and ask if it was a kit or a rebody I would think. How much IS still a Fiero?
Me bash curly's car? ok...too much chrome in the engine bay! (cause I don't want to have to polish it all the time )

Calm down Curls. We are all here for the love of the frame underneath, no matter who or what was done to the top and sides. agreed?

[This message has been edited by revin (edited 12-19-2011).]