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| Colonial Pipeline and how it's shut down effects all (Page 8/10) |
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blackrams
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MAY 12, 07:36 PM
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| quote | Originally posted by Hudini:
Ok the pipeline is back in business. We will see how long before things return to normal. You think these knotheads will learn their security lesson? |
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My understanding is it's partially back up but, maybe this announcement will cool the jets of those in the long lines trying to fill up every gas can they have.
Rams
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cliffw
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MAY 12, 07:37 PM
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| quote | Originally posted by blackrams:
Pretty sure most of us know gas and diesel come from crude oil and that unprocessed crude oil won't run any of our vehicles. I could be wrong but doubt it.
Rams |
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| quote | Originally posted by maryjane:
Good.I was beginning to wonder
So ,what does KeystoneXL have to do with today's refined fuels pipeline shutdown?
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Can you spell MOON SHINE ?
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Raydar
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MAY 12, 09:21 PM
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| quote | Originally posted by 82-T/A [At Work]:
Stop hooking ICS and SCADA systems up to the internet.
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This. Exactly this.
I understand how this stuff works. Looks like you do, too. Probably on a different level than I do.
During my work day, I support the comm links to our SCADA and AMI (automated metering) devices.
I used to be of the opinion that the worst kind of attack would be caused by a disgruntled employee or former employee. But I'm not so sure, any more.
My thinking was based upon the premise that most people don't understand the protocols that talk to the devices, and even if they did, they wouldn't be able to do anything with the data without a "control point", to define the data they happened to be looking at. But if they (an attacker) encrypts it, so that nobody can do anything with it, that would be a problem. A different kind of "Denial Of Service".
Our stuff is protected to a fare-thee-well. I hope it's enough. I think it is.
(I often joke that the most secure network is the one that cannot be accessed at all. But even the maintenance of our systems has turned into a chore, due to all the flaming hoops we have to jump through.)
Aside from that, I've heard comments that Colonial Pipeline's network security was a real mess, so maybe they were "inviting trouble".
Lastly, regarding all of the conspiracy theories, I have often heard words to the effect of... "Don't blame on malice, that which can be readily attributed to stupidity." Might ring true, in this case.[This message has been edited by Raydar (edited 05-12-2021).]
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randye
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MAY 12, 10:21 PM
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| quote | Originally posted by Hudini:
Ok the pipeline is back in business. We will see how long before things return to normal. You think these knotheads will learn their security lesson? |
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Gas stations reopened in Tampa area today but price per gallon jumped 20 cents.
This is insane.[This message has been edited by randye (edited 05-12-2021).]
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blackrams
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MAY 12, 10:35 PM
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| quote | Originally posted by Raydar:
This. Exactly this.
I understand how this stuff works. Looks like you do, too. Probably on a different level than I do.
During my work day, I support the comm links to our SCADA and AMI (automated metering) devices.
I used to be of the opinion that the worst kind of attack would be caused by a disgruntled employee or former employee. But I'm not so sure, any more.
My thinking was based upon the premise that most people don't understand the protocols that talk to the devices, and even if they did, they wouldn't be able to do anything with the data without a "control point", to define the data they happened to be looking at. But if they (an attacker) encrypts it, so that nobody can do anything with it, that would be a problem. A different kind of "Denial Of Service".
Our stuff is protected to a fare-thee-well. I hope it's enough. I think it is.
(I often joke that the most secure network is the one that cannot be accessed at all. But even the maintenance of our systems has turned into a chore, due to all the flaming hoops we have to jump through.)
Aside from that, I've heard comments that Colonial Pipeline's network security was a real mess, so maybe they were "inviting trouble".
Lastly, regarding all of the conspiracy theories, I have often heard words to the effect of... "Don't blame on malice, that which can be readily attributed to stupidity." Might ring true, in this case.
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Steve,
You most likely, have a better picture of this than the majority of us. It's not unusual for corporations to not spend to improve unless they see an advantage or, they take a hit. You may be correct in your assessment.
Rams[This message has been edited by blackrams (edited 05-12-2021).]
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Wichita
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MAY 12, 10:53 PM
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| quote | Originally posted by randye:
Gas stations reopened in Tampa area today but price per gallon jumped 20 cents.
This is insane.
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blackrams
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MAY 13, 06:25 AM
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| quote | Originally posted by Wichita:
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That's funny. Knowing locks only stop honest folks and barely slow down thieves. An employer I had once was losing fuel from some of the company vehicles, the boss's answer to that was to have the maintenance folks install a similar security system to those shown in the pic. Didn't stop the thieves they simply came back with buckets and poked holes in the side of the trucks tanks getting all they could get letting the tanks empty onto the ground. IIRC, four trucks had to have new tanks installed.
Security Cameras (later installed) did catch some teenagers stealing and they were prosecuted but, the losses were constant up to that point.
Rams
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Raydar
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MAY 13, 07:52 AM
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| quote | Originally posted by blackrams:
Steve,
You most likely, have a better picture of this than the majority of us. It's not unusual for corporations to not spend to improve unless they see an advantage or, they take a hit. You may be correct in your assessment.
Rams
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We are considered "critical infrastructure". (I'm really surprised if pipeline companies are not.) We are told by the feds - FERC and others - that, "You will take the appropriate security precautions. Period." This includes network security as well as physical security.
We have to undergo refresher security training every year.
Some of us have to undergo "Insider Threat" screening, for the exact reason that I mentioned in my previous post. They want to make very sure that nobody on the inside is going to "lose it" and start trashing stuff. Someone who knows what they're doing can do a lot of damage in short order.
If someone leaves, or even changes departments, their security access is revoked immediately. If it is needed in their next assignment, it is re-applied for, and reassigned.
Lots of things changed after 9/11, and things have really tightened up over the last 4-5 years. For several years, Network Security was the fastest growing segment of our employee workforce. It's also where the money is. Experienced Network Security Analysts start out at least one pay grade above where I am, now, after having done Telecom for 40 years.[This message has been edited by Raydar (edited 05-13-2021).]
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blackrams
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MAY 13, 07:58 AM
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| quote | Originally posted by Raydar:
Lots of things changed after 9/11, and things have really tightened up over the last 4-5 years. For several years, Network Security was the fastest growing segment of our employee workforce. It's also where the money is.
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As it should be..................... As the world moves forward into more AI, more and better supervision would seem mandatory. I'm way out of my league when it comes to this. So, I defer to those who can play at that level. Thanks for doing what you do. 
Rams[This message has been edited by blackrams (edited 05-13-2021).]
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Raydar
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MAY 13, 08:07 AM
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| quote | Originally posted by blackrams:
As it should be..................... As the world moves forward into more AI, more and better supervision would seem mandatory. I'm way out of my league when it comes to this. So, I defer to those who can play at that level. Thanks for doing what you do.
Rams
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"Where all the money is" does not include my job description. Telecom and radio is a dying art. (If you know any broadcast engineers, they'll give you a lonnng dissertation...)
I know enough about "Network" to blunder through and do what I do. The security people are the "gurus".
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