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| Presidential Pardons? (Page 6/7) |
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maryjane
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JAN 19, 09:34 AM
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I assume that anyone that is currently against pardons is also firmly against pardoning the many many hundreds of thousands of people that have ILLEGALY entered this country...
here they come again[This message has been edited by maryjane (edited 01-19-2021).]
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theBDub
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JAN 19, 11:43 AM
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| quote | Originally posted by blackrams:
As President Trumps term comes to closure, he is considering pardoning many people convicted of different crimes. Some appear to have been political, some financial and some violent and many other felonies based on what I'm seeing. That's my perspective. Regardless, every President has gone through this and I didn't agree with many of the decisions some Presidents made, some I whole heartedly agreed with.
My question is based on the current threats of some, does the President have the authority to pardon himself from any potential charges he may face in the future and if so, should he?
Obviously, I have my own opinions on this but, thought I'd ask yours.
Rams
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I believe he can pardon for any federal offenses (except in cases of impeachment), even before charges are filed. Pardons must be commissioned before he leaves office, but exercised at any point after their commission.
Given the broad powers outlined, I do believe he has the ability to pardon himself of any crimes committed as of the time he writes the pardon(s). I don't believe it would carry to future crimes, say if he murdered someone two days from now. Should he? I don't believe anyone should be above the law, including the president. I don't think that's how the powers were intended, at all. So no, I don't think he should.
If people disagree with those powers (I certainly do / edit: I certainly disagree with how broad the powers are, including self-pardons), then they should amend the constitution, not just interpret at will.[This message has been edited by theBDub (edited 01-19-2021).]
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blackrams
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JAN 19, 11:51 AM
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| quote | Originally posted by theBDub:
I believe he can pardon for any federal offenses (except in cases of impeachment), even before charges are filed. Pardons must be commissioned before he leaves office, but exercised at any point after their commission.
Given the broad powers outlined, I do believe he has the ability to pardon himself of any crimes committed as of the time he writes the pardon. I don't believe it would carry to future crimes, say if he murdered someone two days from now. Should he? I don't believe anyone should be above the law, including the president. I don't think that's how the powers were intended, at all. So no, I don't think he should.
If people disagree with those powers (I certainly do / edit: I certainly disagree with how broad the powers are, including self-pardons), then they should amend the constitution, not just interpret at will.
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We, you and I are in agreement. Edited: With the exception with the broadness of the powers. The President sits in the most powerful position in the world, I would not advocate limiting his power in pardoning. I may not agree with whom or what he pardons but..........
I am looking forward to see who President Trump issues pardons and commutations to today.
I have not agreed with all pardons ever issued. I see that as second guessing a judge and/or jury. But, I don’t have access to all the Information a President has. Some times a pardon may be the right thing to do. Every situation must be judged on it’s own merits.
Rams[This message has been edited by blackrams (edited 01-19-2021).]
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randye
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JAN 19, 12:35 PM
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| quote | Originally posted by theBDub:
I certainly disagree with how broad the powers are, including self-pardons), then they should amend the constitution, not just interpret at will.
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"They" WHO?
| quote | Originally posted by randye:
The unmitigated ignorance of our Constitution and the most basic precepts of our law displayed in this thread is really sad.
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[This message has been edited by randye (edited 01-19-2021).]
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rinselberg
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JAN 19, 12:47 PM
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I like the idea of a secret pardon. Something I described previously in this thread. Maybe it's (going to become) known as a "pocket pardon."
Here's a tip for Pardons Palooza fans... "Don't sleep on Mike Lindell."
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theBDub
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JAN 19, 01:24 PM
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| quote | Originally posted by randye:
"They" WHO?
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Congress and the states... are you saying you don’t know the constitutional amendment process?[This message has been edited by theBDub (edited 01-19-2021).]
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olejoedad
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JAN 19, 01:44 PM
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| quote | Originally posted by theBDub:
Congress and the states... are you saying you don’t know the constitutional amendment process?
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Only you would think that he doesn't know the process.
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theBDub
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JAN 19, 05:02 PM
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| quote | Originally posted by olejoedad:
Only you would think that he doesn't know the process. |
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Joe, what is Randy saying in his comment to me? Is he suggesting I don’t know the process? What in my comment implies that?
I’d think all of the Americans in this thread are familiar with amending a constitution. I’m not sure what the purpose of his question was.
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theBDub
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JAN 19, 05:08 PM
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| quote | Originally posted by blackrams:
We, you and I are in agreement. Edited: With the exception with the broadness of the powers. The President sits in the most powerful position in the world, I would not advocate limiting his power in pardoning. I may not agree with whom or what he pardons but..........
I am looking forward to see who President Trump issues pardons and commutations to today.
I have not agreed with all pardons ever issued. I see that as second guessing a judge and/or jury. But, I don’t have access to all the Information a President has. Some times a pardon may be the right thing to do. Every situation must be judged on it’s own merits.
Rams
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If I may, I think we probably still are in agreement. I don’t wish to do away with it or greatly limit it, but I might throw a few barriers on it, like self-pardons, pardons for crimes that have no charges, and maybe something around not doing it for personal gain. I do think pardons are useful.
I haven’t kept up with the pardon lists for past presidencies, though I know of a few Trump ones just because everything he does is so heavily scrutinized in the media.
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blackrams
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JAN 19, 05:13 PM
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| quote | Originally posted by theBDub:
If I may, I think we probably still are in agreement. I don’t wish to do away with it or greatly limit it, but I might throw a few barriers on it, like self-pardons, pardons for crimes that have no charges, and maybe something around not doing it for personal gain. I do think pardons are useful.
I haven’t kept up with the pardon lists for past presidencies, though I know of a few Trump ones just because everything he does is so heavily scrutinized in the media. |
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Some things like Self Pardoning can easily be decided at SCOTUS (if that ever occurred), the rest I would have to think about.
Rams
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