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| The Trump Impeachment Proceedings (Page 37/49) |
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rinselberg
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JAN 23, 01:48 PM
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It's Congressman or Representative "Shifty." He's not a Senator. And this is from the same report in Politico that "cliffw" referenced:
| quote | | The apparent mischaracterization, however, does not undercut Democrats' argument that Trump withheld critical military aid to Ukraine as a way to pressure Zelenksy into opening up investigations into the Bidens, including Joe Biden’s son Hunter, who was once a board member on Burisma, a Ukrainian natural gas company. |
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[This message has been edited by rinselberg (edited 01-23-2020).]
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RandomTask
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JAN 23, 02:05 PM
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| quote | Originally posted by cliffw:
The Republicans could not even cross examine Dumb wittnesses and any ones which they could, were cut off is the Dumbs deemed so.
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False.
https://rules.house.gov/sit.../CRPT-116hrpt346.pdf
First, Trump was allowed and invited and allowed to call witnesses. He opted not to. (Page 2)
| quote | | Consistent with House precedent, after the evidence arrived at the Judiciary Committee, the Committee invited President Trump and his counsel to participate in the process. Notably, and unlike past Presidents, President Trump declined to attend any hearings, question any witnesses, or recommend that the Committee call additional witnesses in his defense. |
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Here's transcript where several Republicans (including Cow Nunes and Gym Jordan) asked Witnesses questions:
https://www.npr.org/2019/11...o-the-european-union
But per usual, Trump lied about it, and you're running with that.
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Fats
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JAN 23, 03:37 PM
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| quote | Originally posted by RandomTask:
Here's transcript where several Republicans (including Cow Nunes and Gym Jordan) asked Witnesses questions:
https://www.npr.org/2019/11...o-the-european-union
But per usual, Trump lied about it, and you're running with that.
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I listened to the proceedings as I'm certain you will claim to have done as well. The Republicans would ask simple questions and then Schiff would tell the witness not to answer, or tell them they didn't have to answer time after time. The only questions allowed were the ones the Democrats allowed.
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82-T/A [At Work]
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JAN 23, 10:32 PM
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I have a friend that I discuss politics with from time to time, he is an ardent Bernie Sanders supporter, and truthfully believes Trump is the worst thing to have ever happened to this country... though he has tamed his responses quite a bit. We were discussing the impeachment proceedings, and I could tell he was really frustrated that none of us had really bothered to watch any of it. I was honestly trying not to get him upset, and he didn't get upset, but he seemed at least frustrated that I was both unconcerned and uninterested. He couldn't understand, saying that this affects us all, and it's part of history now that will be studied, etc...
I told him, here's the reality of the situation:
1 - Trump didn't break anyone's trust. There was no scandal, he came right out and forward on what he was being accused of.
2 - Trump did essentially what President Obama had done nearly 6 times during his administration, and President Bush several times as well (withhold aide money allocated by Congress to another Government). At that time, no one batted an eye or said anything.
3 - Trump ended up giving the money to Ukraine anyway, before any of this became an issue... so he didn't actually end up withholding anything.
4 - He's not being accused of any kind of crime for investigating Joe Biden, they are trying to attack him on a technicality for which they see he supposedly violated the act that was passed to prevent presidents from misappropriating money allocated by Congress. And I point you back to point #3, they got their money.
5 - Joe Biden actually committed significant crimes, for which President Trump still has every right to encourage Ukraine to support the investigation into.
6 - Finally, because of everything else that's led up to this... literally everyone recognizes this impeachment trial as an attempt to undo the 2016 election... and at best, it's merely a means for the radical left to "get back" at Trump because they're so angry with all of the policies he's implemented, and the undoing of all of Obama's policies.
With all of these 6 points I mentioned, literally everyone realizes, even Rinse (whether he wants to admit it or not), that this is a sham impeachment, so no one takes it seriously.
My friend then sent me an article talking about how 11 million people watched the opening day of the Senate Impeachment trial. He was so concerned about the fact that I was unconcerned, that he wanted to show me that people were taking it seriously. I read the article... it showed a nearly 3 million decline in viewership from the House impeachment to the Senate impeachment, and those numbers (11 million) were for only the first day. The subsequent day dropped by more than 60%. So you put this into context, with the total US population, less than 3% of the population bothered to watch the first day of the Senate impeachment, and barely 1% is watching currently.
As far as I'm concerned, with 1% viewership, it's obvious that no one cares, and everyone recognizes this for what it's worth... a complete and total joke.
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rinselberg
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JAN 23, 11:12 PM
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If the U.S Department of Justice has received tangible enough evidence to justify the launching of a criminal or corruption investigation into either of the Bidens (Joe, and son Hunter) the investigation should be going forwards at the DOJ--quietly and under wraps, not with public announcements.
The DOJ could discretely, and without publicity, request assistance with such an investigation from their counterparts in the Ukraine. That's the way these things are supposed to proceed.
For all I know, one or both of the Bidens is already under investigation by the DOJ. An investigation that is being kept under wraps, as it should be.
Trump angling for a public announcement from the government of Ukraine, about their launching (or pretending to launch) a new investigation into Burisma--an announcement that would have singled out Hunter Biden by name? That's BULL **** .
He made it impossible for the Democratic-majority in the House of Representatives NOT to impeach him.
He could have been working on the positive messages of his reelection campaign. The economy--as he can frame it. The Southern border wall. Deregulation. Whatever he would want to brag about. But NOOOO... he just had to involve a foreign government, ignoring the obvious risks, leaving his very own fingerprints all over a "smoking" White House telephone, just to angle for some kind of dirt to use against Joe Biden. Angling for some on-air footage that would have been created on CNN, to use against Joe Biden in the Trump reelection campaign. Joe Biden, who is not yet even the Democratic candidate.
The House impeachment managers and everyone that's supporting them have crafted their presentation of the case against the President to near perfection, as a "Show and Tell" kind of exercise.
I can't see him being convicted and removed from office.
So it goes forwards, to the completion of the 2020 national elections in November.[This message has been edited by rinselberg (edited 01-24-2020).]
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blackrams
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JAN 24, 05:02 AM
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| quote | Originally posted by 82-T/A [At Work]:
Rinse... you might very well be the only person who's actually watching this... I'm pretty hard-core with politics, and I haven't even caught a minute of it. Not because of any frustration, but it's just been so silly and ridiculous. |
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I did try to watch the first day, tried again on day two. I actually put off a couple important projects because I see this as an historical event even though, I don't believe any impeachable actions have been shown. I eventually realized I had better things to do. I wondered how many citizens are actually watching this tribunal. As it turns out, the Dems apparently shot their wad early on and the networks carrying the live drama have the lowest viewership of the month.
This tells me, the vast majority of Americans either don't care about what DJT is accused of or, have already made up their minds and have grown tired of the drama.
Rams
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randye
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JAN 24, 06:02 AM
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| quote | Originally posted by 82-T/A [At Work]:
I have a friend that I discuss politics with from time to time,.......
I told him, here's the reality of the situation:
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Leftists don't perceive reality on an objective, factual, analytical basis.
The Left-Right Divide Is About Reality Itself
https://www.dennisprager.co...bout-reality-itself/
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williegoat
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JAN 24, 06:20 AM
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If I thought there was the slightest chance of learning something new, I would watch. How many times can you listen to adults recite "I know you are, but what am I?", before you are forced to slam a shot of ipecac?
No one has deviated from the prepared script, on either side.
And this comes from a self confessed "political junkie". A man who watched all of the 2016 debates from both parties and every single minute of the Kavanaugh hearings.
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williegoat
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JAN 24, 06:30 AM
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This is an interesting article: Laura Ingraham shows emails tying alleged Ukraine whistleblower to Obama White House meeting on Burisma
| quote | | Fox News host Laura Ingraham reported Wednesday evening that she obtained a chain of State Department emails stemming from a standard request for comment from New York Times journalist Ken Vogel, whose reporting helped generate scrutiny of Hunter Biden's ties to Ukrainian gas company Burisma. Hunter Biden, 49, is the son of Democratic presidential front-runner Joe Biden, and Republicans have called for him to testify during the Ukraine-related Senate impeachment trial against President Trump. |
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I don't generally like to post single source, unverified claims; but this looks pretty solid. We will see.
Another interesting article: Rudy Giuliani threatens to go public with Biden corruption allegations
| quote | | “Everything I tried to tell the press last March is now coming out, and more. I will now start to reveal the evidence directly to you, the People,” the former New York mayor tweeted. “The Biden Family Enterprise made millions by selling public office. Then when Joe was Obama’s Point Man, they ALL made millions.” |
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This story is being reported by multiple outlets and the source is Giuliani. Show us what you got, Rudy. Put up, or shut up.[This message has been edited by williegoat (edited 01-24-2020).]
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82-T/A [At Work]
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JAN 24, 09:16 AM
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| quote | Originally posted by rinselberg:
The DOJ could discretely, and without publicity, request assistance with such an investigation from their counterparts in the Ukraine. That's the way these things are supposed to proceed.
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As I had said before, I haven't really been paying attention. But if I'm not mistaken, that's exactly what was happening. It only came to light because they forced all this information into house impeachment...
| quote | Originally posted by blackrams:
As it turns out, the Dems apparently shot their wad early on and the networks carrying the live drama have the lowest viewership of the month.
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If I sit here and think for a minute, I have to assume the feeling that's going through the employees of these news stations, must be the same feeling that my friend is having... and that is, he cannot understand why no one cares, when in fact this is something he so deeply cares about.
As Randye said... these people aren't living in reality. So their confusion and frustration is built upon their own fallacy that others are not embracing.
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