Job opportunity versus enjoying what you do. (Page 2/4)
TheDigitalAlchemist NOV 22, 12:32 PM

quote
Originally posted by blackrams:

This is obviously a decision one has to make based on their individual goals.


One thing to remember is, if there's ever a leaning of the workforce, the workers will normally be last on the list to go. Mid-Level and higher are frequently the first to go.

Rams




I have watched 8 sets of managers get fired during my career at different places. I have watched 3 sets of support staff get let go. see whole departments get the boot. Was laid off twice due to the whole company folding or downsizing. but mostly, I've seen groups/teams of managers get let go when there is a merger...
fieroguru NOV 22, 08:04 PM
Through my career, I have bounced back and forth between engineering and management.

The management side has provided the $$$, but in some of the roles I wasn't allowed to scratch my engineering itch. This is why my Fiero hobby grew to the point of becoming a hobby business. It was my creative outlet when my day job wasn't intellectually challenging.

I am currently back in an Engineering Manager role and while I have several engineers reporting to me, I also take on some projects myself because I enjoy the work. It is nice being able to pick and choose which projects to focus on vs. which ones to delegate and support.

So basically, I followed the money, but still needed my engineering outlet. Sometimes that was accomplished through work, sometimes it was accomplished outside of my day job.
82-T/A [At Work] NOV 22, 09:26 PM

quote
Originally posted by Jake_Dragon:

I have been working in IT for 25 years now. Its been a rewarding career just not always as lucrative as I would have liked.
Transitioning to management I do not get that same reward. There are perks and the money is nice but end of the day I have always been an engineer. I do enjoy working with the team and passing on what knowledge I have gathered in those 25 years. But some days its just not the same.
My management want me to start taking a broader role in the organization. But 100% that will be the end of my technical support role and will move me into managing the technicians that now fill those roles and appoint leads to fill my current role.
Its a great opportunity, I do enjoy the work but I miss getting my hands dirty and fixing things.

I'm already 80% in the role now, not much of a path back to where I was.

I know some of you have had to make the same choice, just looking for some like minded people and perhaps some positive feedback.




I made that leap a few years ago already. You CAN go back, it just takes significantly more effort to do so since you end up behind the technical curve. As a manager, you're able to rely on the experience you've gained from all those years... but if you don't make a concerted effort on your own time to keep pace with the latest and greatest, your technical knowledge will get stale.

But, there's nothing wrong with it... another member on here once told me...

"Would you rather be Todd that tries to do everything, or would you rather manage a bunch of Todds and help guide them to successfully do more than you can by yourself?"


I obviously don't look at my employees as Todds, haha... but it was a good point.
blackrams NOV 22, 10:40 PM

quote
Originally posted by Jake_Dragon:


We have been through some managers. That is a fact I am very aware of



As I said previously, I've spent most of my career in management after leaving the military. I've seen the biggest turnover in lower and middle management although, I never worked in any AI or Computer Tech positions. When dollars are in short supply, senior managers generally look to where they can save money and then normally turn to reducing the lower management first followed by middle management while promoting others at lower paying salaries and then spreading the load of 5 or 6 positions to 3 lower new managers. Have seen it several times. Luckily, I survive all but one of those cost saving moves.

If I really wanted more money, then I'd shop my skills and services out to other opportunities. But, I'll say this, the happiest I ever was in a job was when I was in charge. I liked being the person responsible for failure or success. 99% of the time it was success. Not everyone is cut out to be "in charge" and not all managers can relate to what it's like not being in charge. I've filled both positions.

My recommendation is, do what's best for your family. Seems like that always worked best for me.

Rams

[This message has been edited by blackrams (edited 11-22-2024).]

Jake_Dragon NOV 23, 11:48 AM
I appreciate everyone that took a few minutes to post, this is some good feedback.
Raydar NOV 24, 12:39 PM
I have never been in any sort of management/supervisory position. Never really wanted to.
I enjoy my "hands on / nuts 'n' bolts" work. I like to solve technical problems and fix stuff.
I even moved out of some tech roles because everything was scripted. It was automated and dumbed down to the point that I didn't even have to think. Got boring, really quickly.
It's why I left desktop support and went back to telecom.

In my last job (basically a NOC, on steroids) we did everything - mostly by remote control.
Transport - basically fiber optics, telecom, SCADA and smart-metering, and other circuit stuff; Network - routers and switches, etc; Systems - Windows and Unix servers; and Mainframe.
If we couldn't fix it remotely, we would open a ticket and send it to the appropriate group.

We used to kid our team leads, and especially the supervisors, that they had "sh!t magnet" jobs. (They got to deal with all the flack, when something big broke.)
It was pretty thankless work, even though it was 1-2 pay grades above where we "worker drones" were.
People usually used those jobs for stepping stones to other positions, outside our group.
Zeb NOV 29, 09:43 AM
If you make the upgrade, can you back out gracefully? That's an unusual request to make of the guy promoting you. BUT, if it doesn't work out, from your perspective or his, can you go back where you came from? Or is The Door the only exit?

How will this look from a retirement planning perspective? A lot of the guys here, myself most of all, won't be working much longer. What will this job do to your retirement savings? SSI income rating? If you don't like the work, can you stick it out for the money? Five years you can do. Twenty years? Not so much.

Will you have the authority to do what you deem best in this management role? Or will you be restricted by corporate policy, upper management, or budgets? You may have great ideas for Your Department and Your People, but if you can't DO any of them, and just spend the days shuffling paper and babysitting workers, you'll be miserable.

If The Worst happens, and you don't work out in the new position, or aren't deemed a "Team Player" any longer in your old one, what's the job market in your area? Some times, the best job is with another company.
Jake_Dragon DEC 04, 06:36 PM
Well this didn't age very well...

For the record. I have been a supervisor twice at other jobs. Lead technician and team lead as well.
My current organization I joined as a SR Supervisor then they screwed us on our job titles. Long story not the point.

So when I was offered a supervisor position I was told that it would be a working position and I would more or less be managing 12 techs. All well and good, it was the best of a situation that could go very wrong. But at least I wasn't facing pay cuts.
Then I started to see the back end of things, but I thought I could help make things better and did my best. That worked for a while, there were a few growing pains as I had the time to address some issue. Some of the team did not like that.
Its ok everyone hates the boss.

Then I was told that they were doing away with the supervisor position and I was being promoted to manager but nothing else would change. First red flag.
Then I had to put someone on an improvement program. 3 times but that's also another story.
So it was challenging. Dealing with adults that act like children.

At the end of last year I lost 2 people one retired and one had to resign due to an illness. Then in January the RIF happened, the person that had performance issues was let go. They wanted to let one more go but I talked them out of it.
So down to 9 people. Still have a couple of techs that need to do better but ok we can work on it. Let them know that they need to improve ticket metrics. Pay more attention to SLA and lets not give management a reason to reduce the team even more.

Then then our director was fired, bolt of lightning kind of let go. This shook the team as most of them had worked for the director for years. But they must have been planning this as they already had a new director ready to step in. Second red flag
Then the Sr Manager I reported to gave his notice and I was left as the only stop between the bull **** that always comes down from the top. Third red flag
I was reassigned to report to a new Sr Manager, ok good with that. The first week he threatened to fire everyone on the team and replace them. I yelled back, we yelled some more and came to an understanding. I thought everything was good. Forth red flag?

Seems some of the team see this as an opportunity. We are already planning on getting rid of one more of the team due to performance and I assume at some point I will have to update my resume.
Manager does look nice on a resume so there is that.
**** you and have a nice day.
Jake_Dragon DEC 04, 10:26 PM
It was a rough day.
RWDPLZ DEC 04, 11:25 PM
Start looking for a new job now, that company is going down in flames.

Verbal promises that never materialize
'promotions' with increases in title and doubling workload, and no increase in pay
Firings that are not backfilled, forcing the remaining workers to work harder to take up the slack
KPI's (key performance indicators) being increased under more stressful conditions
Director fired to serve as an 'example' and instill fear
New manager installed to further the fear and increase productivity

Your best performers are going to leave because they're sick of the crap, leaving you in even worse shape, also likely not to be replaced.

I guarantee you in January, the head honcho is pulling up in **insert new sports car here** or some other showy form of spending.

Evil is the new normal. Hopefully Brian Thompson's death is the first of many.