Is Social Justice a disease? (Page 2/21)
theBDub JAN 07, 09:12 PM

quote
Originally posted by maryjane:


Why, is that even an issue?
Is it 'written' anywhere, that in private or public owned business, the overall population demographics of this or any other nation has a damn thing to do with who is 'in charge' of those businesses?




Like I said, it’s not an issue in itself. It’s just an issue when it results in a perpetuation of it without warrant. In other words, White people being promoted beyond what pure skills/experience would suggest. In other words... racism.

It’s only an issue when it’s a symptom of hurting others for their race (consciously or unconsciously).
randye JAN 08, 12:38 AM

quote
Originally posted by theBDub:


Like I said, it’s not an issue in itself. It’s just an issue when it results in a perpetuation of it without warrant. In other words, White people being promoted beyond what pure skills/experience would suggest. In other words... racism.

It’s only an issue when it’s a symptom of hurting others for their race (consciously or unconsciously).



But as you said earlier in this thread, you're ok with hurting white people in deference to other races which is the very definition of RACISM.

You just don't choose to, or cannot, see your own racism for what it is.

Of course, taken as a whole, nearly all of what you have said so far has the stench of racism about it since YOU are the one separating people on the basis of skin color with your arbitrary "options"


quote
Originally posted by theBDub:

Those are basically the only four options. So you really just have to pick the best one.

.



By the way, any time someone like you says "These are the only options...Pick one" that is an immediate red flag for any rational individual possessed of critical thinking skills and is also one of the reasons that I remind people to NEVER allow a Leftist to frame an argument or question.

[This message has been edited by randye (edited 01-08-2021).]

theBDub JAN 08, 07:57 AM

quote
Originally posted by randye:


But as you said earlier in this thread, you're ok with hurting white people in deference to other races which is the very definition of RACISM.

You just don't choose to, or cannot, see your own racism for what it is.

Of course, taken as a whole, nearly all of what you have said so far has the stench of racism about it since YOU are the one separating people on the basis of skin color with your arbitrary "options"




Randy, I said exactly that... that’s why I said it’s a sticky issue. Lower the hate blinders for a second. I’m not calling for reparations. I’m just very simply explaining the issue.

If you do nothing, it is racist.
If you do something, it is racist.

You have options in there, with various degrees of racism. You basically have to pick the shiniest turd. It’s not an ideal situation.

Edit: and I’m still not a leftist. I just work relatively high up in Corporate America, where Social Justice is extremely relevant.

[This message has been edited by theBDub (edited 01-08-2021).]

sourmash JAN 08, 08:23 AM
Social Justice is not a disease. It's a con.

First you create special interest/minority groups by definition.
Second you give them protections above non-protected groups.
Third you create a "Social Justice" directive to use the first two positions to dispossess the majority by multi-pronged approach. You give preferential treatment in regards to hiring, education allotments, and use tax revenue to promote the social justice directive.

It's a means to overthrow a society which ultimately puts society in servitude.
blackrams JAN 08, 08:36 AM
For some reason, this discussion made me think of the television show "The Voice". Where judges listen to singers but can't see them until they turn around.
Those judges still select who they want based on their own qualifiers. I would think that a qualifier would be things subject only to talent and possibly range of voice although I'm not qualified to really suggest anything within the music world, I only know what I like.

Even if management promotions or hirings were done in a similar manner, the interviewee must convince the "judges" they have the knowledge, skills, personality and talents. There is no doubt that it's not only what you know but who you know in life that helps one get ahead, I won't deny that but, I also firmly believe that where there is the will, there is a way for the individual to get ahead. I know that in my own hiring and promotion practices, the only thing I really cared about was could the person do the job successfully. But, I also recognize that every person I promoted eventually came into what is known as the "Peter Principle". That same principle applies to myself.

Rams

[This message has been edited by blackrams (edited 01-08-2021).]

sourmash JAN 08, 09:00 AM
We all know government positions have to be posted so all candidates can apply and be considered. Most of us are probably aware that these positions get created when they already have a candidate selected for the position and the posting is already circumvented when it's created. When I was a kid my mom made someone angry for not applying after the created the listing for her.

We know a child car worker who was also baby sat after hours for an officer at a quasi-government power generator (the female exec made 400k per year). So the baby sitter was going to move to take a higher paying job but the exec created a new position at the power generating company with high enough salary so she'd stay and keep baby sitting her children too. Job was posted and given to the baby sitter.

I agree with your premise. Shows like The Voice, the goal is to create revenue for the production, not to select the best candidate. So it's all scripted generate dollars. And the contestants can't have wrong think either.

There's also inside corruption inherit to the process.
She obviously was banging the producer. Look at her selling it afterwards as if it wasn't a fix.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oOb2QbShMpU
maryjane JAN 08, 09:08 AM

quote
Originally posted by theBDub:


Randy, I said exactly that... that’s why I said it’s a sticky issue. Lower the hate blinders for a second. I’m not calling for reparations. I’m just very simply explaining the issue.

If you do nothing, it is racist.
If you do something, it is racist.

You have options in there, with various degrees of racism. You basically have to pick the shiniest turd. It’s not an ideal situation.

Edit: and I’m still not a leftist. I just work relatively high up in Corporate America, where Social Justice is extremely relevant.




From racist to elitist.... ?

If one does believe in social justice, then it's just as relevant among the working class as it is up in the ivory towers.
theBDub JAN 08, 09:10 AM

quote
Originally posted by blackrams:

For some reason, this discussion made me think of the television show "The Voice". Where judges listen to singers but can't see them until they turn around.
Those judges still select who they want based on their own qualifiers. I would think that a qualifier would be things subject only to talent and possibly range of voice although I'm not qualified to really suggest anything within the music world, I only know what I like.

Even if management promotions or hirings were done in a similar manner, the interviewee must convince the "judges" they have the knowledge, skills, personality and talents. There is no doubt that it's not only what you know but who you know in life that helps one get ahead, I won't deny that but, I also firmly believe that where there is the will, there is a way for the individual to get ahead. I know that in my own hiring and promotion practices, the only thing I really cared about was could the person do the job successfully. But, I also recognize that every person I promoted eventually came into what is known as the "Peter Principle". That same principle applies to myself.

Rams




This would be good, and I agree with this. When implemented, including removing names (because names like “Devonta” and “Brayden” give away the respective race), it’s close to equal.

The issue is that it’s hard to implement, including in-person interviews. We see that when anonymized, BIPOC are hired near equal to White people. But when not, White people are overrepresented in hiring. Those same hiring managers believe themselves to be unbiased. And I think that’s really what the “issue” is and what Social Justice tries to resolve.
theBDub JAN 08, 09:13 AM

quote
Originally posted by maryjane:


From racist to elitist.... ?

If one does believe in social justice, then it's just as relevant among the working class as it is up in the ivory towers.



Due to where I sit, I have had to learn a lot about this. It structures a company’s goals and HR approach. Of course it is relevant to everyone, but not everyone has had to have so much training. Don’t mistake my comment.
2.5 JAN 08, 09:19 AM

quote
Originally posted by randye:

Of course, taken as a whole, nearly all of what you have said so far has the stench of racism about it since YOU are the one separating people on the basis of skin color with your arbitrary "options"




Sadly these arent his ideas, these are what is taught and what is currently being implemented in many jobs.