Cancel Culture Takes Out Dr Seuss, Sort Of (Page 12/12)
82-T/A [At Work] APR 03, 01:09 PM

quote
Originally posted by theBDub:


Think about the opposite of what you are suggesting.

Should Disney be required to continue selling copies of Song of the South?

Should old racist toys be required to be sold? How about books that teach about “n*****s” as less than? Do we require all books that have ever been published to continue to be published?

If we aren’t allowed to self-censorship, what right to our own speech do we have? If we aren’t allowed to look on our past word choice, opinions, products, etc. and determine they don’t reflect us today, then how can we even make good decisions today?

These books weren’t outlawed, they were determined by the owner to not be worth publishing anymore. Remember: Everyone upset about this is upset about a private company making a private decision. If I hadn’t come to expect this, I’d call it shocking. But here we are.




I think you're looking at this from a perspective different than others. I don't think anyone is saying that they should be FORCED to sell books that are distasteful or (whatever)... but there are a lot of books that are still currently being published that you can buy that would be considered distasteful.

Mein Kampf, by Hitler... for example, is a book that you can currently purchase off Amazon. I own a copy of it. Hopefully that isn't a shock to anyone. I am not anti-Semitic, and that shouldn't even need to be explained. My wife is Jewish, and I certainly do not support Socialism, let alone the National Socialist Workers Party. But I bought it because of history and wanting to understand what drove someone to do what they did. I have a lot of books that are distasteful, and some books that are very tasteful.

I think, with Dr. Seuss, for example... if there was something they found offensive, why not just change the artwork they felt was improper? Why is the Land-O-Lakes butter considered bigoted? Have any native American tribes complained?

The problem I have is that the overwhelming vast majority of "CHANGE" that is being made... is not done because some specific group is offended. It's being done entirely by young white Millennial progressives who believe that their intellect is superior, and that blacks, Hispanics, and native Americans are too stupid, weak, and victimized to have their own voice... so the white "intellectuals" need to be the voice for them.

Another great example is Florida State University. They have a guy who dresses up as a native American on a horse with feathers...and rides around. Their logo is a tomahawk, and also a native American head with feathers.



Sometimes the guy dressing up as the Indian is actually a white guy, sometimes it's an actual native American. Seeing this is extremely triggering to a white Millennial, and there have been huge movements to try to change it. No one bothered to ask the Seminole INDIANS about this. Finally, the Seminole Indian Tribe finally started combating the young uninformed white liberal, and has put out numerous statements that the tribe leadership is VERY proud of FSU's heritage, name, and branding, and they fully stand behind it.

I also put INDIAN in all caps because white liberals have also stated that the term Indian is offensive. In most "liberal" states, there's no such thing as native Americans. I actually never saw a native American until I actually moved to Florida. The native Americans (because of white liberals) pushed the native Americans to the central and southern states. So they never actually bother to ask them. "native American" is a term that was given to them by white liberals because Indian was deemed offensive.

In Florida, there are several native American tribes, and they all refer to themselves as Indians:

- Miccosukee Indian Village: https://village.miccosukee.com/
- Seminole Okalee Indian Village: https://www.semtribe.com/stof


I'm just really, really tired of the "woke" movement... none of it has anything to do with making the world a better place... it's all done entirely for a political agenda.

The reality is... racism and bigotry is almost exclusively a leftist idea:
- KKK: Founded by Democrat party leadership.
- Jim Crowe: Was a Democrat
- Eugenics: A "science" created by Margaret Sanger, a Democrat, to eliminate blacks.
- Planned Parenthood: Created also by Margaret Sanger, a Democrat, to sterilize and abort black babies. Purposely placed in predominantly black and Hispanic neighborhoods.
- Internment Camps: Created by Democrat leadership and used to house Asians (primarily Japanese) in camps.
- Confederacy: All Democrats
- Anti Gay Legislation: The most anti-gay legislation ever passed in the history of America was during the election of President Obama in 2008
- Segregation: pushed ONLY by Democrats
- Trail of Tears...

I'm not even beginning to scratch the surface.


Alternately, nearly every ACTUAL civil rights act was passed by either a majority Republican congress / senate, or by Republican presidents through executive action.

None of what the radical left does right now has anything to do with helping people. It has everything to do with pitting people against each other so they can better CONTROL different groups, and enslave groups by making them permanent victims, and dependent upon the Government. Every single law that Democrats propose or pass makes people dependent upon the government, and never seeks to actually solve a problem, just make it worse.

[This message has been edited by 82-T/A [At Work] (edited 04-03-2021).]

maryjane APR 03, 02:08 PM
'Cowboy' is now a racist term too.

"'Cowboy' was a derogatory term used to describe slaves that tended to the cows and horses."

"“The term ‘cowboy’ evokes the play time—the racist play time—of cowboys and Indians, right?”"

[This message has been edited by maryjane (edited 04-03-2021).]

rinselberg APR 03, 04:55 PM

quote
Originally posted by 82-T/A [At Work]:
I think, with Dr. Seuss, for example... if there was something they found offensive, why not just change the artwork they felt was improper?


I think I remember reading about an effort (posthumously, with respect to Theodor Seuss Geisel) to change some of the artwork. But the consensus among the movers and shakers at Dr Seuss Enterprises was that they did not think that they could do it in a way that would have preserved the coherence of the books as they were created by Theodor Seuss Geisel, who died in 1991.

It's something to "drill down on" for anyone who is really, really into this story.

My takeaway from what I remember having read is that the ideas, in terms of how to revise some of the artwork, were deemed as about as efficacious as the metaphorical application of Lipstick to a Pig.

It's only six of the more than sixty Dr Seuss titles that have been discontinued, of which four are fairly obscure and the other two, better known but not at the very top of anyone's list of the most popular Dr Seuss books in the catalog.

[This message has been edited by rinselberg (edited 04-03-2021).]

jdv APR 03, 11:47 PM
Was this one of the books
sourmash APR 04, 02:54 AM
Ah yes, a new classic.
Good one.
cliffw APR 04, 09:28 AM

quote
Originally posted by rinselberg:
I think I remember reading about an effort (posthumously, with respect to Theodor Seuss Geisel) to change some of the artwork. But the consensus among the movers and shakers at Dr Seuss Enterprises was that they did not think that they could do it in a way that would have preserved the coherence of the books as they were created by Theodor Seuss Geisel, who died in 1991.

My takeaway from what I remember having read is that the ideas, in terms of how to revise some of the artwork, were deemed as about as efficacious as the metaphorical application of Lipstick to a Pig.

It's something to "drill down on" for anyone who is really, really into this story.



Drill baby drill !

My guess is that you did not read any of the Dr Seuss canceled cultured books. The art work did not depict what the social justice warriors think Dr Seuss conveyed. Why were Dr Seuss's words attacked ?
theBDub APR 04, 09:41 AM

quote
Originally posted by 82-T/A [At Work]:
I think you're looking at this from a perspective different than others. I don't think anyone is saying that they should be FORCED to sell books that are distasteful or (whatever)... but there are a lot of books that are still currently being published that you can buy that would be considered distasteful.

Mein Kampf, by Hitler... for example, is a book that you can currently purchase off Amazon. I own a copy of it. Hopefully that isn't a shock to anyone. I am not anti-Semitic, and that shouldn't even need to be explained. My wife is Jewish, and I certainly do not support Socialism, let alone the National Socialist Workers Party. But I bought it because of history and wanting to understand what drove someone to do what they did. I have a lot of books that are distasteful, and some books that are very tasteful.




Agreed, and I also have Mein Kampf on my Kindle. I’ll admit, I don’t remember if I’ve read it or not. That is available for free and in the public domain though, right? At least in some countries.

I don’t believe in government censorship and understand the value of preserving history “as written” (ha) and not as desired.



quote
Originally posted by 82-T/A [At Work]:


I think, with Dr. Seuss, for example... if there was something they found offensive, why not just change the artwork they felt was improper? Why is the Land-O-Lakes butter considered bigoted? Have any native American tribes complained?

The problem I have is that the overwhelming vast majority of "CHANGE" that is being made... is not done because some specific group is offended. It's being done entirely by young white Millennial progressives who believe that their intellect is superior, and that blacks, Hispanics, and native Americans are too stupid, weak, and victimized to have their own voice... so the white "intellectuals" need to be the voice for them.

Another great example is Florida State University. They have a guy who dresses up as a native American on a horse with feathers...and rides around. Their logo is a tomahawk, and also a native American head with feathers.



Sometimes the guy dressing up as the Indian is actually a white guy, sometimes it's an actual native American. Seeing this is extremely triggering to a white Millennial, and there have been huge movements to try to change it. No one bothered to ask the Seminole INDIANS about this. Finally, the Seminole Indian Tribe finally started combating the young uninformed white liberal, and has put out numerous statements that the tribe leadership is VERY proud of FSU's heritage, name, and branding, and they fully stand behind it.

I also put INDIAN in all caps because white liberals have also stated that the term Indian is offensive. In most "liberal" states, there's no such thing as native Americans. I actually never saw a native American until I actually moved to Florida. The native Americans (because of white liberals) pushed the native Americans to the central and southern states. So they never actually bother to ask them. "native American" is a term that was given to them by white liberals because Indian was deemed offensive.

In Florida, there are several native American tribes, and they all refer to themselves as Indians:

- Miccosukee Indian Village: https://village.miccosukee.com/
- Seminole Okalee Indian Village: https://www.semtribe.com/stof




I can proverbially share a beer over the annoyance of overreactions by people with “white guilt.” Ultimately, though, this is just that family/company making their own decisions about their own legacies. There was a ton of uproar about this on the right (at least on my Facebook), and I couldn’t help but feel like they were really missing the first sentence of the story—that this wasn’t “cancel culture,” it was just someone choosing to not publish their property.

Once this property enters the public domain, it can be published again.
rinselberg APR 04, 05:40 PM

quote
Originally posted by cliffw:
My guess is that you [rinselberg] did not read any of the Dr Seuss canceled cultured books. The art work did not depict what the social justice warriors think Dr Seuss conveyed. Why were Dr Seuss's words attacked?


I don't know if Dr Seuss's words [as distinct from his drawings] were condemned by the "social justice warriors" that cliffw is decrying.

I said that some consideration was given to changing some of the artwork before the idea was discarded.

Mr "cliffw" is subjecting my remark to a "tortuous" interpretation to make it confess to allegations that my remark was not intended to convey.

His guess about my not having read the books is spot on. I didn't read the books. Certainly not at any recent time, for sure.

This is a ti(a)t--a tempest in (a) teapot.

Do the people that are "worked up" about the discontinuation of the Dr Seuss books--just 6 of more than 60--think that the Republican Party should be a political party that is focused on governance, or do they think that the Republican Party's full time and fully compensated staffers, representatives and elected officials would be better served (and better serving) to abandon politics and governance altogether and take up residence in the nation's art and literary-focused institutions? Our libraries, publishing houses and museums. Our colleges and universities. Our top shelf literary and cultural magazines, like The Atlantic and Vanity Fair. (Although those are two that also do politics.)

I don't know if there's going to be a Presidential Library for Donald J. Trump--it seems like an oxymoron to have a Presidential Library to commemorate the nation's most functionally illiterate President--but if there were a Donald J. Trump Presidential Library, it would be a great place to have the Dr Seuss books. All of the Dr Seuss books, including the six titles that were just discontinued. That could be in the Melania Trump area, because of her interest in children. Her "Be Best" initiative.

The question then becomes--would that be the entire library? I guess there could be all of the more recent books that have been written about President Trump, starting with "Fire and Fury" and running the gamut to "A Very Stable Genius" and "Fear: Trump in the White House."

I've imagined the Donald J. Trump Presidential Library as a popup venue that could roam the country.

[This message has been edited by rinselberg (edited 04-05-2021).]

cliffw MAY 04, 09:09 AM
Who is next on the "Cancel Culture" chopping block ?

"Snow White," "Cinderella," and "Sleeping Beauty".

NOT ALL WHITE Snow White may be CANCELED as Disneyland ride sparks fury over non-consensual ‘true love’s kiss’ while she was asleep.

Talk about white privilege, masculine male toxicity.

Cinderella' production canceled over concerns the cast is too white


quote

Chanhassen Dinner Theatres in Minnesota has now decided to scrap the project altogether and will instead turn to producing Footloose in 2022.



Really, ? I saw Footloose. I don't remember one person of color in it.
sourmash MAY 04, 12:07 PM
Cancel culture is death to a society. It's mob rule. And a wise, but now gone gnome, once warned us about listening to the mob.