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| Blooze Own: An F355 Six Speed N* Build Thread (Page 98/126) |
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Bloozberry
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MAR 03, 07:10 AM
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| quote | Originally posted by fierogt28:
Once your finished mocking up the engine, suspension, (front and rear) interior, underneath, etc. Will you be dipping this frame or painting all black and use sealer in the joints like factory cars are done?? |
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Thanks fierogt28! I don't have the means locally to "dip" the frame, so it'll be seam sealed and painted. I haven't decided what colour it's going to be yet but probably a metallic gray.
| quote | Originally posted by Diamond Dave:
...it looked like the tranny mounted right up. Is this at least a right assumption? |
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First, thanks for the shower of compliments Dave.  I hope you decide to stuff that Enterra's engine bay with a Northstar... it'll be a killer!  To get to some of your questions, the F40 six speed does indeed have the same bell housing bolt pattern as the Northstar except for one bolt, which I made an adapter for. The other thing of course is that you have to notch one of the bell housing's internal webs to clear the Northstar starter. Otherwise it just bolts up.
| quote | Originally posted by Diamond Dave:
Just read back a couple of posts and saw your post stating you hadn't worked out clutch, flywheel, and axels. |
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True, but these are simple problems to sort out... there are many people who have come up with various solutions to these issues right here on PFF. The plan for the axles is to use the inner tripot joints and axle from one car, and the outer CV joints from the Fiero. Since the number of splines for the CV joint won't likely mate up with the Fiero CV joint, the trick is to find a car with axles that are long enough to have them shortened and re-splined for the Fiero CV joints. That's what I'm researching now.
As for the clutch and flywheel, several guys have also worked out good solutions including Fieroguru who mated an F40 to an LS engine (he had a completely new flywheel of his own design machined from billet), and there's Zac88GT who used an off-the-shelf Spec flywheel and made a billet aluminum spacer plate with an aftermarket steel facing bolted to it. The choices are out there.
I've run out of time to answer your question about available off-the-shelf suspensions, but will post my opinions later.
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Diamond Dave
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MAR 03, 10:38 PM
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Thanks so much for your input Blooze. It really means alot to me. I have been on track to use the N* for awhile now. Allen at chrfab pretty much helped me to stay with my dream of the N*. You and Will have solidified it. Just want to do it right. Thanks again buddy.
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jb1
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MAR 07, 03:50 AM
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| quote | Originally posted by Bloozberry:
True, but these are simple problems to sort out... there are many people who have come up with various solutions to these issues right here on PFF. The plan for the axles is to use the inner tripot joints and axle from one car, and the outer CV joints from the Fiero. Since the number of splines for the CV joint won't likely mate up with the Fiero CV joint, the trick is to find a car with axles that are long enough to have them shortened and re-splined for the Fiero CV joints. That's what I'm researching now.
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Do you have axles that are the correct length? reason I ask is on my 4t80e the original builder of the car use a caddy axle on one side and smaller fiero axle on the other, with having new caddy axles and joints I could swap the parts in pic between the two different axles The cage and bearings fit both of these ,one just had a larger inner diameter to fit the larger axle but still fit the outer fiero joint fine. so I could use the smaller or larger diameter axles with the same fiero joints if I wanted. Might be worth a try if you have the outer joints that fit the axles, you could see if it would fit into the fiero outer joint.
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87GTseries 1 3800sc (7.597 @88.53 1.579 60ft)
(series II swap in progress)
85GT Northstar/ 4t80e
86GT 3800 n/a
Northstar Rebuild[This message has been edited by jb1 (edited 03-07-2014).]
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Will
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MAR 07, 08:12 AM
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| quote | Originally posted by jb1:
Do you have axles that are the correct length? reason I ask is on my 4t80e the original builder of the car use a caddy axle on one side and smaller fiero axle on the other, with having new caddy axles and joints I could swap the parts in pic between the two different axles The cage and bearings fit both of these ,one just had a larger inner diameter to fit the larger axle but still fit the outer fiero joint fine. so I could use the smaller or larger diameter axles with the same fiero joints if I wanted. Might be worth a try if you have the outer joints that fit the axles, you could see if it would fit into the fiero outer joint.
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My understanding regarding F40 axles is that the G6 axles including the center component of the outer CV joint will fit the Fiero outer CV joint "cups".
However, Blooze's car has a widened track, so he may or may not be able to use shelf axles from anything, just depending on what's available.
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fieroguru
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MAR 07, 10:59 AM
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| quote | Originally posted by Will:
My understanding regarding F40 axles is that the G6 axles including the center component of the outer CV joint will fit the Fiero outer CV joint "cups".
However, Blooze's car has a widened track, so he may or may not be able to use shelf axles from anything, just depending on what's available. |
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The "star" portion from the G6 axles does indeed fit inside the Fiero Manual outer CV housing.
I think the wider track may actually help him find axles... at least on the driver side. I haven't looked at the F40 axle options in a few years, but there are more applications using the 27 spline for the transmission output now.
Looking good as always Blooze![This message has been edited by fieroguru (edited 03-07-2014).]
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Will
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MAR 11, 09:58 AM
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I guess I need to do mre research about what the various families of CV joints are.
As I have the A-body large hub carriers on my car, I have the larger pattern outer CV's. I @$$ume that these take the same "star" as the small pattern CV's, as they both accept the same axle shafts and the weak point of the small pattern joints is the hub spline.
However, I don't know about potential interchangeability with the XL pattern joints from a U-body van or W-body car... or maybe even Corvette.
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Bloozberry
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MAR 13, 05:56 PM
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 What a frustrating and mind-boggling experience it was to research the compatibility of various axles, CV joints, and tripot joints to fit my car. I literally spent 12 hours reading through all the F40 threads here on PFF, the Cobalt SS forum, and combing through hundreds of pages on the "interparts.com" web site trying to find specific, unambiguous information about what I need to mate the F40 to the Fiero rear bearing. Don't get me wrong, there's tons of information out there but the lack of specific language to identify exactly what part is being referred to makes it impossible to follow most of the threads. And apparently I'm not alone in my frustration based on the number of posts in F40 threads, where confusion reigns. (This isn't an invitation for anyone to clutter my thread with pseudo-explanations either!)
Perhaps the reason for the confusion is that there are at least 14 variables that come into play for each axle assembly:
a. the spline count and diameter of the tripot spindle;
b. the spline count and diameter of the tripot inner spider assembly;
c. the spline count, diameter, and length of the axle rod;
d. the spline count and diameter of the CV joint spider assembly;
e. the spline count, diameter, and length of the CV joint spindle; and
f. the spline count and diameter of the wheel bearing assembly.
I gave up trying to piece various parts together when I couldn't find any specific information about bare axle rods, and when I realized that none of the complete axle assemblies that fit the F40 would be long enough for either side of my widened track. I also had a "Eureka!" moment when I ran across Zac88GT's build thread (he comes through again):
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"The axles and intermediate shaft that I'm using (in my [Northstar] Fiero V8 swap) came from a 2005 Cobalt SS with the supercharged engine. The driver's side and passenger side axles are identical. I made my axle [rods] from a single Fiero axle [since the Cobalt SS axle rods were too short for my car]. The original Getrag passenger side axle is long enough that both new shafts can be made out of this one piece and the diameter is sufficient enough to re-machine splines on for the cobalt inner cv tripot. The axles turned out beautifully and it only cost $190 to get them both re-splined. My axles are holding up just fine and my motor is producing about 390hp and 365 ftlbs of torque at the flywheel." |
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So, for $155 for a new (not reman) Cobalt SS axle assembly, I can replace the axle rod with a Fiero manual transmission passenger side axle cut to whatever length I want (can't use an automatic transmission axle because they're smaller dia), have the tripot end of the rod re-splined to fit the Cobalt SS tripot spider assembly, and be done with it for a total of about $250 per axle assembly. It'll also be stronger than the Cobalt SS axle since it's about 0.100" thicker. That's all I needed to know to order my Cobalt SS axle assemblies today... they'll be here tomorrow.
In the mean time, I needed to extract some long Fiero axle rods from a couple worn out assemblies collecting cobwebs and rust in my shop's attic. (I knew they'd come in handy some day!) I'll need two of them since my project car's widened track will need a combined LH & RH axle rod length that exceeds the length of one Fiero axle. So here's a whack of pictures to show how to strip down a Fiero axle.
I started at the outer joint (CV) so I could rid myself of the dead-weight knuckle that had fused itself permanently onto the CV joint's spindle (good thing I don't need the CV joint!). First I snipped off both boot clamps:
Pulled back the boot to reveal surprisingly nice looking grease:
Then fished around for the retaining ring. In case anyone reading this hasn't done it before, you need to get your snap ring pliers inside the two tangs and pry them open, not squeeze them together.
While holding the two ends of the snap ring apart, the axle rod should just slip out of the spider assembly, and the retaining ring will stay behind with the CV joint:
Here's a close up of the CV end of the axle rod once the grease has been cleaned off.
The manual transmission axle rods have 1.063" diameters...
...there are 32 splines and the spline max diameter is 1.024":
For comparison's sake, the Fiero automatic transmission axle rods only have 29 splines vs 32 and are 0.935" diameter with max spline diameter = 0.925".
Next up: removing the tripot joint from the other end.
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seajai
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MAR 13, 06:47 PM
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When I built my axles, I found a lot of cars used the 1.063" dia axle with the 1.024" 32 spline count. The 03 Chrysler 300 had 'em, a lot of GM cars used them, even Ford. I just wandered through the pick and pull with a digital calipers and measured axles until I found the length with the dia I needed. My axle shafts are made from a 99 Buick LeSabre and a 97 Ford Windstar van. Even the stub dia was the same on the tripod joints, I have '03 Chrysler rollers on '02 Caviler joints running inside Chrysler cups. You may find an existing axle without having to custom make something. I have under $100 into my axles. http://www.fiero.nl/forum/F...3/HTML/000139-4.html
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Will
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MAR 13, 08:58 PM
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ccfiero350
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MAR 14, 07:09 AM
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