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| Getrag transmission problem on low mileage Fiero GT (Page 2/17) |
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Rodney
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OCT 19, 02:51 PM
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| quote | Originally posted by hobbywrench:
Alas the transmission was binding upon completion. Before I disassembled the unit the output shaft could be turned by hand with some effort.. After assembly there was significant drag, and unacceptable.. |
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Two things:
Loosen the steel side cover. If it gets easier it is the shim on the intermediate shaft. It should have 0 to -.003" under the height of the aluminum case. I think it is 0-.003". I would have to look that up. If it sits above the case the transmission will be hard to rotate. Find shims that sit flush or lower than the aluminum case. From the factory it should have been a select fit shim. One thickness. Most re-builders have a selection of thin shims and put them together to get the right thickness.
Did you change the tapered bearings on the differential? With new bearings you may be too tight on the crush. Again, from the factory it will have a one thickness shim. When they built them they had shims in many thicknesses on hand and could choose the exact right thickness shim. Re-builders have to use thinner shims and put in as many that are needed to get the right crush (tightness). It will be somewhat tight and they wear in to make them set at zero lash. When you change the oil after a few hundred miles the oil will have a silver sheen to it. Find someone locally that does differentials. He will know the right tightness when he rotates the differential by hand. This requires you to take the ring gear off the differential. You may even have the right crush and don't know it. Being tight is normal. I'm not sure how much that is but any differential set up guy would know just by rotating it. It is possible it is hardly noticeable when turning the input shaft but I don't know that answer. Loosening all the case bolts and prying it open slightly would answer this.
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Rodney Dickman
Fiero Parts And Acc's Web Page:
All new web page!:www.rodneydickman.com
Rodney Dickman's Fiero accessories
7604 Treeview Drive
Caledonia, WI 53108
Phone/Fax (262) 835-9575
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Patrick
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OCT 19, 03:35 PM
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hobbywrench
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OCT 19, 07:09 PM
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Rodney, Well your information is interesting, but I don't remember what all I changed (about 12 years back). I can remember (vaguely) that the spline shaft on the salvage unit turned with perhaps a couple ft lbs-it took a firm grip on the spline shaft to turn and I was able to change across all 5 gears and rev. After the "rebuild" the spline shaft would barely turn by hand, perhaps 8-10 ft lbs, and I also could change the gears. The Baretta salvage spline shaft would turn over with two fingers pinched on the pilot tip-I don't think it would register a couple inch pounds. I could go back if anyone is interested in the kit pn I used and I took some pictures, but not digital. As noted the Baretta unit has been sweet. I got it at a yard in Hillsboro OR for $350 about 7-8 years ago. Also back to the rebuild I think I loosened some parts ,but no improvement. BTW if people have not sensed it this effort is not for the faint hearted. Although the Getrag brochure suggests a minimum 12 ton press mine is a 30 ton and I did heave hard with a short handle on some of the gear removals
for synchro ring changeout. And there is at least one pre heat (oven). Someone with tenacity and maybe a couple successful efforts can do this. At the time I scoured the net and found one new Getrag in GA, price $1000, so by now they must almost all be rebuilders. You should publish a little paper for the weird ( or desperate) minority,
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Moar
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OCT 20, 01:48 AM
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| quote | | My advice is to have an experienced shop do the work, or buy a salvage unit and hope in either case. Good luck. I bet there is a good Austrian mechanic eager for work. |
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Of course, I can find a transmission specialist here in Austria.
But the problem in Austria is that working times of mechanics and especially transmission specialists are extremely expensive here!
A few examples:
- Full paint job for Mazda Miata: € 3000 - 4000.-
- Annually service for Jaguar X-Type: € 700 – 900 .-
(just for checking and re-filling some fluids + oil filer and a new battery)
Therefore, I have never visited a car service/repair shop so far.
I always repair my cars by myself, but I´m not sure if I have sufficient time for a tranny rebuild. 
A salvage unit may be the best option, but where should I get one in Austria/Germany?
If I order one from USA I have to pay $535 (best offer so far) for shipping![This message has been edited by Moar (edited 10-20-2015).]
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Moar
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OCT 20, 02:22 AM
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Thanks Rodney and Hobbywrench for all this detailed information.
I see that I have to deal with a very challenging task in the near future.
Honestly, I don´t have any practice experience with transmissions (only theoretical in view of gear train analysis),
because I have never had transmission problems on other cars.
However, in case I can´t find a salvage unit here in Austria I´m forced to rebuild the tranny by myself.
I think I will only rebuilt the tranny if gears are still in a good or acceptable shape without any pitting or other damages.
BTW, for which parts is this +12 ton press required?
Hope I don´t need it for bearing replacement (maybe just for bearing races and gears)?
@ hobbywrench
You stated that you have only paid about $300 for all essential spare parts needed for a MG282 rebuild?
What exactly was included in this rebuilt kit?
The old rebuilt MG282 is still lying around in your garage/shop?
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Rodney
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OCT 20, 04:00 AM
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Here is some information that might help:
http://www.rodneydickman.com/getraginfo.htm
Trying to find a good used 282 Getrag transmission from a front wheel drive GM car in your part of the world may be very difficult.
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Rodney Dickman
Fiero Parts And Acc's Web Page:
All new web page!:www.rodneydickman.com
Rodney Dickman's Fiero accessories
7604 Treeview Drive
Caledonia, WI 53108
Phone/Fax (262) 835-9575
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Rodney
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OCT 20, 04:03 AM
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hobbywrench
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OCT 20, 11:35 AM
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Moar, I will dig the archive out. The unit I "rebuilt" is sitting with the $300 kit in it, but you would be better off with a good salvage unit. You need a free agent here so you would only stand acquisition and shipping costs. Your neighborhood pic suggests you cannot tolerate a donor car on the street. Those prices are USA Mercedes prices, yikes. Stand by.
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Moar
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OCT 20, 02:05 PM
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You are right, unfortunately a donor car is not an option in my case.
I have rented a small garage which also includes a well-sized drive way.
On the drive way I have already parked my Jag and my Miata or Fiero and either the Miata or the Fiero is in the garage. But for an additional car the drive way will became too small (and also my neighborhood will get more and more angry with my cars).
Besides that, there is only one single 5-speed Fiero for sale here in Austria at the moment!
But this one is not a donor car, because it costs € 4250.-
I know that the Getrag 282 has been used in a quite a lot of other cars as follows:
• 87-89 2.8L Chevy Cavalier
• 87-88 Pontiac 6000
• 87-89 2.8L Chevy Beretta
• 87-88 Chevy Celebrity
• 87-89 2.8L Chevy Corsica
• 87-88 Cadillac Cimarron
• 87 2.8L Olds Fierenza
• 88-90 Olds Cutlass Supreme
• 88-91 Olds Calais
• 87-94 Pontiac Sunbird V6 & Turbo
• 87-89 2.8L Pontiac Tempest
Reference:
http://www.fierosails.com/TransMan.html
But I assume at minimum 90% of them have an automatic transmission and not a 5-speed manual which I´m searching!
Therefore, finding a MG282 salvage unit here in Austria or Germany is a very difficult task!
Maybe I should also look for alternative trannys, like HM282 / NVG-T550 / F23 / F40?[This message has been edited by Moar (edited 10-20-2015).]
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hobbywrench
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OCT 20, 08:24 PM
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Review of notes from 2003 produced more details:
1. Before considering rebuilding a Getrag obtain the 88 Fiero manual containing Muncie 282 sections 7B3 and 7B3A. Read latter carefully. If any desire still remains to rebuild read on.
2. There is a 10 page writeup which details my adventure. (we know it did not end well, but the writeup will again expose shortcomings of GM manual.)
3. The actual cost for parts is more than I stated. About $650 including the rebuild salvage unit, frt, rebuild kit and additional parts I wanted.
4. Surprisingly the basic kit is still available in Portland OR (# BK 234 WS) for $ 273. This includes brass synchros, bearings and seals, and is $100 less than I paid in 2003 thru a retail store (don't ask).
5. A delta list is available of parts I bought beyond the kit.
6. Hopefully pics of the press and adapters below.
If you want a salvage unit I found over 40 units today online in the US ranging in price from TBD, and $100-$1000. The source is car-part.com (aka used-auto-parts.net). This is the source of my salvage unit and my current 89 Beretta unit. I have had several dealings on Fiero and Nissan with ok results. The site lets you search by year/model and with other filters. The 40 units of ref resulted from asking for 89 Beretta , both electronic and mechanical speedo drive gears. You see the salvage yard by state, price, tel no , and sometimes quality comments. As always with risk. Call and talk to the yard guys. Now if you could just get the stuff over there.[This message has been edited by hobbywrench (edited 10-20-2015).]
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