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LS4 V8 DoD 4T65-E TAPShift swap underway (pics inside) by Darth Fiero
Started on: 09-12-2007 09:05 PM
Replies: 389 (49059 views)
Last post by: Dogcreek on 06-23-2012 12:11 AM
Dennis LaGrua
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Report this Post11-21-2008 11:11 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Dennis LaGruaClick Here to Email Dennis LaGruaSend a Private Message to Dennis LaGruaEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by Hudini:


Ryan, can any adjustable fuel pressure regulator be used for this setup? Also, would it be possible to use this type setup with the 7730 ECM? (Since fuel pressure does not vary as in the vacuum regulator type system)

Hugh


I have a concern that splicing in the Fuel pressure regulator to the returnless single line fuel rail line won't provide as much fuel pressure as if the regulator was on the end of the rail as on a standard return type rail. . I adapted a similar system on my 3800SC series III and it seems like the fuel presure gauge at idle hovers around 40 psi instead of 43 psi. It may work fine but I'm just not certain about doing it this way. As for adjustablility, I'm all for it but it would require taking off the o ring and changing the internals (cover and mechanism) .
or adding an aftermarket unit. BTW, GREAT job on this installation...neat clean, uncluttered and very well done.

As for the comment that was made on the ETC my observaton agrees. My daily driver is a Chrysler 300 and the ETC is sluggish and soft. GM's ETC system is far better but since I didn't know what to expect, my 3800SC uses a cable operated N* TB w an LS1 MAF (with thanks to Ryan for supplying the LS1 MAF table that we inserted into the program) Runs great now.

------------------
87GT - 3800SC Series III engine, 3.4" Pulley, N* TB, LS1 MAF, Flotech Exhaust Autolite 104's Custom CAI 4T65eHD w. custom axles, HP Tuners VCM Suite.
87GT - 3.4L Turbocharged engine, modified TH125H
" I'M ON THE LOOSE WITHOUT THE JUICE "

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MstangsBware
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Report this Post11-21-2008 12:41 PM Click Here to See the Profile for MstangsBwareClick Here to Email MstangsBwareSend a Private Message to MstangsBwareEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by Dennis LaGrua:

I have a concern that splicing in the Fuel pressure regulator to the returnless single line fuel rail line won't provide as much fuel pressure as if the regulator was on the end of the rail as on a standard return type rail. . I adapted a similar system on my 3800SC series III and it seems like the fuel presure gauge at idle hovers around 40 psi instead of 43 psi. It may work fine but I'm just not certain about doing it this way. .



I run a returnless fuel setup on my 3800SC swap and have been for about 6 months with no issues. I used the stock FPR cut off the stock rails and adapted it with the correct fittings. I ran a on board FPG on the rail for about a month to keep an eye on the fuel pressure. I have been to the track twice since installing this setup and ran the car all out with no fueling issues. The setup works and has been proven many times.

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Dennis LaGrua
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Report this Post11-21-2008 02:02 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Dennis LaGruaClick Here to Email Dennis LaGruaSend a Private Message to Dennis LaGruaEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by MstangsBware:
I run a returnless fuel setup on my 3800SC swap and have been for about 6 months with no issues. I used the stock FPR cut off the stock rails and adapted it with the correct fittings. I ran a on board FPG on the rail for about a month to keep an eye on the fuel pressure. I have been to the track twice since installing this setup and ran the car all out with no fueling issues. The setup works and has been proven many times.


You describe my setup perfectly. I guess that my concerns were unfounded, but whenever you deviate from stock the new approach must be tested. You have apparently done this. I have had no fueling problems so far either but haven't had the car on the track as you have. Now I can enter the 2009 season with some peace of mind. .

------------------
87GT - 3800SC Series III engine, 3.4" Pulley, N* TB, LS1 MAF, Flotech Exhaust Autolite 104's Custom CAI 4T65eHD w. custom axles, HP Tuners VCM Suite.
87GT - 3.4L Turbocharged engine, modified TH125H
" I'M ON THE LOOSE WITHOUT THE JUICE "

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Darth Fiero
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Report this Post11-21-2008 04:06 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Darth FieroClick Here to visit Darth Fiero's HomePageClick Here to Email Darth FieroSend a Private Message to Darth FieroEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by Dennis LaGrua:


I have a concern that splicing in the Fuel pressure regulator to the returnless single line fuel rail line won't provide as much fuel pressure as if the regulator was on the end of the rail as on a standard return type rail. . I adapted a similar system on my 3800SC series III and it seems like the fuel presure gauge at idle hovers around 40 psi instead of 43 psi. It may work fine but I'm just not certain about doing it this way. As for adjustablility, I'm all for it but it would require taking off the o ring and changing the internals (cover and mechanism) .
or adding an aftermarket unit. BTW, GREAT job on this installation...neat clean, uncluttered and very well done.

As for the comment that was made on the ETC my observaton agrees. My daily driver is a Chrysler 300 and the ETC is sluggish and soft. GM's ETC system is far better but since I didn't know what to expect, my 3800SC uses a cable operated N* TB w an LS1 MAF (with thanks to Ryan for supplying the LS1 MAF table that we inserted into the program) Runs great now.



It does not matter where the fuel pressure regulator is mounted in the fuel system AS LONG AS you don't have any restrictions between the point where the regulator ties into the pressure line and the fuel injectors. If you had a restriction say in the fuel rail inlet, then yes you could have a fuel pressure drop in the rail compared to the rest of the system.

-ryan

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blkcofy
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Report this Post05-02-2010 02:02 PM Click Here to See the Profile for blkcofySend a Private Message to blkcofyEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Thought I'd provide a bit of an update. Almost 15 months since the last post, and the LS4 swap is doing great. I've not had any major issues till recently, where it looks like I've got to replace my high pressure intank fuel pump. I've run the car near empty a few times, and apparently these pumps don't appreciate my frugality. I've ordered a new one, and will likely take it to a shop to do the work since the gas tank has to be dropped and I just filled it.

Most of my time has been spent on the interior of the car. I've installed the subwoofer, new amp, and component speaker install many of you have done with guidance from this forum...replacing the fronts and side rears. I've also been changing a lot of the screws, bolts, seals, and other bits and parts from The Fiero Store to reduce as much rattles and shakes as possible. I tried to reseal my windshield as it was leaking...ended up cracking the darn thing and had to replace the whole window...but got a good deal on the work.

I finally decided what to do with the exterior. I've been sitting on Dietmar's side scoops and Amida's F355 nose for over a year, and finally got them installed. It's amazing the difference it really makes.



So with that much momentum, I've decided to vinyl wrap the Fiero, based on the Ferrari F430 Novitec Rosso. I've read all the hype on vinyl wrapping and decided after much research to do it, as I wanted to do something different than just paint the car. Besides, painting the car at the level I wanted was looking like it was going to cost me $5000 and that was a deal killer. So with a budget of half that, I set out to see how things would turn out.

I'll start a new post as to not take an engine build thread into a vinyl thread. If interested, look for something like "LS4 GXP Fiero goes Vinyl Wrap"

blkcofy

[This message has been edited by blkcofy (edited 05-02-2010).]

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blkcofy
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Report this Post05-02-2010 02:29 PM Click Here to See the Profile for blkcofySend a Private Message to blkcofyEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Well, it looks like I need special privileges to start a new thread, which I obviously don't have.

So I'll continue to use this one, and apologize to those who will be upset about my changing topics.

Here was my visual benchmark...the white w/ black body stripes on the Ferrari F430 Novitec Rosso.







I wanted to go with a Matte color, so I did quite a bit of searching on the net to find examples of paints, vinyl...anything that could provide a matte color. I've spent more than a few weekends waxing and buffing, and liked the look of matte cars and wasn't too upset about not needing to wax again.

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blkcofy
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Report this Post05-02-2010 03:56 PM Click Here to See the Profile for blkcofySend a Private Message to blkcofyEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

I've spent the last 4 months researching companies and manufacturers of vinyl wraps. Read hundreds of threads about the pros and cons, and even thought about matte paint instead of wrap. Wrap just continued to intrigue me. Most folks have been going black or satin black matte, but of course, I have to be different. Plus, having had my car since 1990 I was rather use to keeping the car white.





I finally went with a company in California called StickerCity, who was able to talk me through the process as well as provide me guidance on what to look for in terms of finding someone who could do the work. I probably ordered 30% too much product, but I do have extra for any mistakes or damages. I also probably could have paid less if I allowed a dealer to order the product (3M vinyl), as I'm sure I paid a bit of a mark up. I wasn't going to ship my car from Ohio to California, so I was forced to look for someone who had experience vinyl wrapping vehicles commercially (buses, trucks, ect.) locally.

I made a deal with a local and trusted shop (Audio Explosion) who could provide the space and clearance for doing the work here in Cincinnati, as I found the person to wrap the car from Columbus. Yes, very complicated, but I was able to stick to my budget and get my car done locally.

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blkcofy
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Report this Post05-02-2010 05:22 PM Click Here to See the Profile for blkcofySend a Private Message to blkcofyEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Before the vinyl:




During the process. Shop worked on car across 3 days:




Final pictures after stripes added. I had them do a 30% window tint. First tint I've ever done on this car since I've owned it. Looks cool. I still have some little details to improve. You can't really tell from the photos, but the molding trim needs more detail as they didn't do inside the door seams. Looks awesome from 10 feet away, but under the eyes of a perfectionist, it needs a bit more work. The area of most concern are the seams at the corner of the rear bumper. This is the only place that has visible seams, due to the funky shape of the rear bumper. They couldn't do one piece without splitting it because of the lights, and my wanting them to take it all the way under the car. The shops agreed to redo the bumper and try to hide the seams behind the stripe. Other than that...I think they did an awesome job.







I found some interesting 3.5 inch fog lights that not only have angel eye functionality, but can change colors (white, blue, green, red, purple) with a flip of a switch. Found them on ebay. It came with bluelight bulbs, but I forgot to switch them out. I'd have to remove the nose to get to them, which I'll do eventually to match the LED color. Also added some LED lights in the grill to serve as daytime running lights. I thought about changing these square headlights, but I've not been a big fan of the current options.

[This message has been edited by blkcofy (edited 05-02-2010).]

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Amida
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Report this Post05-06-2010 10:50 PM Click Here to See the Profile for AmidaClick Here to Email AmidaSend a Private Message to AmidaEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Wow! nice job. Almost missed this post...sort of buried in this thread.

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blkcofy
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Report this Post05-09-2010 09:34 PM Click Here to See the Profile for blkcofySend a Private Message to blkcofyEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by Amida:

Wow! nice job. Almost missed this post...sort of buried in this thread.


Thank you sir. I wanted to start a new thread about Vinyl Wrapping Fieros, but I don't have the capability to start new threads.

With your nose on, the car looks amazing. The looks I get on the road now are fun! People honking, gawking, asking what it is. The looks finally match the engine. I washed it today by hand, and as usual that's when you can tell what type of job (wrapping) was done. I'll give it a B+. If I had the skills, I would have taken every body part off and wrapped separately. I would have also made sure the car was 100% clean, even underneath, as I can see where the vinyl is not holding 100%...which must be due to grease. I've got enough to do at least 70% of the car again, and I might do some of the panels over. I still haven't put my rear wing back on. I'm kinda liking it w/out it.

My only enemy is tar and grease smudges, but so far they wash right off with a bit of effort. Dry's fast...no waxing. So far, I'm happy. We'll see what happens when it gets hot this summer...



[This message has been edited by blkcofy (edited 05-09-2010).]

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AkursedX
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Report this Post05-09-2010 10:39 PM Click Here to See the Profile for AkursedXClick Here to Email AkursedXSend a Private Message to AkursedXEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by blkcofy:


Thank you sir. I wanted to start a new thread about Vinyl Wrapping Fieros, but I don't have the capability to start new threads.


No one can start new threads in the Construction Zone section. All the threads in here were moved here by Cliff. You should have no problems starting threads in any of the other sections.

BTW, it looks great! I really like what you have been doing!
------------------
'88 GT- 3800 Turbo 11.367@121.03mph
gmtuners.com -Build info

[This message has been edited by AkursedX (edited 05-09-2010).]

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JPH87
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Report this Post05-10-2010 03:25 AM Click Here to See the Profile for JPH87Click Here to Email JPH87Send a Private Message to JPH87Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Great thread and car 1 question what kind of fuel mileage are you getting

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Amida
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Report this Post05-12-2010 08:54 PM Click Here to See the Profile for AmidaClick Here to Email AmidaSend a Private Message to AmidaEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

I used silver vinyl during the fi355 design review...soft stuff...not too abrasion resistant.

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ghost187x
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Report this Post05-12-2010 09:26 PM Click Here to See the Profile for ghost187xSend a Private Message to ghost187xEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

wow... i was going to do those stripes on my car. i might still do it

very very very nice fiero! this might be my new favorite! you and car-2-lo's fieros...

great job!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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blkcofy
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Report this Post05-13-2010 09:55 PM Click Here to See the Profile for blkcofySend a Private Message to blkcofyEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Thanks guys. I would have never had the inspiration, nor the confidence to get it where it's at today without Pennock's and many of the brilliant enthusiasts on this forum. This has to seriously be the best car forum on the web. I mean, really...are there any more dedicated (or broke) car enthusiasts than Fiero owners?

[This message has been edited by blkcofy (edited 05-13-2010).]

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Dennis LaGrua
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Report this Post06-03-2010 08:59 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Dennis LaGruaClick Here to Email Dennis LaGruaSend a Private Message to Dennis LaGruaEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by blkcofy:

Thanks guys. I would have never had the inspiration, nor the confidence to get it where it's at today without Pennock's and many of the brilliant enthusiasts on this forum. This has to seriously be the best car forum on the web. I mean, really...are there any more dedicated (or broke) car enthusiasts than Fiero owners?



I've been following this swap from the beginning and must say that it is a "work of art" that appears to look like a OEM installation. My hat is off to Ryan for completing what I consider to be one of the most difficult Fiero swaps around. Now when is the turbo being installed?

------------------
" THE BLACK PARALYZER" -87GT 3800SC Series III engine, 3.4" Pulley, N* TB, LS1 MAF, Flotech Exhaust Autolite 104's Custom CAI 4T65eHD w. custom axles, HP Tuners VCM Suite.
"THE COLUSSUS"
87GT - ALL OUT 3.4L Turbocharged engine, Garrett Hybrid Turbo, MSD ign., modified TH125H
" ON THE LOOSE WITHOUT THE JUICE "

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blkcofy
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Report this Post06-20-2010 03:41 PM Click Here to See the Profile for blkcofySend a Private Message to blkcofyEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Finally got around to painting the LS4 engine cover. I sanded everything down with 800 grit, then painted (can) with grey primer for plastics, several coats (5) of red, then a few coats (4) of gloss. I tapped the lettering using a knife tool. Came out pretty good and really sets off the engine bay.



Also finally put some Pontiac GXP badges on the front side markers. Got them pretty cheap off e-bay. Looks like it just belongs there! I like the OEM but not really OEM look the car has taken on.




And for the final touches, I decided after much debate, to put the spoiler back on the car. I bought the Fiero Stealth Wing Stands for TLG and painted them flat black. It took a bit of effort to get the holes aligned...but a few curse words later, it was bolted on and looks fantastic.






UPDATE: The vinyl wrap is OKAY. I think it's really about how perfect (clean) the installer puts the wrap on. I'm seeing peel back in some of the edges of the car. Nothing major, but I don't see this being a multiple year application like I thought. I was told 5 years if I took care of it. Maybe 2 years, before I get fed up with some of the peeling. I've got plenty of material left, and may try to find a better installer. From afar, it tools like a $10,000 paint job, but under the close inspection at the corners, undercarriage, and bumper edges, you can see the imperfections. Would I do it again? Yes, but I'd take all the parts OFF the car and do it slowly and properly instead of the quick and easy way. I only paid $1000 to have the guy put it on. I'd now probably pay $1700 or more to have it done with the right way.

Next stop...Mid-Ohio track w/ a BMW club and the local drag strip (Edgewater Park).

Again, thanks for all the good feedback and advice along the way. I now have visions of Supercharger's in my head...hmmmm.

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dobey
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Report this Post06-20-2010 06:13 PM Click Here to See the Profile for dobeySend a Private Message to dobeyEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Nice. I can't wait to get my LS4 built and in. Going to be a lot of work though. But it will be lots of fun with the 6 speed behind it.

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Darth Fiero
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Report this Post06-21-2010 01:43 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Darth FieroClick Here to visit Darth Fiero's HomePageClick Here to Email Darth FieroSend a Private Message to Darth FieroEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by blkcofy:

Finally got around to painting the LS4 engine cover. I sanded everything down with 800 grit, then painted (can) with grey primer for plastics, several coats (5) of red, then a few coats (4) of gloss. I tapped the lettering using a knife tool. Came out pretty good and really sets off the engine bay.





Looks good! Keep us posted on how that paint holds up. My paint guy tells me he has been unable to find any plastic adhesion promoter that is rated for engine compartment temperatures so he has hesitated to paint any plastic engine components for fear the paint will eventually begin to chip or peel due to the heat.

The GXP badges look awesome on the car! Good thinking!

 
quote
I now have visions of Supercharger's in my head...hmmmm.


....built motor and INTERCOOLED TURBO!!!

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dobey
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Report this Post06-21-2010 02:10 PM Click Here to See the Profile for dobeySend a Private Message to dobeyEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by Darth Fiero:
Looks good! Keep us posted on how that paint holds up. My paint guy tells me he has been unable to find any plastic adhesion promoter that is rated for engine compartment temperatures so he has hesitated to paint any plastic engine components for fear the paint will eventually begin to chip or peel due to the heat.


I used a red VHT paint made for brake calipers, to paint the runners on my LS2 intake. I didn't use any primer or anything under it. Just prepped the intake with some 320 scotch sanding sponge, taped off the parts i didn't want painted, and sprayed it. It seems to stick really well. I don't know if the LS4 engine cover is a different composite than the intake though.

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Darth Fiero
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Report this Post06-21-2010 02:22 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Darth FieroClick Here to visit Darth Fiero's HomePageClick Here to Email Darth FieroSend a Private Message to Darth FieroEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by dobey:


I used a red VHT paint made for brake calipers, to paint the runners on my LS2 intake. I didn't use any primer or anything under it. Just prepped the intake with some 320 scotch sanding sponge, taped off the parts i didn't want painted, and sprayed it. It seems to stick really well. I don't know if the LS4 engine cover is a different composite than the intake though.


How long has the paint been on your intake? How many miles have you put on it since you painted it?

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Gokart Mozart
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Report this Post09-10-2010 07:41 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Gokart MozartClick Here to visit Gokart Mozart's HomePageSend a Private Message to Gokart MozartEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

how's the wrap and engine cover holding up?

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Report this Post09-11-2010 12:33 AM Click Here to See the Profile for dobeySend a Private Message to dobeyEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by Darth Fiero:
How long has the paint been on your intake? How many miles have you put on it since you painted it?


Didn't see this until now. But it's been on the intake for about 6 months now I think. And still 0 miles, since I don't have the build done yet. It's just been sitting in the garage. But I don't forsee any issues with it, once I do get it in.

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Report this Post01-22-2011 08:48 PM Click Here to See the Profile for madcurlClick Here to Email madcurlSend a Private Message to madcurlEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

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Report this Post09-02-2011 10:21 PM Click Here to See the Profile for blkcofySend a Private Message to blkcofyEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Sorry guys. Been a LOOOOOONG time since I've been on the Fiero post. Those that are interested...the wrap was a bit of a disappointment. From a distance it still looks awesome, but under close inspection, it's starting to separate from tough angles. It's kept in a garage, but still. It's probably as much the fault of the applicator (the guy who did it, this was their first time doing it) and just the fact that wraps are nice, but it's not a paint job. Is it drivable? Yes. Is it good for a show....absolutely not. It lasted what, two years so I can't complain too much.

The paint on the engine cover is still 100% perfect. I'll get it out this summer (I've been distracted from my new ride I get this March) and take some current photos.

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Amida
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Report this Post09-04-2011 01:37 PM Click Here to See the Profile for AmidaClick Here to Email AmidaSend a Private Message to AmidaEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Hey Maurice, the valance panel looks a little low at the hood centerline. Is it jus the camera angle? You can use a spacer to prop it up if needed.

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Greenmeansgo
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Report this Post09-25-2011 11:34 PM Click Here to See the Profile for GreenmeansgoSend a Private Message to GreenmeansgoEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Can anyone explain better to me how you get the tap shift to work, Like every part needed

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Report this Post09-26-2011 02:18 PM Click Here to See the Profile for exoticseClick Here to Email exoticseSend a Private Message to exoticseEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post


Blkcofy check this out.

http://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum1/HTML/087104.html

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Fiero Owner Wannabe
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From: Palmdale, California, USA
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Report this Post06-09-2012 11:57 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Fiero Owner WannabeClick Here to visit Fiero Owner Wannabe's HomePageClick Here to Email Fiero Owner WannabeSend a Private Message to Fiero Owner WannabeEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

So what kinda of gas mileage are you getting out of that LS4 now adays?

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Dogcreek
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Report this Post06-23-2012 12:11 AM Click Here to See the Profile for DogcreekClick Here to Email DogcreekSend a Private Message to DogcreekEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Hi,

Can't answer for blkcofy but after 3800 miles on mine I get 32 on the freeway at 72.... 27+ putting my foot in it a bit... (70 to 80 mph) Full tank measured from topped to refill.... with around town and freeway I average 20.... Which is 4mpg more than I used to get with the stock V6 auto.

For the record, I have made no major mods. DoD is on.... which helps... Just shorter cat-back exhaust with Cats only... And a better designed air intake designed by FieroKing. Who did my swap.

Better mileage than my wife's V6 stock formula by far... Power? ABSOLUTELY no comparison. None whatsoever... No not even....

Jeff

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Mine = 1986/2007 LS4 Fiero GXP
Brides= All stock 1988 Formula

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