Hi I have a 1986 and a half fiero with the 5 spd getrag and I wanna put a v8 but I don want to have to modify anything a lot and I was wondering about the gm 350 EFI and how much needs to be modified to put it in and also I wanted to know the fiero is a open differential too right?
There is a lot of information here that will help you. Search for V8 archie's posts as well as his website, and also look for SBC or small block chevy.
For a minimum of modifications the 4.9 caddy is the engine. It bolts to the tranny and if you get the ECM and engine harness with it you are in business. I carb'd mine because I am old school, and it goes like stink. You'll need a heavier clutch though
You will need Archies install kit. If I remember its about $3000. I did one of the conversions myself a few years ago. Dont do it if your using a Fiero automatic though...tranns wont take it.
Ok well if I did the 4.9 I heard that they tend to over heat and they redline at 5600 at only 200hp what is a common what that you guys are turning them into 300hp plus motors and making the redline point higher
The 4.9 is a very good engine for what it is: relatively inexpensive and simple to install, about the same weight as the 2.8 V6, excessive low RPM torque, about 200 hp.
The 4.9 is a very poor engine to try and get more out of. It is difficult/expensive to upgrade and results are typically disappointing unless you go with a power adder of some kind.
[This message has been edited by fieroguru (edited 10-30-2013).]
Has anyone turbocharged a 4.9 or twin turbo cause that has to add some power and yeah if I can't get over 300 whp out of a v8 that will go in there I will probably go with the 3.8
I think the sbc is probable one of the easiest swaps I have done. There are a ton of performance parts. The exhaust is easy to build. lots of people have done this swap. You don't have to have it computer controlled. There are a lot of folks in the forum that are a great resource. A company in Canada, can't remember the name, also has V8 to Fiero swap kits. Go one line and do a search. If you use aluminum heads and intake, the weight difference isn't a killer. I like the kits that provide different length axles that allow you to keep the engine more to the drivers side. It keeps the V belt inside the engine compartment and the front valve cover clear of the deck hinge. It's just my preference for engine placement, but not the only way to skin the cat. I have a roller cammed 427 sbc and the Getrag 5 spd. I am very pleased with the performance. I have front and rear sway bars and 11.25 brakes. Handling and stopping is excellent. The mileage is crap! Have fun planning!
Well I wouldn't be swapping the engine my machanic friend would so how many hours do u think it would take him to do it with a sbc swap cause I want to keep it under 3500
So are there any other v8 engine that are as easily installed that deliver more power or that you can get a lot of power out of it
Short answer is no.
The 4.9 is the cheapest/easiest, but limited in potential.
The SBC requires an adapter plate, custom flywheel, balancer and reworking the entire accessory drive (along with relocating the oil filter, running a mini-starter and some type of water pump - most are using electric these days). If you can buy the needed install parts used, then it doesn't have to cost a lot, and the power is only limited by your wallet, but many old SBC's in stock condition are sub 200hp.
The N* is 280 - 300 fwhp stock, but it is a very tight fit. There are somewhat fewer mechanical issues to work through, but the ECM side is more challenging. There are upgrades available to increase performance, but they are premium priced.
LS(x) family - easily the most expensive to install, but again power potential will only be limited by your wallet.
I'll be getting my carb'd 4.9 dyno'd in the foreseeable future. It pulls hard to 6000 with a stock cam and heads
I am strongly considering in investing in the Allante valve trees though, because I don't think GM intended the engine to have the 6000 red line that mine has.
If you stick with the factory ECM and electronics, the engine will behave like a stock Caddy. In other words, it will fall flat on its face after about 5400 rpm.
A friend of mine built HER86GT and it was a turbo'd 12 sec. 4.9. Yes it can be turbo'd but it needs a whole lot of plumbing, a custom chip and what not.
The basic 4.9 though, is the cheapest and easiest v8 swap for the car.
Like the man says, a free sbc will still cost you way more than a 4.9 swap all costs in.
I am guessing here, but I think the carb'd engine is at about 220 hp and over 300 ftlbs vs the stock which is 200 and 275.
Arn
The 4.9 doesn't run hot, but if you have a non-AC Fiero, you have a single core rad (found that out with mine) and the single core rad will not keep up with the 4.9. I bought a 3 core and it does not overheat.
[This message has been edited by Arns85GT (edited 10-30-2013).]
You should see if you can find some people locally who could let you try driving a 4.9 and a 3800sc..two of the most common swaps. You'll get a better idea what that amount of hp/torque feels like...
Ok thanks guys my choices have officially come down to the north* or a gm 350 the place I'm get I will it from has a great deal on a 350 and they have north* too but the guy said that the head gaskets need to be replaced what will be the least expensive over all btw the 350 is 550 and the north* is 400
I'm thinking you need to do a lot more research before you make a decision. Even with your friend doing the work for free, the cost of a Northstar or a SBC will likely be a lot higher than you think. If I recall correctly, the Northstar may be a bit cheaper of the two, but I've read it's a really tough swap for the result.
Well I wouldn't be swapping the engine my machanic friend would so how many hours do u think it would take him to do it with a sbc swap cause I want to keep it under 3500
Your car is never going to get finished.
No offence to your friend or you, but these sorts of "deals" very rarely work out how the owner wants them to. If your friend is a mechanic, he's going to spend most of his time working on stuff that's going to pay him good money, not on the side job for a friend. Swapping a V8 into a Fiero is no easy task, and it's not going to get done right, in a weekend.
If you want to get it done, and can't do it yourself, then save your money until you can afford to pay someone to do it right, and on time.
Ok thanks guys my choices have officially come down to the north* or a gm 350 the place I'm get I will it from has a great deal on a 350 and they have north* too but the guy said that the head gaskets need to be replaced what will be the least expensive over all btw the 350 is 550 and the north* is 400
So if I repair the head gaskets and tap the block again how likely will it be for this to happen again is this like a thing that you have to do every couple of years with this engine
I have 2 friends who both tried Northstars. They are both driving 3800's now.(one sc and the other turbo) The Northstar is a nice motor but once it needs to be opened you will have problems, particularly sealing it. The engine doesn't like mods. The 4.9 has limited mods available, the 350 has all sorts of mod support, and the 3800 can be built up allot without modding the internals
Of the 3, the sbc is the most expensive and the most complicated. If you do it though, you have a dependable big hp engine, and you'll need the tranny to keep up with it. I know that even the 4.9 needs a heavier clutch for the stick trannies, and I know the auto needs a better stall converter for performance, not function.
Cost wise, your sbc will cost as much and be more work than either the 4.9 or 3800
How deep is your wallet? The more HP you want the more $$$ it is going to cost. A stock 3.8 supercharged engine puts out around 230 - 250 HP. The easiest way to get 300 HP out of one would be to turbo charge it. If I were doing this I would also swap in the automatic that came with the engine. There are lots of build threads on Pennock's on turbo charging the 3.8 engine. Do a search. Then PM the builders and ask questions. Like how long did it take to build? How much money was spent? How many custom parts needed to be made? Who tuned the ECM? Which ECM did you use? Can you do a cheap $$$ swap and get 300HP? Maybe. Would it last? Maybe. I have a question. Why the fixation on 300HP?
[This message has been edited by n7vrz (edited 10-31-2013).]
Hi I have a 1986 and a half fiero with the 5 spd getrag and I wanna put a v8 but I don want to have to modify anything a lot and I was wondering about the gm 350 EFI and how much needs to be modified to put it in and also I wanted to know the fiero is a open differential too right?
Doing any engine swap into any car is in it'self a Modification. So the fact that you want to do an engine swap is a contradiction to not wanting to modify anything.
quote
Originally posted by Kfa171:
I found a great deal on a gm 350 so how much would I have to do to drop that into my fiero
Putting a 350 SBC into a Fiero is not all that more expensive than any of the other swaps that have been suggested.
Yes you do need an adapter plate & a few other custom parts. My Master-Build V-8 conversion kit is a little over $3K. But that kit is going to provide everything you need to put a SBC into a Fiero. Add an engine & engine controls & you've got what you're going to need. It includes everything from the performance clutch to the Exhaust system to the cooling system upgrades & it's all new parts.
AND the kit comes with a DVD instruction video, written Instructions & a complete parts list for the other parts you'll need. It also is supported by my 800 number that you can call to ask any questions you might come up with during the build.
My Economy V-8 kit for the SBC is only $950.00 & it includes all of the custom designed parts you'll need for the swap. At some point during your build, if you're going to build it the way we do them in house, you will need the parts that are in the Master-Build kit. A lot of the other stuff you'll need you will also need if you're going any of the other swaps that have been suggested.
These other parts, to get you up to the Master-Buildkit level, you can pick up as you go. You can buy them used or new at swap meets or from parts store or speed shops.
And many of the parts in the Master-Build kit are items that you'd need to be addressing with any engine swap.
For example:
1) Let's say you want to make 300 to 350hp. Any engine that's going to make that much power is going to create more heat. You'll need a larger radiator & the hoses & connections to hook up the engine cooling system to the Fiero. Those parts are all included in my Master-Build kit. Or you can buy them on your own with my parts list.
2) You're going to need a performance clutch with any stick shift swap. My Master-Build kit includes the clutch or you can buy the clutch that my instructions suggest.
3) You're going to need an exhaust system. My Master-Build kit includes the exhaust system or you can build your own based on the detailed instructions in my Video instructions. Yeah, I know, the advocates of most of these other swaps will say that you can use the exhaust from the junkyard 3.8 or 4.9 or 4.6 you buy. Those are not true dual exhaust systems. Most of the guys advocate those swaps are using the rusty old exhaust manifolds & crossover pipes that came on that junkyard engine. But they still have to build those rusty parts & create the rest of the exhaust from there.
If you build a 3.8 or 4.9 or N-Star to make good power & to be reliable, then you're going to spend a lot more money on the engine & the tuning than you'd spend on the SBC.
Some have said that the SBC is the most expensive. I don't agree. If you compare apples to apples, I think you'll find that the SBC is very close in in final cost to many of the other suggested engines.
NONE of these other swaps that have been suggested come with a detailed instruction video that tells you what to do & what not to do & goes step by step thru the build like my kit does.
If planned properly & if you follow my instructions, you should be able to complete the SBC swap in 35 to 40 hours.
I fear that you're mechanic buddy could lose interest in the project if he had to spend 2 or 3 times as much time trying to get a 3.8 built to 500hp or to try to figure out a way to hookup the N-Star to make it run correctly. Let along the time it would take you guys to find the best mounting instructions ta make it all happen before you mechanic friend loses interest.
Hope that helps
Archie
[This message has been edited by Archie (edited 10-31-2013).]
