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Economical by timenewton
Started on: 08-14-2017 01:44 PM
Replies: 18 (362 views)
Last post by: fierofool on 08-18-2017 06:55 PM
timenewton
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Report this Post08-14-2017 01:44 PM Click Here to See the Profile for timenewtonClick Here to Email timenewtonSend a Private Message to timenewtonEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Ok so I have a 3.8 SC fiero pushing about 300hp and it has a 4.10 4 speed. 2nd sync is going out. Now im at the point would it be to cheaper to get an isuzu 5 speed and swap it or go with the m17 gears swap?
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timenewton
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Report this Post08-15-2017 03:40 PM Click Here to See the Profile for timenewtonClick Here to Email timenewtonSend a Private Message to timenewtonEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Ok so I found an isuzu 5 speed in a fiero at the junkyard for $200 with the added costs of the other components.

To swap in an Isuzu 5 speed here is what you will need:
Isuzu 5 speed (duh!)
Isuzu shift and select cables
5 speed shifter
Shifter console trim plate with the 5 speed pattern on it
You will need the brackets for the slave and the cables at the transaxle, and the transaxle mount brackets.

Anything else I need for this to work? Please respond I need to know by tomorrow.

Also like I said mine is a 4.10. So do the axles need to be swapped too?

[This message has been edited by timenewton (edited 08-15-2017).]

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Gall757
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Report this Post08-15-2017 04:25 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Gall757Send a Private Message to Gall757Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I would keep the 4 speed considering how much torque your engine is making.
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pmbrunelle
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Report this Post08-15-2017 07:34 PM Click Here to See the Profile for pmbrunelleClick Here to Email pmbrunelleSend a Private Message to pmbrunelleEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
How do you find the 4.10 gearing with that much power?

What's good about the M17 is the ribbed case for durability, more so than the actual gears. And the ratios are different.

If you like this gearing, why don't you just keep it? Find a 4-speed transmission somewhere; there ought to be one good synchronizer ring in it.
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timenewton
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Report this Post08-15-2017 08:29 PM Click Here to See the Profile for timenewtonClick Here to Email timenewtonSend a Private Message to timenewtonEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I dont like the gearing honestly. At 60mph im at 3k rpm wondering when im suppose to shift again. It's fun up until 60 then it's just mehh. I have a 3.8 SC that tops out at 90.
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Gall757
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Report this Post08-15-2017 09:05 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Gall757Send a Private Message to Gall757Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
You would like the M17, I think it is 3.65....so rpm would be much lower at speed. I think you would break an isuzu.

[This message has been edited by Gall757 (edited 08-15-2017).]

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timenewton
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Report this Post08-15-2017 09:31 PM Click Here to See the Profile for timenewtonClick Here to Email timenewtonSend a Private Message to timenewtonEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Yeah i've thought about it. I believe im just giving up on the manual and going auto. Less hassle to worry about. Save money in the long run anyways, and not have to worry about hearing about breaking/fixing issues anymore. The fiero trans are just to weak for the modern age and I have now been enlightened.
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pmbrunelle
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Report this Post08-16-2017 12:22 PM Click Here to See the Profile for pmbrunelleClick Here to Email pmbrunelleSend a Private Message to pmbrunelleEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I don't think the Fiero transmissions are so bad, but none of them are new anymore. They're old and abused. Junkyard stuff needs rebuilding before use; cars don't end up in the JY because they still drive nice.

A crunchy synchro doesn't mean the transmission is weak. A synchro ring is a wear part requiring periodic replacement.

Saying your trans is broke because the 2nd gear is crunchy is like saying the design of your brakes suck, but you've worn the pads to the metal.
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Patrick
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Report this Post08-16-2017 03:14 PM Click Here to See the Profile for PatrickClick Here to Email PatrickSend a Private Message to PatrickEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by timenewton:

I believe im just giving up on the manual and going auto.


Well... that'll suck about 90% of the fun out of driving the car.

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timenewton
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Report this Post08-16-2017 05:46 PM Click Here to See the Profile for timenewtonClick Here to Email timenewtonSend a Private Message to timenewtonEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Yes, I understand the synchro will be easy enough to replace. I just don't like the 4.10 gearing. The car is fun up until 60. Mine has a spec 3 clutch in it. So i'll prob keep it the way it is till it rips some gears then its auto after that. As for 90% of the fun I doubt it. About the only fun I have with manuals is on curvy roads up and down shifting. For periodic driving auto is the way it is.
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Report this Post08-18-2017 09:34 AM Click Here to See the Profile for 2.5Send a Private Message to 2.5Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Gall757:

I would keep the 4 speed considering how much torque your engine is making.


How much does a 3800 SC with 300 hp make?
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Report this Post08-18-2017 09:35 AM Click Here to See the Profile for 2.5Send a Private Message to 2.5Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

2.5

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Member since May 2007
 
quote
Originally posted by timenewton:

The fiero trans are just to weak for the modern age and I have now been enlightened.


The Getrag is behind V8s. The Isuzu is weaker.
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fierosound
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Report this Post08-18-2017 09:43 AM Click Here to See the Profile for fierosoundClick Here to visit fierosound's HomePageClick Here to Email fierosoundSend a Private Message to fierosoundEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by timenewton:

Ok so I found an isuzu 5 speed in a fiero at the junkyard for $200 with the added costs of the other components.


 
quote
Originally posted by 2.5:

The Getrag is behind V8s. The Isuzu is weaker.


Agreed. Finding a FWD Getrag is easier too...
http://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum9/HTML/000038.html

Rodney has everything he needs. Adapters, cables etc.
http://rodneydickman.com/ca...h=37&products_id=143



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olejoedad
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Report this Post08-18-2017 09:44 AM Click Here to See the Profile for olejoedadClick Here to Email olejoedadSend a Private Message to olejoedadEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by 2.5:


How much does a 3800 SC with 300 hp make?


Peak torque would be around 300, as a guess, but would be at a higher RPM than a V-8.
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Report this Post08-18-2017 09:47 AM Click Here to See the Profile for fierosoundClick Here to visit fierosound's HomePageClick Here to Email fierosoundSend a Private Message to fierosoundEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by timenewton:

To swap in an 5 speed here is what you will need:

5-speed shift and select cables
5 speed shifter



Can someone explain why you need the 5-speed shifter?
How it is different from the 4-speed shifter?

One of our guys went from 4-speed to 5-speed and used the same shifter.
It's not like there's a "gate" limited to the "H" pattern.
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Report this Post08-18-2017 10:29 AM Click Here to See the Profile for fierosoundClick Here to visit fierosound's HomePageClick Here to Email fierosoundSend a Private Message to fierosoundEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
The other choice would be a Getrag F23
(unfortunately all the pics were hosted somewhere else and are lost )
http://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum1/HTML/087296.html

[This message has been edited by fierosound (edited 08-18-2017).]

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Report this Post08-18-2017 10:36 AM Click Here to See the Profile for 2.5Send a Private Message to 2.5Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by olejoedad:
Peak torque would be around 300, as a guess, but would be at a higher RPM than a V-8.


Really, that surprises me I would not think near that high.
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olejoedad
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Report this Post08-18-2017 03:59 PM Click Here to See the Profile for olejoedadClick Here to Email olejoedadSend a Private Message to olejoedadEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
A stock Series 2 makes 240 horse @ 5200 and 280 ft lbs @ 3600.
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fierofool
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Report this Post08-18-2017 06:55 PM Click Here to See the Profile for fierofoolClick Here to visit fierofool's HomePageClick Here to Email fierofoolSend a Private Message to fierofoolEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Your cable to transmission mount and slave mount are one and the same for the Isuzu. A question that wasn't answered was about what else you will need. You can use the same clutch and pressure plate, but you'll need to get an Isuzu throwout bearing.

One good thing about using an Isuzu behind the SC is that when you pop it, Isuzu's are fairly plentiful and cheaper than a Getrag. Tina, an old PFF drag racer ran Isuzus in her Fiero just for that reason. http://www.fiero.nl/forum/A...050119-2-055573.html
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