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New Moon Rising by Bob2112
Started on: 12-15-2015 10:47 PM
Replies: 72 (2122 views)
Last post by: Bob2112 on 11-06-2018 01:07 PM
Bob2112
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Report this Post12-15-2015 10:47 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Bob2112Send a Private Message to Bob2112Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I'm starting this thread to be a journal of sorts. I've been working on Mustang restoration for a few years, and I just recently started doing a retrospective thread on it. I wish now I had started that thread when I started the car as many little details have slipped my mind. So, I figured this time I would start a thread right when I got this project, even though there might be some quiet times.

I got my first Fiero around 1995 or 96 - somewhere near the end of college when I lived in Kent, Ohio. I always like the cars and by then they were cheap. The first one was a 86 SE with a sunroof and luggage rack. I paid $600 for it. The front wheels were at about a 20 degree slant so I promptly got that fixed. Drove it around for about a year or two until my girlfriend was driving it on the freeway one day when it threw a rod and busted a hole in the block. Luckily no fire. I kept the car and took out the engine to sell to the scrap metal place. I had visions of a SBC in the back of that SE, but for now I needed a new ride. As luck would have it, another friend of mine had a 86 plain jane coupe that he wanted to get rid of. The locks had been drilled out of the doors when someone broke into the car and stole the stereo. But it drove fine. I got that one for $300. I swapped over the luggage rack, the SE wheels and the power truck opener. Then I moved out west to Reno Nevada and had to give the first Fiero body to a friend in Ohio. I then drove that second Fiero for a good three or four years and finally had to get rid of it in Tucson, AZ (where I went to U of A for grad school) when it was smoking so much it wouldn't pass emissions.

By that time I had kids and a 2 seat car wasn't in the cards. Plus in California (living in the north bay by then) I had started working on the aforementioned Mustang. Anyway, ten years later here I am in Denver and my kids have cars of their own. So I start to think and realize I don't need a rear seat anymore since the kids have sedans. If we all want to go somewhere, we'll just take their cars. I have a '95 Chevy Truck to drive in the winter and my wife has a 2015 Honda Fit for something practical that also seats more than 2 people. Plus the Mustang is getting close to being done. All that puts me in the mind of getting back to a Fiero project. There is also a 1977 Impala Station Wagon in the project queue, but that's another story.

I wanted an 88 for the suspension upgrades, and I liked notchies so I wanted a Formula. So I spent the last few months watching them on craigslist, ebay etc to get a decent gauge on the price. Well, I finally decided to buy one and although it took me several weeks from first inquiry to finally pull the trigger, I finally did. The car has 51,000 miles and is in very good condition. The car has most options, and it has something I hadn't seen before - cup holders! Anyway, this post is pretty long so I'll wrap it up with a couple pictures from the listing and continue with more tomorrow.











[This message has been edited by Bob2112 (edited 08-28-2017).]

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zzzhuh
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Report this Post12-15-2015 11:11 PM Click Here to See the Profile for zzzhuhSend a Private Message to zzzhuhEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
That is a great looking formula. The black really adds to the look of the notch backs.

Im assuming you didn't get to drive the car at all today, considering all the snow
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Bob2112
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Report this Post12-15-2015 11:14 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Bob2112Send a Private Message to Bob2112Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Nope - it is completely buried. My wife said "where is the Fiero?" I said - "That lump of snow over there."

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Report this Post12-16-2015 10:59 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Gall757Send a Private Message to Gall757Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
When you get a chance, put the VIN in the thread called 88 database guy.

I have a car that is nearly a clone of yours.....Nice Choice!
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Bob2112
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Report this Post12-16-2015 12:50 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Bob2112Send a Private Message to Bob2112Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Already done!
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FieroJuice
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Report this Post12-16-2015 02:48 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FieroJuiceClick Here to Email FieroJuiceSend a Private Message to FieroJuiceEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Cup holders, lol. Besides being under powered, the bane of our beloved car's existence.

Are they screwed to the door or velcro? Good spot for them, BTW.

What mods are you planning?
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Bob2112
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Report this Post12-16-2015 06:18 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Bob2112Send a Private Message to Bob2112Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I don't know how they are attached - haven't looked much yet. Car got here and we promptly received a foot of snow.

Definitely have some mods in mind. The main reason I didn't buy a CJB was because I wouldn't want to mod one of those. Off the top of my head -

Hood struts (bought them before the car arrived)
Headlights - I like the hide away look, but I will do some type of low profile projector type mod. Saw some nice housings here or might fab up my own.
Body - I like the look of the notchback, so I don't plan to do much with this. I may do some side scoop rear quarters if I can fab or buy some that don't look to crazy. I do like the more aggressive look from wider hips, but I don't want to make it not look like a Fiero anymore.
Interior - Maybe a little here and there, eventually will probably go with Amida's kit.
Drive train - if I'm lazy, I'll do a 3800 swap, but what I am currently envisioning is a LS4/F40 swap.

All that said - I'm wide open to suggestions! Feel free to point out things you all would do with a black Formula if you had one!

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New Moon Rising - 1988 Black Formula

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FieroJuice
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Report this Post12-16-2015 11:07 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FieroJuiceClick Here to Email FieroJuiceSend a Private Message to FieroJuiceEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I'm right there with ya brother, though you are a few steps ahead.

I also just bought a black '88 Formula with under 60K miles.

Differences is that I have the beechwood interior with power nothing (that's on the Fiero-Do list to change over to power everything & where you're ahead).

2 priorities for me to fix is a rusted battery tray and bad brakes - may do the Corvette ones as that's the end game there anyway if it's not just a pump/bleeding issue.

I'm on record here that I'm going for a black interior swap.

Then normal stuff like hood/decklid props, hood & side scoops, Mustang decklid scoop, poly, suspension upgrade, inch drop, 17s, upgraded sound system with center sub & glovebox TV, back-up mirror display, heated seat pads under Mr Mikes, an overhead console across the inside of the windshield for more storage options (haven't seen that mod much), hidden trailer hitch for enclosed cargo carrier for luggage (yup, a DD that plans to travel too).

I will plan it out and buy as much as I can when I can over the next year or so as this is my last Fiero (5th one) and I'm in no rush to change this all over. With Under 60K, I can get plenty of more miles on this baby girl and enjoy that before all hell breaks loose over a summer.

Stock for now. Plan, save/buy/store parts. Enjoy the hell out of it until it's down to be reborn in a few summers.

Then Fiero Heaven: Last will be an engine swap (TBD but it will be a crate engine). I want that to be the icing on the cake.

Glory be to Hulki

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MaskJuice
88 Black Formula

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Bob2112
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Report this Post12-16-2015 11:31 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Bob2112Send a Private Message to Bob2112Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Sounds awesome. Do you have thread going on the car yet? If so I'll subscribe. Thanks for the list - gives me even more ideas! Funny you mention the power stuff. I looked at CJB that was power nothing and that also played into my decision to get this one. It has power everything except the rear deck opener and since I've done that install before I know it is pretty easy.

It will be a while until I get to the major stuff too. I need to finish my Mustang project for one. Plus I figure I drive this 2.8 for a little while and get some miles out of it before I pull it.

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FieroJuice
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Report this Post12-17-2015 07:17 AM Click Here to See the Profile for FieroJuiceClick Here to Email FieroJuiceSend a Private Message to FieroJuiceEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
No, I haven't started a thread yet detailing the plans with some starter photos as I have a Chromebook and PIP doesn't support posting from android (or I haven't been able to figure that out yet too. Android smartphone compatible either?).

I will get one started with or without photos after the holidays and it slows down.

MJ
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Report this Post12-19-2015 09:04 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Quad RaiderClick Here to Email Quad RaiderSend a Private Message to Quad RaiderEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
That is a great looking car. Bob, are you by any chance a Rush fan?
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Bob2112
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Report this Post12-19-2015 11:44 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Bob2112Send a Private Message to Bob2112Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Haha - who me? Yes, I am indeed. I did manage to see them in concert back in 93ish. I have my 17 yr old son hooked on 2112 as well now so I consider myself a successful parent.
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Report this Post12-19-2015 12:25 PM Click Here to See the Profile for RaydarClick Here to Email RaydarSend a Private Message to RaydarEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Nice Formula!
Mine used to look a bit like that, except that my paint was fried.


I'm one of those people who can never leave well enough alone, so I made some minor tweaks.

Good luck with your project!

[This message has been edited by Raydar (edited 12-19-2015).]

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Bob2112
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Report this Post12-19-2015 03:22 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Bob2112Send a Private Message to Bob2112Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Looks good Raydar!

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Bob2112
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Report this Post12-19-2015 11:09 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Bob2112Send a Private Message to Bob2112Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
ice day in Denver today. The snow melted enough that I could actually get to the Fiero today.

It started up just fine. A bit of exhaust or heat shield rattle. I'll track that down later. Figured out the power lock doesn't quite kick the passenger side open enough to unlock the door. Might just need some cleaning and lubrication. I can do that the first time I pull the door trim off to see how things look in there.

Looking forward to spring so I can get this thing out on the road. I'm hesitant to do so now because there is so much salt residue out there. Still need to get tags as well. Was nice sitting in the car though. Got the seat and mirrors a bit more adjusted to my preferences.

------------------
New Moon Rising - 1988 Black Formula
My Blue Heaven - 1965 Mustang Coupe

[This message has been edited by Bob2112 (edited 12-19-2015).]

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zzzhuh
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Report this Post12-21-2015 02:16 AM Click Here to See the Profile for zzzhuhSend a Private Message to zzzhuhEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Hey Bob, I happened to stumble upon this video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y-DVO104Dp0

Look familiar?
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Bob2112
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Report this Post12-21-2015 02:48 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Bob2112Send a Private Message to Bob2112Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Yup! That's the car. I watched the video a few times before I bought it.

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My Blue Heaven - 1965 Mustang Coupe

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Bob2112
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Report this Post12-24-2015 07:06 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Bob2112Send a Private Message to Bob2112Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Weather was nice today, so I took the Fiero out for a spin around the block. Didn't go far since I don't have tags. Seemed to run nice and it was fun.

It seemed like a good opportunity to teach my two boys how to drive manual. The first kid awake came out and did pretty well. The only time he stalled was when we were on a bit of hill and there was a car behind him so he panicked a bit and stalled. The lady behind us was nice and backed up to give him some room to try and he did fine then. Then he wanted to head over to his girlfriends house so I drove him. We of course did as hard a pull as the little 2.8 could do. He said his face was hurting because he was smiling so much both when he was driving and when he was a passenger. Maybe the bug has bit him now.

Anyway, later in the day son #2 gave it a go. Our driveway has a bit of a dip at the bottom. Well, he got hung up in there a bit and I think he wasn't letting the clutch out all the way. He stalled a couple times and then we started to get some smoke from the engine bay, presumably from the clutch. We switched and I backed out onto the street for him. He drove a bit down the road, probably a quarter mile or so, around a turn and then when he went to shift to 2nd he couldn't get it into gear. I think he wasn't pushing the clutch all the way down, so we pulled over and switched again. I headed up the slight incline, and then after we turned again I went 1st, 2nd and 3rd and on third I was slipping. By then we were on a slight downgrade, and I wasn't getting anything in any gear. We coasted down the hill and got close to home, then pushed the car the rest of the way to the house (with the help of a family of 6 that just happened to be driving by).

Anyway, clutch might be fried or might be fine after it cools off. I'm guessing with only 50k, it is the original clutch so it is probably pretty old. Might be just the excuse I need to tear things apart and see how they tick. Fun fun!

------------------
New Moon Rising - 1988 Black Formula
My Blue Heaven - 1965 Mustang Coupe

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84fiero123
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Report this Post12-24-2015 08:15 PM Click Here to See the Profile for 84fiero123Click Here to Email 84fiero123Send a Private Message to 84fiero123Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
If the smoke wasn't colored blue, black or any real dark color or smell bad I would guess you didn't cover the rear vents before the snow fell? And that may be all it is, most of us throw peace of 1/4" plywood over those when winter is coming, or some rug material, just cut ether one to size and in the spring when the snow has melted just store them under or behind each seat.

or it could be a leaking main seal in the engine or trany if it is colored smoke, clutch slipping has a smell all its own and you will know it when you smell it. But also if it was one of those seals it could also have damaged the clutch.

Enjoy

Steve

------------------
Technology is great when it works,
and one big pain in the ass when it doesn't



Detroit iron rules all the rest are just toys.

[This message has been edited by 84fiero123 (edited 12-24-2015).]

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Report this Post12-24-2015 08:36 PM Click Here to See the Profile for GTGeffSend a Private Message to GTGeffEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Check the clutch fluid reservoir level.
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Patrick
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Report this Post12-24-2015 08:44 PM Click Here to See the Profile for PatrickClick Here to Email PatrickSend a Private Message to PatrickEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Bob2112:

He stalled a couple times and then we started to get some smoke from the engine bay, presumably from the clutch.


A burning clutch has a distinctive aroma. What did you smell at the time?

 
quote
Originally posted by zzzhuh:

Hey Bob, I happened to stumble upon this video:

1988 Pontiac Fiero Formula


Uh oh, it's missing the wind deflector for the sunroof!

[This message has been edited by Patrick (edited 12-24-2015).]

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Bob2112
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Report this Post12-25-2015 02:19 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Bob2112Send a Private Message to Bob2112Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Thanks guys. I'll check the fluid level.

The smoke was pretty light colored, and was a rubbery type smell. Kind of like when a belt is slipping a lot and starts to smoke. I had driven it around earlier in the day, so I wouldn't think it was just snow/water steaming off the engine. The main reason I assumed it was the clutch was the fact that I had no grab from the engine when in gear.
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Report this Post12-25-2015 07:23 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Bob2112Send a Private Message to Bob2112Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Am I imagining things or did I see a post somewhere about someone that will take the VIN/Option tag and make a nice looking certificate listing things out? I've been trying google and Pennock's searches and I can't seem to track it down now.

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My Blue Heaven - 1965 Mustang Coupe

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Report this Post12-26-2015 01:24 AM Click Here to See the Profile for RexgirlSend a Private Message to RexgirlEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Is this what you are looking for?
http://fierostuff.com/RPOSheets.html
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Bob2112
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Report this Post12-26-2015 01:27 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Bob2112Send a Private Message to Bob2112Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I don't think so, but that is very handy. Thanks!!

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My Blue Heaven - 1965 Mustang Coupe

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Bob2112
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Report this Post12-29-2015 09:29 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Bob2112Send a Private Message to Bob2112Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Last week or so got this:



Today I got this!

[This message has been edited by Bob2112 (edited 08-28-2017).]

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Report this Post12-30-2015 01:06 AM Click Here to See the Profile for litespdSend a Private Message to litespdEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Bob2112:

Am I imagining things or did I see a post somewhere about someone that will take the VIN/Option tag and make a nice looking certificate listing things out? I've been trying google and Pennock's searches and I can't seem to track it down now.



You might try to message Fiero Toy Box here on the forum...that's Ray Paulk. He used to take the codes and make a nice printout of what everything was. Not sure if he still does it or not, or if he even frequents the forum anymore, but it's worth a shot.

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Report this Post01-01-2016 04:40 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Bob2112Send a Private Message to Bob2112Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Tried out the clutch today and it still is non-existent. Fluid looks fine, but no engagement at all. Once the weather warms up a bit I'll get the car up, the cradle down and mess around with it. Since I'll have the cradle down anyway, I figure I might as well just put a new clutch assembly in all at once. Assuming I'll be keeping the 2.8 in there for a year or two, what are some recommended upgrades to the clutch/transmission system? I'm not worried about the cost, although I don't want to go crazy since I plan to go the F40 route eventually.

------------------
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My Blue Heaven - 1965 Mustang Coupe

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Patrick
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Report this Post01-01-2016 05:14 PM Click Here to See the Profile for PatrickClick Here to Email PatrickSend a Private Message to PatrickEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Bob2112:

Tried out the clutch today and it still is non-existent. Fluid looks fine, but no engagement at all.


Clutch "engagement" can occur just fine with no fluid... so it's unclear what you're describing. A non-functioning clutch hydraulic system would result in no dis-engagement of the clutch.
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Report this Post01-01-2016 05:24 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Bob2112Send a Private Message to Bob2112Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I had just checked the fluid because someone mentioned it above. I agree, I wouldn't think fluid had anything to do with engagement.
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Report this Post01-01-2016 05:45 PM Click Here to See the Profile for PatrickClick Here to Email PatrickSend a Private Message to PatrickEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Bob2112:

I agree, I wouldn't think fluid had anything to do with engagement.


Correct, the fluid has nothing to do with clutch engagement.
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Report this Post01-05-2016 12:51 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Bob2112Send a Private Message to Bob2112Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Putting my shopping list together for when I pull out the transaxle to check out and probably replace the clutch. Figure I'll change the oil pan gasket, belts, fluids, maybe rear main seal, and put on Koni shocks and struts while I have the car up and cradle down.

What's the opinion on clutch kits? Should I just stick with a stock replacement or go with a RAM HDX? I doubt I'll be getting much more power out of the 2.8 anytime soon, but if the HDX doesn't noticeably increase the amount of pressure it takes to press the clutch pedal then I wouldn't think it would hurt to upgrade.

Also, any other parts I should replace while the car is up?

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Report this Post01-05-2016 01:14 PM Click Here to See the Profile for zzzhuhSend a Private Message to zzzhuhEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Bob2112:

What's the opinion on clutch kits? Should I just stick with a stock replacement or go with a RAM HDX? I doubt I'll be getting much more power out of the 2.8 anytime soon, but if the HDX doesn't noticeably increase the amount of pressure it takes to press the clutch pedal then I wouldn't think it would hurt to upgrade.

Also, any other parts I should replace while the car is up?



I've read people doing 3.4L swaps and recommend the stock AC delco clutch replacement. It has a nice clutch feel, and quality as well. If the RAM is less, I'd get it. But no need to waste money on something that might be more of a leg workout, than an 'improvement.'

If you aren't in a rush, I'd take off the manifolds and port them. It's a good 5-10HP gain. Patrick can chime in on his tool set he uses that will take about 10 seconds to port each hole.

[This message has been edited by zzzhuh (edited 01-05-2016).]

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Report this Post01-05-2016 02:43 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Bob2112Send a Private Message to Bob2112Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Porting isn't a bad idea. The engine will be hanging, but I'm sure the exhaust manifolds will be easier to take out since the cross over pipe is disconnected anyway. Then after I get the car back down, it wouldn't be much trouble to pull the intake from above. The coolant will already be out, air filter housing off, and probably some other small parts out of the way. I'll see what I can find on the interwebs about porting. I'll be picking up a cheap die grinder this weekend since they are on sale at HF. I could also pick up a dremel tool while I'm at it.

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Report this Post01-06-2016 03:40 AM Click Here to See the Profile for PatrickClick Here to Email PatrickSend a Private Message to PatrickEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by zzzhuh:

If you aren't in a rush, I'd take off the manifolds and port them. It's a good 5-10HP gain. Patrick can chime in on his tool set he uses that will take about 10 seconds to port each hole.


As requested...

 
quote
Originally posted by Patrick in This thread:

My buddy has a Hole Saw kit (similar to what's pictured below) which includes a cutter which is the exact same size as the inside of the manifold ports.

You may not wish to hear this, but it takes about ten seconds per port to do a perfect job! I'm not kidding. I'm surprised more people don't use this method.





And regarding a replacement clutch... I installed a LUK 04088 clutch kit ($74.79 at RockAuto) in my '88 Formula more than two years ago. Daily driven and autocrossed repeatedly. Works just fine.

[This message has been edited by Patrick (edited 01-06-2016).]

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Bob2112
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Report this Post01-06-2016 03:42 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Bob2112Send a Private Message to Bob2112Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Awesome - thanks! That is a nice price for a clutch - I'll check it out.

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New Moon Rising - 1988 Black Formula
My Blue Heaven - 1965 Mustang Coupe

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Bob2112
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Report this Post01-12-2016 11:18 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Bob2112Send a Private Message to Bob2112Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Ordered up most my parts, should be here over the coming week. Clutch, gaskets (oil pan, rear main, valve covers, intake, exhaust), and belts. Also got some 12 ton jack stands at HF on sale this weekend to get the car up nice and high.

Anyway - what's the best shock for the front since Koni doesn't make the front anymore?

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New Moon Rising - 1988 Black Formula
My Blue Heaven - 1965 Mustang Coupe

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Patrick
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Report this Post01-12-2016 11:28 PM Click Here to See the Profile for PatrickClick Here to Email PatrickSend a Private Message to PatrickEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Bob2112:

Anyway - what's the best shock for the front since Koni doesn't make the front anymore?


Some people might say KYB, but I doubt you'd notice much if any difference between them and Monroe Sensa-Tracs.
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Bob2112
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Report this Post01-12-2016 11:30 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Bob2112Send a Private Message to Bob2112Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Guess I'll treat them as equal and see which I can get cheaper.

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New Moon Rising - 1988 Black Formula
My Blue Heaven - 1965 Mustang Coupe

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Patrick
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Report this Post01-12-2016 11:50 PM Click Here to See the Profile for PatrickClick Here to Email PatrickSend a Private Message to PatrickEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Bob2112:

Guess I'll treat them as equal and see which I can get cheaper.


Check Monroe's website. Every year about this time they offer rebates on Sensa-Tracs. Several years ago (after rebate) I paid a total of $40 (which included shipping) for a complete set of shocks and struts. Yes, ten bucks apiece!
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