I was messing around on my uncles VIO program yesterday, which stands for Vehicles in Operation. I wanted to see how many fieros were still registered in the US and on the roads, and the number is disappointing: 30,774.
You have to consider that there are many Fieros that are garaged and unregistered. How many Fiero owners show/drive one car while storing 3 others or having "works in progress cars.". I would say the number of Fieros remaining in circulation is probably closer to 80-100K.
------------------ " THE BLACK PARALYZER" -87GT 3800SC Series III engine, custom ZZP /Frozen Boost Intercooler setup, 3.4" Pulley, Powerlog manifold, Northstar TB, LS1 MAF, 3" Flotech Afterburner Exhaust, Autolite 104's, MSD wires, Custom CAI, 4T65eHD w. custom axles, HP Tuners VCM Suite. "THE COLUSSUS" 87GT - ALL OUT 3.4L Turbocharged engine, Garrett Hybrid Turbo, MSD ign., modified TH125H " ON THE LOOSE WITHOUT THE JUICE "
I recently made some off the cuff projections of Fieros left, not in salvage yards, Worldwide. Strictly guesses, but I based my estimates on the following: (# left)
1984 20% left 1985 30% left 1986 40% left 1987 50% left 1988 75% left
This totals to about 125,000. Would be interested in others input on these %.
I'd say that's about right. As most changes to the Fiero occurred as it aged, these models are the ones people tend to collect. It's not often you see people ecstatic about having an '84 these days.
I'd say that's about right. As most changes to the Fiero occurred as it aged, these models are the ones people tend to collect. It's not often you see people ecstatic about having an '84 these days.
But 84's are the more likely car I run into driving around. That or an 86GT, I rarely see another 88 except an older gentleman who lives near me.
I was messing around on my uncles VIO program yesterday, which stands for Vehicles in Operation. I wanted to see how many fieros were still registered in the US and on the roads, and the number is disappointing: 30,774.
30774 fieros still in operation isnt a whole lot.
Matt
I'm not usually a pessimist, but I go months without seeing a Fiero on the road. My guess is that 30,744 is way too high for Fieros still on the road.
Also registered and on the road are two different things. I have three registered and two haven't left the yard in over a year.
I Agree. 30,xxx+ seems way too high. As a basic rule of thumb, how often do you see a Fiero driving around as compared with a newer "rare" car. For example a new high performance edition car with a production number of 35 or 40 thousand. Which one do you see more of? If I were to take a guess, the number is more like 20,000. Perhaps much less.
how many are still titled as a fiero..(kit cars) how many are not reg. and insured.. (most project cars) how many are reg with the r.m.v. as a different model.. the r.m.v. reg. of mine list it as an "indy" how many are used/owned buy a mechanic and they slap a repair plate on it when they want to take it out.. how many are solocross cars.. how is that "program" collecting the data?
I'd say there is about 42% of production left.. with a good number of them titled as something else.. because of laws governing kitcars..
I do not have the number of Fieros on the road or still just with us.
The fact is there are still a hell of a lot of them around as they are far from rare. If you want to see or find one you still can.
Even at 31,000 that is a hell of a lot of cars and we need to keep this in perspective.
If you own a rare car you have to work for months to find one or even buy one. Some may take years to locate. Then to find parts are even more difficult.
Just in my drive to work this week I have seen 3 on the road. While not a great number this is still a sign that they are very active and abundent. Also many are unresgisterd and are difficult to account for. They may be restoreable or they could even be in junk condition but there is no way to know.
TO be honest I feel there are many more cars of the Fiero era even in much shorter supply. When was the last time you saw a Turbo Sunbird or Turbo Grand Am. In fact when was the last time you even saw many other models from Pontiac of this era on the road other than a Trans Am/FIrebired. How long has it been you saw a 1987 Bonneville or even a 6000.
As most cars of the 84-88 era go the Fiero survives in what I find greater numbers than most other models.
Fewer in numbers yes Rare hardly.
[This message has been edited by hyperv6 (edited 11-17-2012).]
I have one sitting in the garage thats not tagged and the new neighbor just showed up a few days ago with a 88 thats not tagged....He also has a 95 firebird sitting next to it.....I still need to go introduce my self.
ya that seems amasing low considering there where 250k produced i believe.
30,774 out of 250K would be almost 12.3%. I'm assuming this excludes sales in Canada, etc but it sounds reasonable. 12% is probably much higher than, say, 1984-88 Cavaliers or Ford Escorts, two models produced in far greater numbers.
My own theory - out of those 30K, there might be several thousand that are not driveable, and there might be another several thousand others out there that are not registered. I doubt if there are any more than about 40K remaining regardless.
I'm not usually a pessimist, but I go months without seeing a Fiero on the road. My guess is that 30,744 is way too high for Fieros still on the road.
Also registered and on the road are two different things. I have three registered and two haven't left the yard in over a year.
Registered, on the road and in storage are all different things. Consider that 15 million Model T Fords were built of which it is estimated that 500,000 to 1 million still remain. Model T's are very common and we hardly see those cars on the road. Point is that old cars eventually become collector and show cars. Many of the hobbiests that own them seldom drive them and when they do its usually to a car show or cruise night. The Pontiac Fiero is a curio, collectible, "cult classic car", poor mans hot rod,and even a daily driver for some. You rarely see them in junkyards these days so what remain will probably be wih us for a long time.
------------------ " THE BLACK PARALYZER" -87GT 3800SC Series III engine, custom ZZP /Frozen Boost Intercooler setup, 3.4" Pulley, Powerlog manifold, Northstar TB, LS1 MAF, 3" Flotech Afterburner Exhaust, Autolite 104's, MSD wires, Custom CAI, 4T65eHD w. custom axles, HP Tuners VCM Suite. "THE COLUSSUS" 87GT - ALL OUT 3.4L Turbocharged engine, Garrett Hybrid Turbo, MSD ign., modified TH125H " ON THE LOOSE WITHOUT THE JUICE "
30,774 out of 250K would be almost 12.3%. I'm assuming this excludes sales in Canada, etc but it sounds reasonable. 12% is probably much higher than, say, 1984-88 Cavaliers or Ford Escorts, two models produced in far greater numbers.
My own theory - out of those 30K, there might be several thousand that are not driveable, and there might be another several thousand others out there that are not registered. I doubt if there are any more than about 40K remaining regardless.
That sounds right to me, my guess would be in the 40-60k range when you include the unregistered ones.
Total number of Fieros built were 370,167. Of those approximately 27,730 were sold in Canada.
While it may be possible to get some figures on Fieros still registered, numbers of how many still exist is always going to be a guess and probably always wrong.
Canadian Fiero Sales figures (or why it's hard to find them here) Got this from Pontiac Historical Services (Canada) years ago.
Total Fiero sales in Canada for all models were approximately 11,000 units in 1984 7,000 units in 1985 6,000 units in 1986, 3,000 units in 1987 730 units in 1988.
For the trivia fans out there, based on total Canadian sales figures, our data books show the rarest options to be:
1984 Fiero Sport model 2PM37 - 9 with AM radio code UL6 1985 GT - 105 with Tan Leather interior code 643 1986 GT - 5 with rear carrier code V58 1987 GT - 12 with Light Saddle Leather interior code 622 1988 GT - 20 in color Bright Yellow code 53.
Canada imported 160 Fieros with Y82 Indy Fiero option in 1984.
And number of 88's sold in Canada: GT 423 FORMULA 139 BASIC 4CYL 168
Color numbers for 88 GT's: 27 in color 16 100 in color 40 93 in color 41 36 in color 77 147 in color 81
For GT models I believe the code for gold wheels was 60P on 96 cars and 19P for black wheels on 327 cars.
Total number of Fieros built were 370,167. Of those approximately 27,730 were sold in Canada.
Hmmm, 370K total? Take away the 27K sold in Canada and a generous 10K in the rest of the world, that would leave perhaps 330-340K sold here in the US. If 30,774 are registered that's only 8 or 9 percent. I believe it.
Number or Fieros sold or still daily driven varies greatly by region. In the mid-west it seems Fieros were sold in far greater numbers and and much more are still on the road. Here in Texas I might go 6 months to a year between Fiero sightings on the road. I am more likely to see a 57 Bel-air on the road than a Fiero.
True it's only going to be a guess how many exist until the census adds a question as to how many Fieros live at your house.
[This message has been edited by jscott1 (edited 11-17-2012).]
Number or Fieros sold or still daily driven varies greatly by region. In the mid-west it seems Fieros were sold in far greater numbers and and much more are still on the road. Here in Texas I might go 6 months to a year between Fiero sightings on the road. I am more likely to see a 57 Bel-air on the road than a Fiero.
True it's only going to be a guess how many exist until the census adds a question as to how many Fieros live at your house.
This is true on where you live as most were sold in the mid west and they are still not what you call a very rare site.
I see more Fiero's than 08-10 HHR SS here. I see Fiero's often but my HHR SS often will be the only one I see for months.
Just because you don't see em does not mean they are not out there.
If I had a dollar for every one I see dead in the yard with expired plates or low mileage one in the garage with expired plates I would be rich.
We also have to consider that the Fiero was one of the highest annualy produced two seat sports cars of all time.
Some of the most popular and higest produced two seaters of the period were the Miata, MR2 and Vette. Of these the Miat and MR2 averaged less than 18,000 units per year and some years did not break 10,000 units.
The Vette is also one that could average 30,000 unit to last years 12,000 units.
So even what I feel is a low number here at 30K+ is still a big number.
The day that there are few Fiero's left you will sell it for more than 10 times what it is worth now and you will not be able to find parts. .......I am not holding my breath as I will be very old or in the ground by then.
I suspect there may be as may as a third of the cars left in total running, registered, dead , unregistered etc. The fact is there is no way to know or even really find out, How many of these threads do we have to post to come to the reality of it.
No matter what the number Fiero's are still available in great numbers for the year and type of car it is and will remain so as so many are willing to sit on them running or not.
I have four Fieros and none of them are registered. Yet. Two of them may be back on the road next year.
Dave: Don't mean to hijack this post but have to ask where ya been all these years? I remember you from back in the mid 90's when we only had the Fiero mailing list and the Fiero Factory meets. Good to hear that ypou still have your Fieros. Proves that Fiero owners may go dormant for a while but they eventually surface again. We only had the Dukes, 60* V6's and the SBC option back then. How times have changed.
------------------ " THE BLACK PARALYZER" -87GT 3800SC Series III engine, custom ZZP /Frozen Boost Intercooler setup, 3.4" Pulley, Powerlog manifold, Northstar TB, LS1 MAF, 3" Flotech Afterburner Exhaust, Autolite 104's, MSD wires, Custom CAI, 4T65eHD w. custom axles, HP Tuners VCM Suite. "THE COLUSSUS" 87GT - ALL OUT 3.4L Turbocharged engine, Garrett Hybrid Turbo, MSD ign., modified TH125H " ON THE LOOSE WITHOUT THE JUICE "
This is an interesting topic to me in light of my involvement with classic GTO's. Although '64-'74 Goats are obviously much older, they are still being found in barns and garages regularly. I believe that there are probably WAY more than 30,000 Fiero's still in existence. This is a HUGE country, and there are literally millions of cars being stored in barns, garages, storage units, and back yards. There are a whole litany of reasons why people hold onto cars that have not been registered, insured, or anywhere near for road for long periods, even decades. Granted, a Fiero is not a GTO, and not as many people are likely to hold onto one as would hold onto a classic Goat, but I'll but there are thousands of Fiero's all over this country waiting to be "fixed up," restored, or generally returned to the open road. I have 2, and only my '86 has moved under ts own power, much less been registered, in the last 5 years. Just look how many members on here have already chimed in owning multiple cars, with the majority unregistered. Fiero's are still out there. What is more likely is that there are only 30,000 owners willing to put in the time, money, and effort to keep one on the road.
The amount of members here would make it likely incorrect . I would think there are 20,000 members here making Pennocks an army of nearly every fiero owner on the road?
600+ per state. I think that's actually pretty good. I wonder how many first generation MR2's RX7's or 240Z's are still registered? I doubt that it not even close to 30,000.
[This message has been edited by carnut122 (edited 11-20-2012).]
