Now i was thinking this today- abotu minimum wage- its like 5 or 6 bucks now right? Well weith gsa going up to 3 bucks a gallon (2.98 yeterday)
Now this is my proposed goal lets come up with a list- (MN area seeing this can be sorta area specific) of logical amount for one to live upon. Now there is food of coruse then there is car insurance- and gas as well. Then there is rent - and utilities- and cable weather it be tv or internet or a mix. Ect. what does the bare minimume REALLY add up to? 1000? 1200? how much a month.
I say we do city rules- say 18-20 to the gallon (because we own fiers and hopefully at least the 2.8) this would include rent as well - so what- say let s give the hypothetical 4 room mates eh?
So how bought it guys opinions, thoughts, lists ect. ?
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11:33 PM
PFF
System Bot
sostock Member
Posts: 5907 From: Grain Valley, MO Registered: May 2005
There's an easy solution to the gas prices. Don't drive. My mother and I are on welfare, we flat out 100% can't afford the insurance or upkeep on a car anyway, so there's no need for gas.
Internet and cable TV are neccessities of life---like food and housing???? didn't think so.
When my financial inflow no longer met my cash outflow (4 kids born in 3 yrs will do that), I did the most natural thing. I got a 2nd job. No, min wage won't go far, nor is it intended to. It just keeps a person from starving. It's not intended to buy a home, buy a car, buy a computer, or any other big ticket things--it's just what it says-a minimum starting place. Personally, I don't remember ever working for minimum wage, unless you count the summers I worked when I was a teenager. Hauling hay for 20 cents/bale wasn't much but it was better than min wage way back when, and I hauled a LOT of bales of hay.
Internet and cable TV are neccessities of life---like food and housing???? didn't think so.
When my financial inflow no longer met my cash outflow (4 kids born in 3 yrs will do that), I did the most natural thing. I got a 2nd job. No, min wage won't go far, nor is it intended to. It just keeps a person from starving. It's not intended to buy a home, buy a car, buy a computer, or any other big ticket things--it's just what it says-a minimum starting place. Personally, I don't remember ever working for minimum wage, unless you count the summers I worked when I was a teenager. Hauling hay for 20 cents/bale wasn't much but it was better than min wage way back when, and I hauled a LOT of bales of hay.
the cable tv was ment as a pass at some one i know - not even specifically on our forums- but mostly a joke- so you can ignor it
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12:06 AM
jstricker Member
Posts: 12956 From: Russell, KS USA Registered: Apr 2002
Rent 250 Gas/Electric 100 Sewer/other utilities 50 Telephone 25 Renter Insurance 35 Food 100 Clothing 35 Car Insurance 30 Car Fuel 35 Car Maintenance 25
For gasoline, I figured that you'd put on about 75 miles a week or 300/mo. If you get close to 30, that's 10 gallons or $30 but I allowed $35 and to be honest, if you're driving more than 300 miles per month you're either a) driving a lot more than just to work or b) need to move closer to where you work.
While I'm sure some will think that's being too harsh because you "can't live where you want to" I say tough luck, get back into school and learn a skill so you can get a job that pays you more so you can commute.
Add 'em up and it comes to about $685/mo to squeak by, net. For a 160 hour work week, that's about minimum wage after taxes and such if you live alone. If you have a roomate, you can knock about $200 off of that and have a little bit to set aside for the inevitable rainy day. Of course you have to be frugal to do this.
Looking at the graph, you can see your fuel expense is just a small part of your living expenses even at $3/gallon.
When I was in college, I did just like Don says. I went to school full time, worked part time as a mechanic at an IHC truck dealership, and worked from 8pm to 2 am on Tues, Weds (college town party night), & Fri nights, and from 6 pm to 2 am on Saturday nights as a bouncer/bartender. I was averaging 4 hours/day on weekdays and 5 hours on Saturdays at the IH dealership for about a 30 hour week and another 26 hours at the club. That means I was working 56 hour weeks and going to school full time. At minimum wage now, that would be a gross of about $5.15 X 56 = $1,153, after taxes that would be about $950 net.
Pretty accurate John--except around here, I don't think you can rent anything at all for $250mo. The 1st apt I rented here was not the best or the worst (by a long shot), and ran me $380/mo . I paid elec, phone, and and they paid water, sewer, and basic cable. So subtracting the $50 sewer/other utilities you have there--from $380, I still paid more than $250 mo---$320.
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01:15 AM
86GT3.4DOHC Member
Posts: 10007 From: Marion Ohio Registered: Apr 2004
i spend about $75 a month on gas for non-discretionary driving. that's a 10 mile round trip to and from work, and 60 miles twice a week to and from school (i AM, after all, trying to better myself so i can have a better job). unfortunately, the state was thoughtless enough to locate the university in another town. speaking of university, theres the lovely and ever-rising tuition. i suppose i could just get a job where i go to school but then i'd either need to commute 60 miles every day, or sell the house and move. or i could quit school, and be content with my plight. yeah, that's the ticket!
auto insurance? i pay 300/year for minimal coverage. i used to pay 600 before i became statistically "old" and cheap to insure.
most people here dont live within 5 miles of work, and a 30 mile each way commute is not unusual. nor is it unusual to spend an hour and a half sitting in traffic going to or from nashville for those high paying jobs. i used to do that, for a $40/hr job in DC and Atlanta, but i gave it up. i'm much happier now.
love of money is the root of all evil. but it's ok, i just like it
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01:47 AM
DjDraggin Member
Posts: 2854 From: St Louis, MO. USA Registered: Feb 2003
250 a month to rent?? damn son I spend that a month on my gas card!! Dont even get me started on what my new house is going to cost me.. lets just say I wish i had about 5 arms and 7 legs..
------------------ Ferrari 308 GTB rebody on a modified 86SE chasis Soon to have a highly hooped up 3800SC..Ohh yeah baby!! I like a lil Whine with my meal when I go out to eat Rice Contacts _ AIM / Zildjianfx _ Yahoo / djdraggin Remember, always brush your milk, drink your teeth, dont do sleep and get eight hours of drugs.
So far, it looks like this summer I'll be driving 500 miles a month JUST to and from work. That's compared with about 640 miles a month commuting to school. So, I'd guess that if I went to school and work (and I do), and had some misc. driving, I'd easily put on 1000-1200 miles a month.
Unless I move into a shithole apartment, I can't really move closer to my place of employment. I used to live about 2 miles from it, now I live about 12 miles from it. When I was looking at houses to rent with my Dad, there were houses less than a mile from my office. I could have easily BIKED to work from there, but I'd still have to commute to school and rent would be $2000/mo total. Right now, where I'm living, we're splitting rent and I'm paying about $450 per month.
So, saying that I drive 1000 miles per month, that's about $140 per month in gas. I also pay $200 a month in insurance on my cars. Add in another $200 a month for food (again, splitting with my Dad). Another $200 for misc. stuff. That's about $1190 per month going out. I pull in about $1500 per month working a little over double minimum wage here in GA (min. wage is $5.15 here). I'm operating within my means, thats most of what matters. That also leaves me with about $300 "emergency" cash, I don't have medical insurance or anything like that (I'm expendible, damn republicans!), so any emergencies better be cheap to fix.
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02:42 AM
under8ted Member
Posts: 1108 From: Sparta, ON, Canada Registered: Mar 2006
Rent 250 Gas/Electric 100 Sewer/other utilities 50 Telephone 25 Renter Insurance 35 Food 100 Clothing 35 Car Insurance 30 Car Fuel 35 Car Maintenance 25
For gasoline, I figured that you'd put on about 75 miles a week or 300/mo. If you get close to 30, that's 10 gallons or $30 but I allowed $35 and to be honest, if you're driving more than 300 miles per month you're either a) driving a lot more than just to work or b) need to move closer to where you work.
While I'm sure some will think that's being too harsh because you "can't live where you want to" I say tough luck, get back into school and learn a skill so you can get a job that pays you more so you can commute.
Add 'em up and it comes to about $685/mo to squeak by, net. For a 160 hour work week, that's about minimum wage after taxes and such if you live alone. If you have a roomate, you can knock about $200 off of that and have a little bit to set aside for the inevitable rainy day. Of course you have to be frugal to do this.
Looking at the graph, you can see your fuel expense is just a small part of your living expenses even at $3/gallon.
When I was in college, I did just like Don says. I went to school full time, worked part time as a mechanic at an IHC truck dealership, and worked from 8pm to 2 am on Tues, Weds (college town party night), & Fri nights, and from 6 pm to 2 am on Saturday nights as a bouncer/bartender. I was averaging 4 hours/day on weekdays and 5 hours on Saturdays at the IH dealership for about a 30 hour week and another 26 hours at the club. That means I was working 56 hour weeks and going to school full time. At minimum wage now, that would be a gross of about $5.15 X 56 = $1,153, after taxes that would be about $950 net.
John Stricker
John, you're either a. insane, or b. european, if you think someone is supposed to live on 300 miles per month. Average car gets 12000 miles on it per year, that's about 1000 per month. Even with roadtrips that doesn't balance out.
John, I already have a job that pays more so I can commute. Gas prices hurt even more. Let me guess, suck it up and move closer, or use public transportation? Or if those fail, get a job in my area? Moving closer would cost much more than I'm currently paying in rent, and it would cancel out any positives I'd gain from the lesser commute. Public transportation doesn't even run from my house to my job. And, in the situation we have right now, I'm not leaving my current job just so I can be closer.
And oh yeah, even though I make twice minimum wage, I still think I'd be considered "poor". Working full time I'd make about $21,000 a year. As for working 2 jobs, no wonder men die earlier than women, we're getting worked to death! I shouldn't have to be a slave struggling with 2 jobs to make $40,000 a year while some CEO makes millions a year playing golf. But then again, that's the republican way isn't it? "You're too weak to become a CEO fatcat yourself? Too bad, get back to slaving away". I'm all for smaller government, but the playing field HAS to be evened out. Not everyone gets the same opportunities for success.
I''ve got a 6-star discount rating, plus multi-car discount and still pay $90/mo for liability-only, and thats as a statistical old fart.
Heh, cheap insurance? I'm with USAA and paying $200 a month for 3 cars, two of which are Fieros, and the other is a 8-cylinder Camaro. And I'm 20 with no real attachments (no g/f, kids, etc), so I'm statistically likely to go nuts and do 140 mph and total a car. Not to say that I haven't done something like that. I've gone 140 mph, but didn't total the car. Only time I've ever done that, I'll probably never have the balls to do it again, I think that much over the limit equals a lost license and jailtime. So the insurance isn't actually that bad, I know guys driving Civics and other little econoboxes that pay the same amount per year (with 1 car). Also, apparently the Fieros cost the same to insure as the Camaro, the insurance companies see them just as dangerous in the hands of a 20 year old male as a 350 hp, 0-60 in 5 seconds, tires smoking, 160 mph Camaro. That really made me go .
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02:59 AM
aceman Member
Posts: 4899 From: Brooklyn Center, MN Registered: Feb 2003
I don't know where you heard that. Poverty level for one person, no kids, in 2003 was 9,393. My wife and I together don't spend $3,000/year on food, much less just on me, and we eat pretty well.
John Stricker
quote
Originally posted by 86GT3.4DOHC:
Dunno what its worth, but the poverty level is defined as 3x a yearly food budget.
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09:41 AM
jstricker Member
Posts: 12956 From: Russell, KS USA Registered: Apr 2002
I'll bet you that SOMEWHERE in California I can find a place to live for $250 per month. Want to bet?
I know our housing costs are lower here, I never claimed otherwise. You want a pretty nice 3 BR 2B home for under $100K? Well come on down because we have them in several towns and out in the country. I've posted links numerous times showing the asking prices of houses just like this in my area for that kind of money. We actually have very little renting going on here because $250 or a little more a month will make the mortgage payments.
Even if you ARE right and a small efficiency apartment costs you $600/mo, you can still have a roomate and be back down in that ballpark.
John Stricker
quote
Originally posted by Telegram Sam:
$250 a month for rent? Not in California. That won't even rent a room. Triple that for a nasty studio apartment.
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09:45 AM
Rainman Member
Posts: 3877 From: Cincinnati, Ohio Registered: Jan 2003
300 miles/month? Maybe if you smoke crack all day.
I average just over 2K miles/month commuting to work and back, about 44 miles each way, stop and go 4-5 lane highway traffic, both directions, everyday. I could move closer, but nobody lives in the city unless they can't afford to live elsewhere. Can you say suburban sprawl.
And any house under 100K in this area, would probably be condemned and slated for demo.
As for renting something cheap, income guidelines apply. I pay >$600/month for my 500 sqft apt. To find any cheaper around here I would have to qualify for income assistance.
But, I am a very cheap/frugal person. I make a decent income, I have no home phone, no cable tv, I eat extremely cheap, my only extravagances are broadband internet and cell phone. My newest car is a '91 with 240K+ miles.
[This message has been edited by Rainman (edited 05-14-2006).]
Mcdonalds pays their employees the least amount they can according to the gov- lots of cashiers at smaller stores do this as well- that glasses shop downt he street kind of thing. These are the kind of things i am talkign about.
I put about oh 100 bucks a month in gas in. For an apartment around andover/anoka area its from 350 (being the lowest i have EVER seen) to 650 for just a single room.and the 350 usually does not include utilities- and there is usually about a grand for down payment. I have to pay abotu a 300 dollar bill toward brakes this month - joy- food well i am 5'7" (and a quarter and i am damn proud of that quarter) so i don't eat that much. I was in an accident about 3 years ago it is going to be off in about 6 months- sutpid kid kidn of thing- i pay about 200-220 a month for car insurance liability. I have more clothes then god seeing that i have not grown much but as fashion goes and when my mother thought "hey you need to keep up with style" that made my wardrobe big so no worries there ever. Renter insurance i can't remember seeing that i don't rent telephoen is abotu right for 25-30 a month. I usue ALOT of electricity but not much in gas seeing tha ti am a blanket and wear alot of cloths type of person- and also seeign that i used to work in a lumber yard i can just through on my carharts.
So i think 1200-1500 and 1500 is sound more like it because just in case the soccer mom hits you in her crysler van. and that is about 11 bucks an hour. i say 13 an hour hten one is makeing about 2k a month then one can live fairly easily unless you don't know how to spend your money at all.
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09:50 AM
jstricker Member
Posts: 12956 From: Russell, KS USA Registered: Apr 2002
I pay $350.70 per month to these two companies. Insured on these policies are:
1998 Buick Riviera, Full Coverage 1973 Pontiac Grand Am, Stated Value 1980 IHC Scout, restored, state value 1985 Pontiac Fiero/Finale, stated value 1994 GMC 1/2 T 4WD Pickup, Full coverage 1983 GMC 3/4 T 2WD Utility bed service Truck, Full coverage 1973 IHC Scout Pickup, Liability Only 1974 IHC 3/4T Pickup, Liability Only 1974 IHC 1600 2T Truck, Full Coverage 1981 IHC 1700 2T Truck, Full Coverage 1980 IHC CO 9670 Semi Tractor, Liability and Collision 1998 Tempte Grain Trailer, Full Coverage
That's 12 individual vehicles with mixes of full coverag and liability only averaging $25.47 each per month. It pays to have a good claim history and driving record for anyone that's going to be in the vehicles.
John Stricker
quote
Originally posted by under8ted:
Where are you guys getting such cheap insurance?
I''ve got a 6-star discount rating, plus multi-car discount and still pay $90/mo for liability-only, and thats as a statistical old fart.
[This message has been edited by jstricker (edited 05-14-2006).]
Heh, cheap insurance? I'm with USAA and paying $200 a month for 3 cars, two of which are Fieros, and the other is a 8-cylinder Camaro. And I'm 20 with no real attachments (no g/f, kids, etc), so I'm statistically likely to go nuts and do 140 mph and total a car. Not to say that I haven't done something like that. I've gone 140 mph, but didn't total the car. Only time I've ever done that, I'll probably never have the balls to do it again, I think that much over the limit equals a lost license and jailtime. So the insurance isn't actually that bad, I know guys driving Civics and other little econoboxes that pay the same amount per year (with 1 car). Also, apparently the Fieros cost the same to insure as the Camaro, the insurance companies see them just as dangerous in the hands of a 20 year old male as a 350 hp, 0-60 in 5 seconds, tires smoking, 160 mph Camaro. That really made me go .
Well then you get a multi car discountf for one- and two are you odler then 21? 25? both ages yrou Ins goes down so if you are as young as i am then your car ins would go up? I am using state farm - i personally can't stand the company and need less ins- this is one thing that is KILLING me EVERY month-its a small bill yes 200 bucks but it all adds up. i have a 94 saffari van and a 85 gt fiero.
Is it a local company real small? cause if we get that up here in MN and it really is that LOW. then i would LOVE to swtich over to something sooooooo low. I mean seeing that you have mulitple cars- if i pay the van as my main vehcile it is about 193 with everythign else wich adds to about 203 a month- then as the fiero as the main it costs abtou 216- with paying the fiero as a second vehcil as well then it is another 65 a month so that is about 260 a month with van fist and fiero second. and i have not done it the other way around yet.
Why? The reason you drive so much is because you can afford it, plain and simple. If you couldn't you'd do something different. When Chris lived in Hays, going to school and working, he filled up his Bronco every two weeks and it took about 12 gallons, but it also only got about 17 mpg. The original poster specified 30 mpg, not 17, so that's what I used. Just because you can't do it (or aren't willing to) doesn't mean it's not possible. Chris moved to Ann Arbor, MI, last August and hasn't even HAD a car, walking or taking public transportation to work, so don't say it can't be done.
John Stricker
quote
Originally posted by Tinton:
John, you're either a. insane, or b. european, if you think someone is supposed to live on 300 miles per month. Average car gets 12000 miles on it per year, that's about 1000 per month. Even with roadtrips that doesn't balance out.
John, I already have a job that pays more so I can commute. Gas prices hurt even more. Let me guess, suck it up and move closer, or use public transportation? Or if those fail, get a job in my area? Moving closer would cost much more than I'm currently paying in rent, and it would cancel out any positives I'd gain from the lesser commute. Public transportation doesn't even run from my house to my job. And, in the situation we have right now, I'm not leaving my current job just so I can be closer.
And oh yeah, even though I make twice minimum wage, I still think I'd be considered "poor". Working full time I'd make about $21,000 a year. As for working 2 jobs, no wonder men die earlier than women, we're getting worked to death! I shouldn't have to be a slave struggling with 2 jobs to make $40,000 a year while some CEO makes millions a year playing golf. But then again, that's the republican way isn't it? "You're too weak to become a CEO fatcat yourself? Too bad, get back to slaving away". I'm all for smaller government, but the playing field HAS to be evened out. Not everyone gets the same opportunities for success.
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10:09 AM
Rainman Member
Posts: 3877 From: Cincinnati, Ohio Registered: Jan 2003
If you're young and want cheaper ins than State Farm, check out Allstate. I saved over $1800/year switching to them for identical coverage at the age of 23. I'm 25 now and paying $40/month, for one primary car and comp on my two cars in storage.
I do agree witi Stricker that it can be done, just might not be fun doing it. I fill up my tank almost every 3rd day, 15 gallon tank, sometimes I drive more and fill every other day. OPEC loves me. It is I causing the strain on gas supply.
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10:27 AM
jstricker Member
Posts: 12956 From: Russell, KS USA Registered: Apr 2002
See my response to Tinton. Right now my son drives 0 miles per month because he doesn't have a car and hasn't had one since last August. What you think is a necessity another man might think a luxury or even wasteful.
Quite honestly, I don't give a crap if any house in your area that is under $100k would be slated for demolition (a statement I doubt factually, but whatever). If it's too expensive for you to live in an area for what your skills command your being paid, the get the F out of there.
Look, the original question was "can someone live on minimum wage?". Yes, they can. Not everywhere. Not and buy a $100,000 house. Not and drive 10,000 miles a month. But live, survive, take care of their own necessities. Most of the responses I read here tell me one thing, there are a lot of people that don't understand the difference between a want and a need.
John Stricker
quote
Originally posted by Rainman:
300 miles/month? Maybe if you smoke crack all day.
I average just over 2K miles/month commuting to work and back, about 44 miles each way, stop and go 4-5 lane highway traffic, both directions, everyday. I could move closer, but nobody lives in the city unless they can't afford to live elsewhere. Can you say suburban sprawl.
And any house under 100K in this area, would probably be condemned and slated for demo.
As for renting something cheap, income guidelines apply. I pay >$600/month for my 500 sqft apt. To find any cheaper around here I would have to qualify for income assistance.
But, I am a very cheap/frugal person. I make a decent income, I have no home phone, no cable tv, I eat extremely cheap, my only extravagances are broadband internet and cell phone. My newest car is a '91 with 240K+ miles.
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10:32 AM
Rainman Member
Posts: 3877 From: Cincinnati, Ohio Registered: Jan 2003
Not looking for a confrontation, as I do agree with you.
I just did a search for homes in the area for $100K or less on RealEstate.com. There aren't any. I did find one for $149K: Property Features: Fixer - Seller to do no repairs- SOLD AS-IS
Sounds like my kind of place!
Come on. Ann Arbor is a college town. Of course its going to be walkable/survivable without a car.
[This message has been edited by Rainman (edited 05-14-2006).]
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10:37 AM
aceman Member
Posts: 4899 From: Brooklyn Center, MN Registered: Feb 2003
Mcdonalds pays their employees the least amount they can according to the gov- lots of cashiers at smaller stores do this as well- that glasses shop downt he street kind of thing. These are the kind of things i am talkign about.
I put about oh 100 bucks a month in gas in. For an apartment around andover/anoka area its from 350 (being the lowest i have EVER seen) to 650 for just a single room.and the 350 usually does not include utilities- and there is usually about a grand for down payment. I have to pay abotu a 300 dollar bill toward brakes this month - joy- food well i am 5'7" (and a quarter and i am damn proud of that quarter) so i don't eat that much. I was in an accident about 3 years ago it is going to be off in about 6 months- sutpid kid kidn of thing- i pay about 200-220 a month for car insurance liability. I have more clothes then god seeing that i have not grown much but as fashion goes and when my mother thought "hey you need to keep up with style" that made my wardrobe big so no worries there ever. Renter insurance i can't remember seeing that i don't rent telephoen is abotu right for 25-30 a month. I usue ALOT of electricity but not much in gas seeing tha ti am a blanket and wear alot of cloths type of person- and also seeign that i used to work in a lumber yard i can just through on my carharts.
So i think 1200-1500 and 1500 is sound more like it because just in case the soccer mom hits you in her crysler van. and that is about 11 bucks an hour. i say 13 an hour hten one is makeing about 2k a month then one can live fairly easily unless you don't know how to spend your money at all.
a) Fast Food joints and convenience stores paying minimum wage in the Twin Cities???? BULLSH!T!!!! As stated, my son just recently got a job. Lowest starting pay at all the places he applied was $7/hr.
b) Can't afford the gas and insurance in a metro area????? TAKE PUBLIC TRANSPORTATION!
You guys drive a LOT more than I do, and I\ve been averaging an 800 mile round trip to e Tex once/mo or more often for the last 3 months. Even with that, I am driving less than 1000 miles/mo. Without the trips thrown in, I usually drive less than 100 miles/week--much less. 18 miles round trip to work 5 days/week--do my shopping on the way home. My car ins is 29 bucks/mo. I could take a bus to work for $1.20/day round trip.
Originally posted by aceman: a) Fast Food joints and convenience stores paying minimum wage in the Twin Cities???? BULLSH!T!!!! As stated, my son just recently got a job. Lowest starting pay at all the places he applied was $7/hr.
b) Can't afford the gas and insurance in a metro area????? TAKE PUBLIC TRANSPORTATION!
I have a friend making 6.50 an hour- at mcd's. just got the job............your son lucked out man. I am not trying to start a flame war- and oh btw you said you were going to email me with that info from your buddy- again its dupontlm@gdnmail.net
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11:32 AM
jstricker Member
Posts: 12956 From: Russell, KS USA Registered: Apr 2002
$6.50/hr is still $1.35 (or 26%) above the Federal Minimum Wage.
John Stricker
quote
Originally posted by vega: I have a friend making 6.50 an hour- at mcd's. just got the job............your son lucked out man. I am not trying to start a flame war- and oh btw you said you were going to email me with that info from your buddy- again its dupontlm@gdnmail.net
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11:50 AM
Formula88 Member
Posts: 53788 From: Raleigh NC Registered: Jan 2001
Geez, people. Use some common sense. The minimum wage may be fixed Federally, but individual states can, and some do, set it higher. Also, the local job market will also affect what employers hire for. That easily explains why a McNasty pays more in some locations than others. Not to mention if they have a dire need for specific shifts, those will obviously pay more.
quote
Originally posted by jstricker:
I'll bet you that SOMEWHERE in California I can find a place to live for $250 per month. Want to bet?
I know our housing costs are lower here, I never claimed otherwise. You want a pretty nice 3 BR 2B home for under $100K? Well come on down because we have them in several towns and out in the country. I've posted links numerous times showing the asking prices of houses just like this in my area for that kind of money. We actually have very little renting going on here because $250 or a little more a month will make the mortgage payments.
Even if you ARE right and a small efficiency apartment costs you $600/mo, you can still have a roomate and be back down in that ballpark.
John Stricker
That "somewhere" has to be also where the jobs are, or your mileage driven will go up due to your commute. But considering part of CA is desert, between LA and the wide open nothing, you'll find a huge range of prices. Just how many jobs are gonna be out there in the middle of nowhere, though? Can you find a place to live in Orange County, CA for $250 / mo? Only thing I think you'll find is a room to rent at best.
A small efficiency for $600 may be hard to find in some areas, and easy in others. A roommate in a 1 room apartment had better be a lover or it's going to get real crowded real fast. Of course, the overriding disclaimer is, as always, "You do what you have to do." If the only way you can afford to live is to rent a 1 room apartment with no separate bedroom and share it with 4 other guys, well, that's what you do until you can afford better. That or until the housing authority finds out and kicks you out for violating occupancy laws (varies by city/state).
My last apartment in Raleigh was $609/mo. That was for a 933 sq. ft. 1 bed / 1 bath apartment with a full kitchen, living room, dining room, sunroom, and deck. It was a bargain here and I had to look high and low to find it. The only reason I got it so cheap was they were running a special becasue the low interest rates were getting more people into houses and fewer people were looking for apartments.
As interest rates go up, apartment rentals will go up, too, because houses will become harder to afford, so more people will be looking for apartments.
Minimum wage is just that. A MINIMUM. What ever happened to American ingenuity and hard work? What happened to making your life better? What happened to going out and achieving and earning more than MINIMUM. From the way some of you are talking, you should go to China or Russia and enjoy the socialist way of life.
If I have to work at McDonald's, then you can be damn sure I'm going to work at both McD's and BK's/Wendy's to make more money or be working a lot of overtime or a second job. You want something, go out and earn it. Complaining about the high cost of living in a particular area? Then move. Life isn't fair, equal, just or free.
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11:56 AM
jstricker Member
Posts: 12956 From: Russell, KS USA Registered: Apr 2002
Sorry I missed your post. So you're spending $75/mo on gas, and Chris is spending $0, that averages out to $37.50.
I know that some people will have to drive more than that for (as you accurately put it) "non-discretionary driving". Heck, I do. I also live 15 miles from the nearest convenience store. I actually average about 8,000 miles a month, but most of that is business. But my driving is also nowhere near "normal". Even given your gas expense, you're still at a level that is 10% or less of your total monthly expenses. Yes, it hurts when gas goes up because if you were squeaking by before maybe clearing $20/month if you're a minimum wage earner, that is what gets ate up. I know that. But that's not the question as I read it.
The original poster basically said how can you make it with gas prices so high. People have come here now disputing my figures on rent and car insurance. Gas price has nothing to do with that and, in fact, makes the point that gas prices aren't that big a factor even more relevant because as your rent, utilities, insurance, etc. gets higher, gasoline is a smaller component of you overall expenses.
John Stricker
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Originally posted by lurker:
i spend about $75 a month on gas for non-discretionary driving. that's a 10 mile round trip to and from work, and 60 miles twice a week to and from school (i AM, after all, trying to better myself so i can have a better job). unfortunately, the state was thoughtless enough to locate the university in another town. speaking of university, theres the lovely and ever-rising tuition. i suppose i could just get a job where i go to school but then i'd either need to commute 60 miles every day, or sell the house and move. or i could quit school, and be content with my plight. yeah, that's the ticket!
auto insurance? i pay 300/year for minimal coverage. i used to pay 600 before i became statistically "old" and cheap to insure.
most people here dont live within 5 miles of work, and a 30 mile each way commute is not unusual. nor is it unusual to spend an hour and a half sitting in traffic going to or from nashville for those high paying jobs. i used to do that, for a $40/hr job in DC and Atlanta, but i gave it up. i'm much happier now.
love of money is the root of all evil. but it's ok, i just like it
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12:01 PM
jstricker Member
Posts: 12956 From: Russell, KS USA Registered: Apr 2002
Excellent post. I agree with most of it. It's always a trade off and that's my point as well. I'm NOT going to find an apartment in Orange County (probably) for $600/mo. That's why I wouldn't live there (well, one of the reasons). Some places are SO expensive to live that it's simply silly to me to try to live there..........so I don't. You know what, though? I know that not everyone wants to live in KS, in the middle of nowhere. Really, I do. Good for them. I'm not recruiting to get people to come here. I'd rather they put a sign on the roads as they come into the state saying "thanks for visiting but don't stay, we're full".
You're dead on about the "You do what you have to do." If the only skills you have at the time are flipping burgers and saying "would you like fries with that?" then you don't have many options and "You do what you have to do." Another job. Room mates. Eating Ramen noodles and rice 5 days a week. Whatever it takes. That's not a life I care to lead but if any of you think I haven't lived it you're sorely mistaken.
I lived with 2 other guys in a 14 X 60 ft trailer house when I was in college. Our rent was $175/month and we paid our own gas and electric. This was in the mid '70's. I couldn't pay books, tuition, and expenses on one job so I got a second job and sacrificed sleep for it. I slept from the time I got home Saturday at about 1:00 pm until I had to go to work that night, then slept till noon on Sunday then studied the rest of Sunday. I didn't drive much because I couldn't afford to and I didn't have time to go anywhere anyway. A lot of times I'd get my assignments for the week from the instructors ahead of time so I could work on them Sunday. That was my "STUDY DAY" and I did nothing else. I didn't need a lot of "down time" working at a bar. Although it was work, I still was hanging out with my friends, so that helped. I didn't feel the need to "go out". In fact, I wanted to get home because I was tired of the partying going on around me.
None of this is to get anyone to say "poor guy.." it's to illustrate you're absolutely correct point of "You do what you have to do." You can either do it or whine about it, which camp do you want to be in? That's the bottom line.
John Stricker
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Originally posted by Formula88:
Geez, people. Use some common sense. The minimum wage may be fixed Federally, but individual states can, and some do, set it higher. Also, the local job market will also affect what employers hire for. That easily explains why a McNasty pays more in some locations than others. Not to mention if they have a dire need for specific shifts, those will obviously pay more.
That "somewhere" has to be also where the jobs are, or your mileage driven will go up due to your commute. But considering part of CA is desert, between LA and the wide open nothing, you'll find a huge range of prices. Just how many jobs are gonna be out there in the middle of nowhere, though? Can you find a place to live in Orange County, CA for $250 / mo? Only thing I think you'll find is a room to rent at best.
A small efficiency for $600 may be hard to find in some areas, and easy in others. A roommate in a 1 room apartment had better be a lover or it's going to get real crowded real fast. Of course, the overriding disclaimer is, as always, "You do what you have to do." If the only way you can afford to live is to rent a 1 room apartment with no separate bedroom and share it with 4 other guys, well, that's what you do until you can afford better. That or until the housing authority finds out and kicks you out for violating occupancy laws (varies by city/state).
My last apartment in Raleigh was $609/mo. That was for a 933 sq. ft. 1 bed / 1 bath apartment with a full kitchen, living room, dining room, sunroom, and deck. It was a bargain here and I had to look high and low to find it. The only reason I got it so cheap was they were running a special becasue the low interest rates were getting more people into houses and fewer people were looking for apartments.
As interest rates go up, apartment rentals will go up, too, because houses will become harder to afford, so more people will be looking for apartments.
[This message has been edited by jstricker (edited 05-14-2006).]
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12:16 PM
Formula88 Member
Posts: 53788 From: Raleigh NC Registered: Jan 2001
Do you mean to tell me that you think that in that great big state, all the deserts and back water towns, that there aren't any rooming houses, or rooms for let, or shacks, or shanties, somewhere, that someone won't rent for $250? Dream on. All those illegal immigrants are living somewhere, aren't they, and they supposedly only make a few dollars a day, right?
You need to broaden your horizons. I know it's not going to be somewhere you or I might consider "acceptable", but in the words of another poster "You do what you have to do."
John Stricker
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Originally posted by Telegram Sam:
I'll take that bet.
Sucker. I don't think you can stay in county jail for $250 a month, so amaze me. What do I win?
And as far as the cheap real estate in Kansas goes, well, I've been there and there's a reason for it. They may as well give it away. But if everyone was living in Kansas, where would anything innovative come from? Everyon would be brain dead from boredom. Nothing against your great state, but there is a reason that the design centers are in Los Angeles and San Francisco. There is a reason that Silicon Valley and Seattle are centers of technology. There is a reason why it cost so much to live out here. It's worth it.
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01:28 PM
Telegram Sam Member
Posts: 231 From: Carmel-by-the-Sea, California Registered: Apr 2006
and hopefully at least the 2.8) this would include rent as well - so what- say let s give the hypothetical 4 room mates eh?
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