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Ohio Republicans Scam and Election Rewards by connecticutFIERO
Started on: 06-02-2005 03:22 PM
Replies: 54
Last post by: Formula88 on 06-03-2005 06:34 PM
connecticutFIERO
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Report this Post06-02-2005 03:22 PM Click Here to See the Profile for connecticutFIEROSend a Private Message to connecticutFIERODirect Link to This Post
http://hartfordadvocate.com/gbase/News/content?oid=oid:113922

Just follow the money and you usually find a Bush fundraiser beiing rewarded.

"A story that came out of Ohio last week confirms that Republicans are playing it fast and easy with our future. That is, it was learned by reporters at the Toledo Blade that the state agency in charge of paying medical bills and providing monthly checks to state workers injured on the job has invested $50 million of its operating budget in rare coins. Rare indeed is it when reporters actually do their jobs these days, but these Blade reporters were the rarest of the rare: they asked questions intended to get to the bottom of the story.

And down there at the bottom of this story, down among the polyps, microbes and mad-cow prions, resides a rare-coin dealer in Toledo named Tom Noe. Noe was, yes, one of the top fund-raisers in Ohio for the Bush reelection campaign. He was what Bush-Cheney folks call a "pioneer," meaning he raised up to $250,000 for their efforts toward permanent war and deficits. Ohio is the state, you may recall, where Wally O'Dell, another valued Republican "pioneer," lives. O'Dell was the man who wrote to the RNC, prior to the election, that "I am committed to helping Ohio deliver its electoral votes to the president next year."

O'Dell made good on that commitment. O'Dell owns and operates Diebold, the company that makes touch-screen voting machines, the ones without a paper trail, the ones that have proven to be susceptible to hacking and fraud, the ones that will eventually be installed in every American voting precinct to assure that all election results will be open to debate and that in the future you will hear variations on the following: "oh, so sorry, your candidate lost to the Republican again ... and it was so close, well, nice try, see you in four years ..." "Ah, but here's the real rub about those rare coins in Ohio. A state audit found that as much as $12 million of that $50 million "investment" -- funds intended to pay worker's compensation claims -- is unaccounted for, leading to speculation that Noe funnelled it back into Republican Party coffers. In other words -- and let's not beat around the Bush -- Republican hacks stole $12 million from state taxpayers, Republican AND Democrat, and are still walking the streets. When this happened in Connecticut -- the quid pro quo Republican con game scoring $224 million for Enron subsidiary CRRA -- the governor was sent to prison."

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Report this Post06-02-2005 09:27 PM Click Here to See the Profile for WichitaSend a Private Message to WichitaDirect Link to This Post

[This message has been edited by Wichita (edited 06-02-2005).]

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Report this Post06-02-2005 10:19 PM Click Here to See the Profile for fierobearSend a Private Message to fierobearDirect Link to This Post
Hartford Advocate: News, Arts and Entertainment weekly for Liberal f***...I mean...the Hartford Area

LOL, now there's a mainstream paper and objective source. LOL. Nice try, ConnecticutFiero. Really, I mean, you provided a link and everything!

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Report this Post06-02-2005 10:22 PM Click Here to See the Profile for TaijiguySend a Private Message to TaijiguyDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Wichita:

[Insert funny-ass picture here]

Hehee. No sh*t.

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Report this Post06-02-2005 10:24 PM Click Here to See the Profile for NEPTUNESend a Private Message to NEPTUNEDirect Link to This Post
I saw this story somewhere else. Facts are facts.

"follow the money"
-Deep Throat

"power corrupts. Absolute power corrupts absolutely"

I wish we had NIXON back.
Even he was better than what we are (being) stuck with today!

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Report this Post06-02-2005 10:32 PM Click Here to See the Profile for connecticutFIEROSend a Private Message to connecticutFIERODirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by fierobear:

Hartford Advocate: News, Arts and Entertainment weekly for Liberal f***...I mean...the Hartford Area

LOL, now there's a mainstream paper and objective source. LOL. Nice try, ConnecticutFiero. Really, I mean, you provided a link and everything!

Its commentary on a toledo paper's story. So what if the advocate picked up on it. You guys are funny, I mean nobody even comments on the story, you just attack the messenger. Your like a pack of **** throwing monkeys. If you don't like the story tell me why its OK for Bush fundraisers to be rewarded with state contracts and why its OK for state election officials to simulataneously head the Bush campaign in their state. I wouldn't want either party to have that kind of position in their pocket, its a disgrace to democracy.

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Report this Post06-02-2005 10:36 PM Click Here to See the Profile for G-NastyClick Here to visit G-Nasty's HomePageSend a Private Message to G-NastyDirect Link to This Post
Teens not getting jobs (immigration anyone?), young soldiers & Iraqis are dying, billions going into war machine that funnels money to the wealthiest, gas prices boosting profits, airline pension billion dollar taxpayer bailout looming, insider judges getting picked, Social Security getting dropped...
Hell thats some damn good stuff for the nation.
America. **** Yeah.

While Bush, his advisors and his administration have been splundering our National Treasury-
I think the only positive voice to come out of WA spin is Jimmy Carters asking Putin to follow thru with Nuclear Proliferations treaty. Something RICE should have done.

Any president that mis speaks and says erection instead of election is just plain stupid. This guy must be on medication or something. http://www.dubyaspeak.com/

WILL WE EVER have a REAL president-not some rich **** that works for the elite?
I doubt it.
America is beyond bankrupt. Watch China, Singapore, Hong Kong, Israel, India and others continue to strip our futures. Our brave New World Order is one controlled by bankers that print up hordes of money and buy up everything & everyone.
Just ask the new Iraqi council how much they owe the World Bank.
And ask Alan Greenspan who really owns America and its markets.

YES. OHIO dropped the ball on this one.
AND thier ballot admin is a Republican.
Whooda thunk it.
OUT>

[This message has been edited by G-Nasty (edited 06-02-2005).]

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Report this Post06-02-2005 10:51 PM Click Here to See the Profile for TaijiguySend a Private Message to TaijiguyDirect Link to This Post
The difference is, most of us already KNOW politicians are a bunch of crooked SOB's. Including Clinton and Kerry. But if we're going to have a crooked SOB running the country, I'm still glad it's W. You guys aren't cheesed that W is in office, he's just the current target of your angst. You wouldn't be happy if Jesus Christ hisself was in office since he'd probably be a Republican. Face it, you think W is the problem, he's not. It's the society we have created for ourselves, and we've all contributed to it in some way. Now we get to live with it. Don't like it? Quit whining and change it. Talk is cheap, take some action to make it better or shut the hell up.
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Report this Post06-02-2005 11:02 PM Click Here to See the Profile for edheringClick Here to visit edhering's HomePageSend a Private Message to edheringDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by connecticutFIERO:
I mean nobody even comments on the story, you just attack the messenger.

Oh, and liberals and Democrats NEVER do that, of course.

Ed

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Report this Post06-02-2005 11:05 PM Click Here to See the Profile for stimpySend a Private Message to stimpyDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Taijiguy:
You wouldn't be happy if Jesus Christ hisself was in office since he'd probably be a Republican.

You've GOT to be kidding, right?

------------------

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Report this Post06-02-2005 11:08 PM Click Here to See the Profile for connecticutFIEROSend a Private Message to connecticutFIERODirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Taijiguy:

The difference is, most of us already KNOW politicians are a bunch of crooked SOB's. Including Clinton and Kerry. But if we're going to have a crooked SOB running the country, I'm still glad it's W. You guys aren't cheesed that W is in office, he's just the current target of your angst. You wouldn't be happy if Jesus Christ hisself was in office since he'd probably be a Republican. Face it, you think W is the problem, he's not. It's the society we have created for ourselves, and we've all contributed to it in some way. Now we get to live with it. Don't like it? Quit whining and change it. Talk is cheap, take some action to make it better or shut the hell up.

I am taking action. I LEARN from our mistakes, yes OUR mistakes. The whole country makes mistakes left and right, and I try to keep myself informed of whats happened and happenning, and I do my best to let those around me know. Thats more than 90% of the country in itself, and thats not all I do. When I see crooked politicians and media personalities spreading lies and propaganda or feeding us death through "policies" I am going to let YOU know about it, if you don't want to read about what the majorit is doing to rape you then don't click on my posts. I will keep tabs on these crooks for the majority of people out there content with American Idol and "Faux" news.

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Report this Post06-02-2005 11:11 PM Click Here to See the Profile for WichitaSend a Private Message to WichitaDirect Link to This Post
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Report this Post06-03-2005 12:27 AM Click Here to See the Profile for JazzManSend a Private Message to JazzManDirect Link to This Post
Can someone with photoshop skills do a Republican seal for me? It needs to have the ouside ring like the above, but inside will be a photo of Nixon with his fingers up in the V victory signs and the logo that says, "I am not a crook!"

JazzMan

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Report this Post06-03-2005 12:46 AM Click Here to See the Profile for frontal lobeSend a Private Message to frontal lobeDirect Link to This Post
We leap from "...as much as $12 million...is unaccounted for, leading to SPECULATION that Noe funneled it back into the Republican Party coffers..." to "...Republican hacks STOLE $12 million from state taxpayers..."

I would be absolutely outraged if that happened. Is this proven? Or is this innuendo? Those are very serious charges.

As are charges that O'Dell intentionally stole votes by intentionally rigging voting machines. Is this proven? Or inneundo? Because O'Dell saying "I am committed to helping Ohio deliver its electoral votes to the president next year..." is hardly damning. It is typical political terms.

So if there is proof, I would like to know.

Here is something that IS known. A real federal probe into Milwaukee voter fraud has been concluded and has proof of widespread voter fraud that definitively aided John Kerry. I'm not bringing this up to deflect attention from the original post. I'm adding it to the list of serious problems with voting, if indeed there is proof of this situation in Ohio.

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Report this Post06-03-2005 01:12 AM Click Here to See the Profile for loafer87gtSend a Private Message to loafer87gtDirect Link to This Post
Same thing happens up here in Soviet Canuckastan. The Liberals will do anything to stay in power, offering choice Cabinet positions and other positions of power to their buddies and financial supporters. Through these shady dealings and corrupt politics - they have managed to stay in power for almost 11 years now.

Hell - check out the latest news from Canadar - we finally had a chance to oust these corrupt a-holes about a week ago but the government bribed the independant MP's to take their side before the crucial vote. After being caught red handed doling out 155 MILLION in Canadian tax payers money to their friends - with stories of mob ties and other stuff you would expect to see in a late night drama show - the Liberals managed to hold onto their reign of power. So as it stands - we are now stuck with a corrupt dictatorship led by a group of greasy Liberal wankers until they decide to call an election. With the highest level court judges and heads of the Royal Canadian Mounted Police appointed, and more importantly, funded, by this regime - the can essentially act with impunity smuggly knowing that they could essentially get away with murder and not be held accountable. Using strongarm tacts like media censorship to coveruup the current scandals, they stop at nothing to remain in power. Did you know this - that while last months investigation into the 155 MILLION in missing dollars was at its climax, we Canadians had to rely on the US media and press to get information as our government had a media blackout on the trial preventing us from hearing the sordid details. Apparently Freedom of speech is all but dead in Soviet Canuckastan.

Democracy my ass. Here's hoping either the West seperates in the near future or the US attempts to liberate us from our current regime through annexization. The government funded Communist Broadcasting Corporation (CBC) has the majority of Canadians so friggin brainwashed that outside intervention is our only hope of escaping this liberal led nightmare.

So yeah - it goes both ways. Corruption sucks - and people who don't do anything about it suck even more.

[This message has been edited by loafer87gt (edited 06-03-2005).]

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Report this Post06-03-2005 01:19 AM Click Here to See the Profile for UaanaClick Here to visit Uaana's HomePageSend a Private Message to UaanaDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by connecticutFIERO:


I am taking action. I LEARN from our mistakes, yes OUR mistakes. When I see crooked politicians and media personalities spreading lies and propaganda or feeding us death through "policies" I am going to let YOU know about it, snip

Well oh shining light of truth.. where were you in last month?

I even found a nice liberal source for you..

The event's organizer, entrepreneur Peter Paul, is believed to have spent more than $1.2 million on it. But Rosen told the commission it cost $400,000, which means that at least $800,000 could have gone illegally into Clinton's campaign coffers. This, if it is proved true, would be a serious breach of America's strict campaign finance laws. Rosen faces a maximum jail sentence of 15 years and up to $250,000 in fines if he is found guilty.

http://archive.salon.com/news/feature/2005/05/16/hillary_clinton_scandal/print.html

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Report this Post06-03-2005 01:25 AM Click Here to See the Profile for lurkerSend a Private Message to lurkerDirect Link to This Post
too bad we cant send them ALL to jail.
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Report this Post06-03-2005 06:29 AM Click Here to See the Profile for 84BillClick Here to visit 84Bill's HomePageSend a Private Message to 84BillDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Uaana:

Ok so you see someone tossing a bag of trash out the window of their car means it's ok for you to do the same?

What an upstanding responsible citizen you all are.

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Report this Post06-03-2005 09:59 AM Click Here to See the Profile for TaijiguySend a Private Message to TaijiguyDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by connecticutFIERO:


I am taking action. I LEARN from our mistakes, yes OUR mistakes. The whole country makes mistakes left and right, and I try to keep myself informed of whats happened and happenning, and I do my best to let those around me know. Thats more than 90% of the country in itself, and thats not all I do. When I see crooked politicians and media personalities spreading lies and propaganda or feeding us death through "policies" I am going to let YOU know about it, if you don't want to read about what the majorit is doing to rape you then don't click on my posts. I will keep tabs on these crooks for the majority of people out there content with American Idol and "Faux" news.

Blah blah blah, like I said, talk is cheap. You say you "let us know", which translated really means you're just another outlet for regurgitated news designed to further your own beliefs. The problem with the "actions" you claim to take (as in "informing" us of big news) is all directed at republicans, the side you dislike so much. Your bias prevents you from being objective, so your "action" is meaningless. I mean take some action, go out and do something. Instead of whining and complaining about how crappy the economy is, start a business and help to boost it. Instead of pissing and moaning about the high cost of housing, join up with Habitat For Humanity and help build some affordabable housing. But don't just sit there and copy and paste the same old "Bush sucks" propoganda and tell me you're informing me of anything. Dig up some crap on Clinton or Kerry and then tell me how fair your reporting is. You' aren't doing anything proactive to effect any changes, you're just complaining and pressing your opinions without any real action.

[This message has been edited by Taijiguy (edited 06-03-2005).]

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connecticutFIERO
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Report this Post06-03-2005 10:31 AM Click Here to See the Profile for connecticutFIEROSend a Private Message to connecticutFIERODirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Taijiguy:


Blah blah blah, like I said, talk is cheap. You say you "let us know", which translated really means you're just another outlet for regurgitated news designed to further your own beliefs. The problem with the "actions" you claim to take (as in "informing" us of big news) is all directed at republicans, the side you dislike so much. Your bias prevents you from being objective, so your "action" is meaningless. I mean take some action, go out and do something. Instead of whining and complaining about how crappy the economy is, start a business and help to boost it. Instead of pissing and moaning about the high cost of housing, join up with Habitat For Humanity and help build some affordabable housing. But don't just sit there and copy and paste the same old "Bush sucks" propoganda and tell me you're informing me of anything. Dig up some crap on Clinton or Kerry and then tell me how fair your reporting is. You' aren't doing anything proactive to effect any changes, you're just complaining and pressing your opinions without any real action.

I never said I was an unbiased journalist, I am a concerned citizen. One that happens to see more BS going on in the GOP then in the Democratic party. Watch the news and you might think that Richard Nixon was a hero. THAT is corrupt biased news.

I actually run TWO business and have a full time job. And I spend a lot of time helping friends and family, when I run out of thing sto do for my own then I'll help others with more than the charitable contributions I make.

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Report this Post06-03-2005 10:36 AM Click Here to See the Profile for TaijiguySend a Private Message to TaijiguyDirect Link to This Post
Well, then it looks like the economy and the government aren't hurting you too bad. What are you complaining about?
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Report this Post06-03-2005 11:03 AM Click Here to See the Profile for connecticutFIEROSend a Private Message to connecticutFIERODirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Taijiguy:

Well, then it looks like the economy and the government aren't hurting you too bad. What are you complaining about?


Both businesses are start ups, one has lasted through these last two years and we may actually make some income this year and have something to pay taxes on. The other is simply side work as a designer. Neither business does more than help buy milk and eggs and the occasional prescrip bill. My full time job at the hospital is half funded by soft money and those funds could dry up anytime (crosses fingers). We are operating with NO budget, just payroll. The economy is doing great for people on the top, but for people like me doing everything possible and still can't get ahead, it sucks. I should be in a house right now, and if it wasn't for this artificial housing price inflation and rising cost of energy and medical, I might be able to afford one. The economy is putting people back to work, that much is true. But the work is low pay, no benefit, union free slave labor. I happen to be lucky enough to have landed a decent job. But even that job which pays more than 99% of my friends jobs and more than lots of my elders are making isn't enough to buy a 3 bedroom house on 1/5th of an acre in the 50 mile area surrounding Hartford. If I want a house I have to live in the city, that isn't an option because I have a daughter ready for public schools. I would rather my kid get a good education while I waste money on rent than put her in a hartford school. The houses in the city that are affordable are next door to shuttered bum hideouts and other lowlives. Trust me, I know about the situation.

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Report this Post06-03-2005 11:20 AM Click Here to See the Profile for TaijiguySend a Private Message to TaijiguyDirect Link to This Post
Well, believe me, I know things ain't great. But back to the point I was driving at earlier is this; you say you keep yourself informed, but I assert that you only pay attention to the things that support your opinions. I was saying ALL politicians are pieces of crap. Bush, Clinton, and Kerry included. I *do* think Bush is a sincere guy. Brightest bulb in the knife drawer? Maybe not. But I have to admire his resolve. That's probaly what I disliked about Clinton, was he didn't appear to have any real committment to anything. Maybe I'm wrong, I just don't remember anything that he really adhered to with any vehemence. There are things I like about Bush, and things I think he's totally f'ed in the head about.
My personal feeling is, the only way we're EVER going to make any progress is to quit electing politicains and lawyers into office, and start electing scholars and every day people. (which, the way the system is built can probably never happoen, cause the guy with the deepest pockets get all the airtime) I mean, let's face it, elections aren't won by qualifications, they're won with the best and most advertising. We also need to revamp the tax system, a flat tax is absolutely the answer, since, among other things, as someone else mentioned before, you minimize the need for lobbying and other under-the-table dealings when you level the playing field that way. I personally think they should completely eliminate media advertising and canvassing and touring for candidates. I think the only exposure a candidate should get is through debates and free tv appearances. That way you give the little guy a fair chance, and remove the big-budget advantage.
I know you're a "concerned citizen", but when you immidately dismiss something someone does merely because of their affiliation, you aren't learning anything, and you're only cheating yourself. Just curious, has there been ANYTHING that Bush has done that you approve of? Is there ANYTHING that you can say you admire about him? If not, maybe you aren't as open minded as you claim, when you talk about "thinking for yourself" (which you have done on numerous occassions) or being open minded about anything.

[This message has been edited by Taijiguy (edited 06-03-2005).]

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Report this Post06-03-2005 11:21 AM Click Here to See the Profile for RandomTaskSend a Private Message to RandomTaskDirect Link to This Post
Ahhh! arguement! Too... political.... head hurts... anyone have a bandaid?
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Report this Post06-03-2005 12:01 PM Click Here to See the Profile for connecticutFIEROSend a Private Message to connecticutFIERODirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Taijiguy:

Well, believe me, I know things ain't great. But back to the point I was driving at earlier is this; you say you keep yourself informed, but I assert that you only pay attention to the things that support your opinions. I was saying ALL politicians are pieces of crap. Bush, Clinton, and Kerry included. I *do* think Bush is a sincere guy. Brightest bulb in the knife drawer? Maybe not. But I have to admire his resolve. That's probaly what I disliked about Clinton, was he didn't appear to have any real committment to anything. Maybe I'm wrong, I just don't remember anything that he really adhered to with any vehemence. There are things I like about Bush, and things I think he's totally f'ed in the head about.
My personal feeling is, the only way we're EVER going to make any progress is to quit electing politicains and lawyers into office, and start electing scholars and every day people. (which, the way the system is built can probably never happoen, cause the guy with the deepest pockets get all the airtime) I mean, let's face it, elections aren't won by qualifications, they're won with the best and most advertising. We also need to revamp the tax system, a flat tax is absolutely the answer, since, among other things, as someone else mentioned before, you minimize the need for lobbying and other under-the-table dealings when you level the playing field that way. I personally think they should completely eliminate media advertising and canvassing and touring for candidates. I think the only exposure a candidate should get is through debates and free tv appearances. That way you give the little guy a fair chance, and remove the big-budget advantage.
I know you're a "concerned citizen", but when you immidately dismiss something someone does merely because of their affiliation, you aren't learning anything, and you're only cheating yourself. Just curious, has there been ANYTHING that Bush has done that you approve of? Is there ANYTHING that you can say you admire about him? If not, maybe you aren't as open minded as you claim, when you talk about "thinking for yourself" (which you have done on numerous occassions) or being open minded about anything.

I was standing behind Bush as the towers burned. I watched him and trusted his advisors. Then he started with proagandistic speaches and misinforation about Iraq. I was skeptical, but I thought they must know something we don't and are keeping it secret for now. Then time passed and I noticed there was nothing else. No more information. They took our trust and fed us propaganda like never before. They completely misled us, and now I am a skeptic about everything they say and do, I make sure I get every piece of information before giving my trust to them. I even read and watch "faux new" every single day.

I NEVER liked Bush, but I gave him the benefit of the doubt while things needed to be done. Now I know my skepticism and initial dislike of his "compassionate conservatism" was well justified.

Here are a few examples of why I hate them.

" Clear Skies Act"
"Healthy Forests Initiative"
" Lies about Iraq"
" No Bin Laden"
"Questionable 2000 election actions"
"obvious dailt propaganda"
"oppostion to 911 commission"
" Social Security Dismantling"
"Pandering to religious factions"
"Dirty campaign tricks"
"never worked a day in his life"
"mission accomplished"
"backdoor draft"

Thats just a few of my reasons.

WHat do I like about him?

"relatively quick action in Afghanistan"
"brokered Libya disarmament"

[This message has been edited by connecticutFIERO (edited 06-03-2005).]

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Report this Post06-03-2005 12:03 PM Click Here to See the Profile for TaijiguySend a Private Message to TaijiguyDirect Link to This Post
And Clinton? What do you dislike about him? How about Kerry?
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Report this Post06-03-2005 12:30 PM Click Here to See the Profile for WichitaSend a Private Message to WichitaDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by connecticutFIERO:


I never said I was an unbiased journalist, I am a concerned citizen. One that happens to see more BS going on in the GOP then in the Democratic party. Watch the news and you might think that Richard Nixon was a hero. THAT is corrupt biased news.

Actually Richard Nixon, IMHO, was one of the greatest Presidents in our modern presidency. What he did and lied about to cover his subbordants was a bad thing. Yes! Tricky Dicky was a paranoid person, but the actions he took during his Presidency and his legacy (it was a noble thing to resign) but beyond that, he did many great things for this country and in the world. I'm sorry! He was a great President and I'm not saying this because he was a Republican. I'm just talking about his record and action.

His book "Victory without War" and "Leaders" are excellent books to read.

I will always defend Richard Nixon. They sure don't make them like they used too.

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Report this Post06-03-2005 12:50 PM Click Here to See the Profile for fierobearSend a Private Message to fierobearDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by loafer87gt:
Soviet Canuckastan.

The Liberals will do anything to stay in power

Communist Broadcasting Corporation (CBC)

Hahahahahaha!

Thanks for the funnies. Sorry that it's so true for you, though.

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Report this Post06-03-2005 01:10 PM Click Here to See the Profile for connecticutFIEROSend a Private Message to connecticutFIERODirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Taijiguy:

And Clinton? What do you dislike about him? How about Kerry?

Clinton.

Bad.

"womanizer"
"typical politician, (I feel your pain)"
"couldn't pass healthcare reform"
"couldv'e taken stronger action after WTC1"

Good.

"Excellent idea communicator"
"Reigned in the Rep congress and led us to a balanced budget"
"Took action in the Balkans against Milosevich"
"Moderate leader, not as liberal as conservatives claim"
"Pushed reform for welfare"
"Helped mediate in Social security solvency"
"Helped reduce poverty to lowest level ever"
"didn't push for any ridiculous morality laws"
"pro environment"

Kerry is hard to peg because he hasn't had a chance to lead the country.

Bad.

"appears indecisive due to "Senate" deliberating nature"
"doesn't fight hard enough agaist personal attacks"
"needs to introduce more legislation"


Good.

"leads senate in investigations of Government"
"helped normalize relations with Vietnam"
"Does not pander to religion"
"Intelligent and articulate"
"deep thinker"
"good moderator"
" pro union"
"leading vietnam war critic, reformer"
"pro environment"
"pro UN"

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Report this Post06-03-2005 01:14 PM Click Here to See the Profile for connecticutFIEROSend a Private Message to connecticutFIERODirect Link to This Post

connecticutFIERO

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quote
Originally posted by Wichita:


Actually Richard Nixon, IMHO, was one of the greatest Presidents in our modern presidency. What he did and lied about to cover his subbordants was a bad thing. Yes! Tricky Dicky was a paranoid person, but the actions he took during his Presidency and his legacy (it was a noble thing to resign) but beyond that, he did many great things for this country and in the world. I'm sorry! He was a great President and I'm not saying this because he was a Republican. I'm just talking about his record and action.

His book "Victory without War" and "Leaders" are excellent books to read.

I will always defend Richard Nixon. They sure don't make them like they used too.

I will always see Dick as power hungry brooding figure that tried to steal from his political opponents in order to crush opposition. He is a crook, a liar, and a thief. Have you listened to the tapes of Nixon explaining EXACTLY how to break in? He wasn;t just covering up for his underlings, the absurd. He was the puppet master, and he deserved to go to jail. I don't care if he did make some good foreign policy decisions, if you think you are above the constitution and thwart democracy you belong in jail.

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Report this Post06-03-2005 01:30 PM Click Here to See the Profile for WichitaSend a Private Message to WichitaDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by connecticutFIERO:


I will always see Dick as power hungry brooding figure that tried to steal from his political opponents in order to crush opposition. He is a crook, a liar, and a thief. Have you listened to the tapes of Nixon explaining EXACTLY how to break in? He wasn;t just covering up for his underlings, the absurd. He was the puppet master, and he deserved to go to jail. I don't care if he did make some good foreign policy decisions, if you think you are above the constitution and thwart democracy you belong in jail.

Just like Clinton lieing in front of a Grand Jury, Whitewater, and countless other aquistions.

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Report this Post06-03-2005 01:36 PM Click Here to See the Profile for fierobearSend a Private Message to fierobearDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Wichita:


Just like Clinton lieing in front of a Grand Jury, Whitewater, and countless other aquistions.

They just dismiss that as "lieing about a blowjob". I guess it's OK to lie to a grand jury, as long as it's about a BJ.

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Report this Post06-03-2005 01:38 PM Click Here to See the Profile for connecticutFIEROSend a Private Message to connecticutFIERODirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Wichita:


Just like Clinton lieing in front of a Grand Jury, Whitewater, and countless other aquistions.

Nope not even close buddy. I don't like a lying president in any shape or form. When someone is trying to avoid being caught with his pants down, thats bad. When someone is setting up burglaries to steal power and then uses the government to try and cover it up, thats a WHOLE different level of bad. Its not even close. I laugh at the thought of impeaching a president for lying about a personal love affair. But I cringe in disgust, loathing, and anger at the thought of the president of the United States of America planning breakins, coverups, and blackmail. Using the CIA and the FBI to track political opponents and who knows what else. The man could have been behind assasinations for all we know. If he was willing to do what he did without fear of retibution, who knows what else lurks in his past.

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Report this Post06-03-2005 01:40 PM Click Here to See the Profile for connecticutFIEROSend a Private Message to connecticutFIERODirect Link to This Post

connecticutFIERO

7696 posts
Member since Jun 2002
 
quote
Originally posted by fierobear:


They just dismiss that as "lieing about a blowjob". I guess it's OK to lie to a grand jury, as long as it's about a BJ.

Yeah you're right. Lying to a grand jury is the real crime, not the corruption or reasons for lying. Just like the ocean, its the surface of the ocean thats important, not the trillions of gallons water and life below the surface.

Nixon apologists and history revisonists, that what you guys are.

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Report this Post06-03-2005 01:42 PM Click Here to See the Profile for TaijiguySend a Private Message to TaijiguyDirect Link to This Post
Nixon didn't do anything no other President has done, he just got caught. If you think every other Pres hasn't been behind some sort of covert/illegal operations, I think you're kidding yourself.
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Report this Post06-03-2005 01:48 PM Click Here to See the Profile for connecticutFIEROSend a Private Message to connecticutFIERODirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Taijiguy:

Nixon didn't do anything no other President has done, he just got caught. If you think every other Pres hasn't been behind some sort of covert/illegal operations, I think you're kidding yourself.

Well then we need more deepthroats and more watergates. I don't think "most" presidents have done what Nixon has done though. I think Bush Jr and Reagan certainly have skeletons in the closet. But probably not Bush Sr, Carter, maybe not even Clinton. I don't think there is that level of corruption with most presidents. Kennedy maybe, Ford probably, FDR don't know, Eisenhauer is probably clean. LBJ maybe, but he did have a conscience and seemed to be pretty upstanding and honest.

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Report this Post06-03-2005 01:53 PM Click Here to See the Profile for WichitaSend a Private Message to WichitaDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by connecticutFIERO:


Well then we need more deepthroats and more watergates. I don't think "most" presidents have done what Nixon has done though. I think Bush Jr and Reagan certainly have skeletons in the closet. But probably not Bush Sr, Carter, maybe not even Clinton. I don't think there is that level of corruption with most presidents. Kennedy maybe, Ford probably, FDR don't know, Eisenhauer is probably clean. LBJ maybe, but he did have a conscience and seemed to be pretty upstanding and honest.

You tell me what Nixon did! I want to know if you know! I don't even care if you Google it!

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Report this Post06-03-2005 02:01 PM Click Here to See the Profile for connecticutFIEROSend a Private Message to connecticutFIERODirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Wichita:


You tell me what Nixon did! I want to know if you know! I don't even care if you Google it!

You want a transcipt of the tapes of him planning breakins?

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Report this Post06-03-2005 02:04 PM Click Here to See the Profile for WichitaSend a Private Message to WichitaDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by connecticutFIERO:


You want a transcipt of the tapes of him planning breakins?

Sure! See if he does say anything about planning breakins.

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Report this Post06-03-2005 02:14 PM Click Here to See the Profile for connecticutFIEROSend a Private Message to connecticutFIERODirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Wichita:


Sure! See if he does say anything about planning breakins.

Here you go, this is from HardBall, its Chris Mathhews playing the tapes for Kissinger.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/8073301/

"But here‘s a quote from June of ‘71, a year before the Watergate break-in. “The way I want that handled, Bob”—that‘s Bob Haldeman—“is through another way. I want Brooking. Just break in. Break in and take it out. You understand?”

“But what do we have to do—how do we do that?”

Nixon says: “Don‘t discuss it here.”

In other words, Nixon is afraid he‘s being taped, I guess.

“You‘re to break into the place, rifle the files, and bring me.”

And then he says: “Just go in and take it. Go in around 8:00 or 9:00 at night and clean it up.” "
.
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Here is story about it. This is from a different breakin he ordered before watergate.
.
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"Lone guard foils all the president's men

July 24 2002


One year before the Watergate break-in, Richard Nixon ordered a burglary at the Brookings Institution, telling aides, "I want the Brookings safe cleaned out."

A few days later, two men with attache cases entered the think tank's lobby, asking to see Morton Halperin, a critic of the president's Vietnam policy. But the security guard on duty, a tall, thin Caribbean native with a no-exceptions policy, didn't recognise them. Roderick Warrick told them they had to clear their entrance with Halperin. And the men left.

On Monday, three decades after that encounter, Brookings staff - from the institution's president to its computer technicians, from scholars to corporate executives - turned out to honour the man who is credited with saving the institution's files. They all had stories to tell about his stalwart devotion to the rules - like the time he would not let the vice-president of Brookings into the building because he had not met him before.

"He has the most complaints against him of any employee I supervise," Kathy Santos, director of building operations, said proudly. "At least until September 11, I used to get a complaint once a month."

An employee would chafe because Warrick wouldn't let his girlfriend up to the library. Or let him take a computer home. Or even come to work if he'd forgotten his access card. "I calmed them down and told them Warrick was just doing his job," Santos said.


Just doing his job earned Warrick the affection of many on the staff. In a reception room laden with salmon canapes, celebratory cake and fresh-cut fruit, they honoured his years on Brookings' payroll - and talked about his service to them even before that, when he worked for a local real estate development company that handled Brookings security.

When Warrick turned away the two men in attache cases, no one knew who had sent them.

But in 1996, the National Archives released a fresh batch of tapes recorded by the Nixon White House. In them, Nixon ordered the burglary at Brookings, then widely considered a liberal organisation. The order came the night the Supreme Court ruled six to three that The New York Times and The Washington Post had a constitutional right to publish the Pentagon Papers, a secret Pentagon study that chronicled decades of failed policy in Vietnam.

Concerned that Halperin and Leslie Gelb, who directed the Pentagon Papers, might leak further anti-war materials, Nixon told White House Chief of Staff H. R. Haldeman to have someone rifle Brookings' files and "just go in and take it! Go in around 8 or 9 o'clock . . . and clean it up."

Warrick's actions in foiling Halperin's uninvited guests - no matter who sent them - made him the toast of the staff on Monday. Stephen Hess, Brookings' presidential scholar, said he delayed a television appearance so he could attend Warrick's party. But he seemed a bit jealous of all the attention given the guard. "They didn't give me a party at my 30th," he said.

Warrick, a dapper, moustached man who prefers not to give his age, seemed a little puzzled by all the attention. "A lot of people think I'm mean, but I'm just careful," he said. "You have to be careful. All it takes is one mistake."

- Los Angeles Times"

[This message has been edited by connecticutFIERO (edited 06-03-2005).]

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