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twin radiators with a 4.9L by SMTHGT
Started on: 09-02-2010 11:00 AM
Replies: 14
Last post by: Gokart Mozart on 10-11-2010 10:37 PM
SMTHGT
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Report this Post09-02-2010 11:00 AM Click Here to See the Profile for SMTHGTSend a Private Message to SMTHGTDirect Link to This Post
I am wanting to do away w/ my radiator in the front for many reasons. My question is: Will twin motorcycle (or some other small ones) with a mounted fan on each side on my Fiero in front of my rear wheels (side scoops of some sort) be enough to cool the 4.9L..??? Thanks for all the opinions... Smooth

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Steve
Aka. "SmoothGT"
1987 GT 4.9L~V8 ~4T6OE
SmoothGT~II

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Fieroseverywhere
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Report this Post09-02-2010 11:13 AM Click Here to See the Profile for FieroseverywhereClick Here to Email FieroseverywhereSend a Private Message to FieroseverywhereDirect Link to This Post
Depends on how much surface area you can get to fit. I wouldn't want it any less then a stock fiero radiator. Also depending on the year of fiero you may need to add an opening to the passenger side to proper air movment. 87-88 already have an opening under the battery tray. 84-86 do not. Going to want to relocate that battery up front also (I would anyway).

The 4.9 PCM can run 2 cooling fans so your good there. Running an oil cooler?

What would you be doing for an intake then? Decklid? I've been considering a mod like this myself. It would eliminate the cooling tubes running to the front of the car. Also move a good amount of weight from ahead of the front axel to just ahead of the rear axel. Your front end will be lighter...

[This message has been edited by Fieroseverywhere (edited 09-02-2010).]

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SMTHGT
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Report this Post09-02-2010 11:54 AM Click Here to See the Profile for SMTHGTSend a Private Message to SMTHGTDirect Link to This Post
Thanks for the response so fast.... YES, Battery is headed forward anyways if I do this or not. NO, Oil Cooler right now. I would add one. then my thought was where would it go... OK, I could still use it up front somewhere for now anywayz. I would only have small lines instead of the coolant tubes. Uummm, ok that was Back to the question/response...lol DAMN, THAT WAS LIKE INTERUPTING MYSELF (thumps own ear) INTAKE: Right now it just has a 10" filter on it. I am working on something on paper for that, but alot depends on this.
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SMTHGT
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Report this Post09-02-2010 11:59 AM Click Here to See the Profile for SMTHGTSend a Private Message to SMTHGTDirect Link to This Post

SMTHGT

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Looks like its the perfect time for a 10"-12" s t r e t c h.....
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Bloozberry
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Report this Post09-02-2010 12:28 PM Click Here to See the Profile for BloozberrySend a Private Message to BloozberryDirect Link to This Post
Radiators are chosen by car manufacturers with cooling capacities that are greater than the engine's capacity to produce heat in the worst case scenarios. To keep from overheating, you too have to use the same logic. The problem is that virtually nobody gives information on the cooling capacity or heat production rate of their radiators or engines, because there are too many variables. So for you to avoid selecting too small a pair of radiators, there are two simple (though not especially scientific) ways that will put you in the right ball park.

The first is to calculate the volume of the Fiero radiator (width X height X depth). Then divide this volume by two since you're planning on using a pair of them. Next, you'll have to find a donor vehicle with a radiator that will fit in the location you want, that has the same volume as half the Fiero rad. This is probably the best way although there are still going to be issues like the size of your air openings, and the shape of the exit route for the hot air that can drastically alter the cooling capacity of the radiator.

The other approach is to select a radiator that fits, from a vehicle that produces at least half of the HP rating of your 4.9L, since HP is proportional to the heating capacity of the engine. But don't rely on a motorcycle radiator if you use this logic because even liquid cooled motorcycle engines shed a significant amount of heat through the cooling fins on the cylinders... something your 4.9 doesn't have.

There's a thread in the construction zone here on page 13 further down the page www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum3/HTML/000007-13.html where bubbajoe installed a pair of radiators in the flanks like you want, so you might PM him for more details (although I think Fiero2m8 now owns the car). Note that his are at fairly steep angle of incidence to the incoming airflow so that's going to raise the resistance of the airflow path considerably. I've done a bit of junkyard research myself and found that a 95 Honda Civic or 89 Suzuki Swift radiator fits perfectly inside the flanks on my F355 rebody, but my car is about 3" wider in that area than a stock Fiero. The stock Civic radiator probably would have a tough time coping with the heat generated, but there are 3 and 4 core "racing" rads for $100 each that claim to have 1.5 times the cooling capacity of the stock rad. Hope this helps.
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Report this Post09-02-2010 12:42 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FieroseverywhereClick Here to Email FieroseverywhereSend a Private Message to FieroseverywhereDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by SMTHGT:

Looks like its the perfect time for a 10"-12" s t r e t c h.....


That would give you lots of space for radiators....

Don't forget about the volume of the coolant tubes. Given their diameter and length you will be losing coolant capasity of those also. Add a bit to the volume of the fiero radiator calculation to compensate. The fiero has a large coolant capasity as it sits (~3.5 gallons) but you don't want to reduce it too much when installing a V8. The oil cooler will help a bunch when lowering capasity. Speaking of which...

On the oil cooler. Are you running the exhaust in stock position and/or do you need a cat? If not you can mount the cooler to the cradle near the starter. They get plenty of air flow there and wont interfere with anything else. I'm interested in seeing what you come up with.

Hmmm. Twin side mounted radiators, mid mounted oil cooler, wing mounted intercooler with trunk intake (for the turbo setup of course ). Convert now empty hood compartment to a full trunk. Oh the fun that would be...

[This message has been edited by Fieroseverywhere (edited 09-02-2010).]

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SMTHGT
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Report this Post09-02-2010 09:25 PM Click Here to See the Profile for SMTHGTSend a Private Message to SMTHGTDirect Link to This Post
Thanks Blooz... lots of good info. I forgot all about when BUBBA built that one. Thanks again EVERYWHERE... Anyone else?
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California Kid
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Report this Post09-02-2010 10:20 PM Click Here to See the Profile for California KidSend a Private Message to California KidDirect Link to This Post
Just my opinion, you'd have to do a stretch to even consider packaging twin radiators, there isn't enough room in the body side vent location in front of the rear tires to package the radiators with fans.

On my GT I have an engine oil cooler with thermal fan packaged in the drivers side, side scoop cavity. It's a tight fit, I modified the wheel house liner to have an exhaust duck to blow hot air into wheelhouse cavity instead of engine compartment, so it can exhaust away from the car. This is one of the reasons I like the body side scoops on my car, the opening is forward on vehicle, and outboard bulge styling allows packaging items in that cavity. The scoops with opening more near rear tire don't allow you to package anything without eating up engine compartment space that's already tight when you have a V8 in there.

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Car History: http://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum1/HTML/025670.html

[This message has been edited by California Kid (edited 09-02-2010).]

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RACE
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Report this Post09-02-2010 10:37 PM Click Here to See the Profile for RACEClick Here to visit RACE's HomePageClick Here to Email RACESend a Private Message to RACEDirect Link to This Post
It might have enough thermal capacity with two. You may have better luck placing them under the decklid vents if they are not too big. It seems like a lot of work and a gamble to solve a problem that you don't have.
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SMTHGT
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Report this Post10-11-2010 02:30 PM Click Here to See the Profile for SMTHGTSend a Private Message to SMTHGTDirect Link to This Post
bump for any new ideas...
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Jake_Dragon
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Report this Post10-11-2010 03:30 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Jake_DragonSend a Private Message to Jake_DragonDirect Link to This Post
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Report this Post10-11-2010 04:06 PM Click Here to See the Profile for revinSend a Private Message to revinDirect Link to This Post
jake,
Don't give him ideas, you KNOW he would do that.
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Report this Post10-11-2010 08:03 PM Click Here to See the Profile for RWDPLZClick Here to visit RWDPLZ's HomePageSend a Private Message to RWDPLZDirect Link to This Post
Hondas have tiny little radiators, and their engines produce half the power a 4.9 does...
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SMTHGT
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Report this Post10-11-2010 10:27 PM Click Here to See the Profile for SMTHGTSend a Private Message to SMTHGTDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by revin:

jake,
Don't give him ideas, you KNOW he would do that.


Whatever.... Thanks Jake, I needed that smile..
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Gokart Mozart
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Report this Post10-11-2010 10:37 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Gokart MozartClick Here to visit Gokart Mozart's HomePageSend a Private Message to Gokart MozartDirect Link to This Post
Do you want to keep your trunk? Have scoops leading air into the trunk and cut out the bottom. Have a couple fans pulling air into and out of the area with the radiator in between sitting on an angle, top near the back, bottom near the front like / if viewing from the drivers side.
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