I need to know if it is ok to reuse rod and main bearings. I have to take the crank out of an engine and replace the tone ring and I do not have time to wait on bearings.Then engine only has 50,000 miles on it.Thanks
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03:14 PM
PFF
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phonedawgz Member
Posts: 17104 From: Green Bay, WI USA Registered: Dec 2009
any good parts house should have the bearings or be able to get them in a day. Don't reuse them, they are so inexpensive. If you can mic up the journals so you know you are with factory specs, you can also get .001" oversize bearings.
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03:25 PM
Francis T Member
Posts: 6620 From: spotsylvania va. usa Registered: Oct 2003
I would not. Get some plasti-gauge and see what oversize you need. Like he said they are not exspensive. If youu ahvent use plasti gauge do a search here there's not much to it and its very cheep.
The tone ring is what the crank sensor reads from. they are expensive 54$ for the mains 55$ for the rods and 15$ for the thrust washers. The money is not the problem, it is time. Not being rude,I know I should change them, that is not what I asked, I asked if I could reuse the old ones. thanks
[This message has been edited by fierofan25 (edited 01-12-2011).]
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03:56 PM
1fatcat Member
Posts: 1519 From: Zimmerman, Mn Registered: Dec 2010
If the bearings are not damaged, you can reuse them. Just don't mix them up, keep them in the same location and you should be fine. What engine are you working on? What happened to the tone ring? If something came apart in the engine, then you may need bearings. But then you would probably need more than JUST bearings.
Make a long story short I f..ked up and installed a 04 jeep liberty engine in an 03 jeep liberty and The tone rings(reluctor wheel) on the crank are different so it will not start.So now I have to pull the crank and change it. The engines for the 03 are near impossible to find and are expensive when you do like 2000$ for 130,000 miles.
[This message has been edited by fierofan25 (edited 01-12-2011).]
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04:09 PM
82-T/A [At Work] Member
Posts: 25242 From: Florida USA Registered: Aug 2002
Make a long story short I f..ked up and installed a 04 jeep liberty engine in an 03 jeep liberty and The tone rings(reluctor wheel) on the crank are different so it will not start.So now I have to pull the crank and change it. The engines for the 03 are near impossible to find and are expensive when you do like 2000$ for 130,000 miles.
Why Jeep couldn't have just kept the 4L straight six is beyonod me... this V6 they have is total crap.
Like mentioned above, you'll be fine as long as the bearings are good. There are some obvious signs of bearing wear, like metal shavings in the oil, scuff marks and/or discoloration on the bearing surface, low oil pressure at idle, etc.
When you remove the crankshaft, the bearing and crankshaft mating surfaces should be polished mirror-smooth. The bearing surface should also be a bright silver color. If you see any discolored patches (the patches will usually be gold-colored), it means the bearing surface has worn down... which of course means it needs to be replaced.
Best of luck!
[This message has been edited by Blacktree (edited 01-12-2011).]
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04:53 PM
Indiana_resto_guy Member
Posts: 7158 From: Shelbyville, IN USA Registered: Jul 2000
If it were an engine that I was well aware of maintance done I might consider reusing them. If I was not aware of prior care, mileage, never heard the engine run, didn't know what sort of oil pressure it was producing ect, I would never consider using the old ones. That's just me, take what ever action you wish. I would chang the oil pump as well, again, that's just me.
bearings for WHAT ??? rod bearings run $2 per rod, mains between $18-35 for Fed mogul, clevite, king...a set depending on what you have, separate Thrust washers ?? are you working on something foriegn ? re using bearings is ok IF they are going back on the Same crank, on the Same journal, in the Same block, IF they are in excellent condition. otherwise, why chance it ?!
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09:02 PM
1fatcat Member
Posts: 1519 From: Zimmerman, Mn Registered: Dec 2010
It's actually pretty easy to spot a worn bearing once you can see it. Here is a pic of a bearing that has SOME wear. Still running nice and quiet with good oil pressure and no engine noise. They got replaced in this example, but just to show what a good, but worn bearing looks like.
Here is a good used bearing. The blue is plasti-guage. If you use plasti-guage, clean it off when done.
Here is a new bearing with a couple globs of assembly lube on it
Here is a very bad bearing
Ok, that's a rod cap, but just imagine what the bearing looked like. That was the result of a spun bearing. If you see a spun bearing, there will be no doubt in your mind if it is bad or not. Pretty obvious. But at that point, the engine is already knocking pretty loud.
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09:28 PM
JumpStart Member
Posts: 1412 From: Central Florida Registered: Sep 2006
If the bearings are good, there good. Bearings don't wear fast with regular oil changes. It's lack of maintanance that wears bearings. With 50k miles on the engine, the bearings should easily last another 100k miles with regular oil changes.
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10:34 PM
1fatcat Member
Posts: 1519 From: Zimmerman, Mn Registered: Dec 2010
If you want to see some photos, try a Google image search for "worn rod bearing" or "worn main bearing".
Good suggestion! You will see examples of the different levels of wear. I forget the material used or the order there layed down, but it's something like this... Bearing structure...steel next layer...copper next layer...lead next layer...babbit
Babbit is the outer layer, next to the journal. When that's gone you can see the lead, then the copper, then the steel. By the time it gets to the steel, the crank is deffinatly going to need machining...if it can even be saved. Usually, by the time it gets to the steel you have already thrown a rod through the block.
Sorry, I may be wrong on the material and order, but the bearings are constructed in layers that make it pretty easy to visually see how much wear there is.
One very important thing to mention is to make sure everything is very clean when reassembling. I don't mean clean of oil, but clean of dirt and grime. If you don't get dirt in there, you shouldn't need to clean at all. Just leave the clean oil on them. Wiping them off could actually make things worse if you use a dirty rag or a lint filled cloth.
[This message has been edited by 1fatcat (edited 01-12-2011).]
Thanks guys for all your help. I am going to take out the engine in the morning and if the bearings show any wear. I will just replace them. The guy will just have to wait. Thanks
I called napa and that was the prices they told me. They have two bearings that go on the side of the crank that are called thrust washers.thanks
quote
Originally posted by Lou6t4gto:
bearings for WHAT ??? rod bearings run $2 per rod, mains between $18-35 for Fed mogul, clevite, king...a set depending on what you have, separate Thrust washers ?? are you working on something foriegn ? re using bearings is ok IF they are going back on the Same crank, on the Same journal, in the Same block, IF they are in excellent condition. otherwise, why chance it ?!
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11:30 PM
TONY_C Member
Posts: 2747 From: North Bellmore, NY 11710 Registered: May 2001
Thanks guys for all your help. I am going to take out the engine in the morning and if the bearings show any wear. I will just replace them. The guy will just have to wait. Thanks
If you have any doubts, if that voice in your head says change them, then change them.
You: "Hey customer/whoever, want to wait a couple extra days for new bearings?" Customer/Whoever: "Yes, replace them, sounds like a wise idea" or "No, I'm stupid."
That way you're off the hook at least if the bearings fail. This is probably something you should ask him anyway...
Babbitt isn't critical. If the lead is good, and the plastigage shows NO more than 0.0035", then main bearings should live. For rods, NO more than 0.0030" With this much clearance, you will want to run 20W50 oil all the time.
Alot of the "replacement bearings" Now are nothing but Aluminum ! you have to ASK for "tri metal " bearings.** if you are working on a "Fiero Engine",** Fiero engines DO NOT HAVE separate "Thrust washers" !** what Engine is it ?
They don't cost an arm and a leg to buy. My opinion is while you're in there take care of it before its a problem. Like its been mentioned though, if you want to use it again then plastiguage it to find out if you can. Though if you've got the motor out, and on a stand. One thing that will help those bearings, and everything else in that motor is a high volume oil pump. I'd say get it from autozone since I believe its twenty dollars cheaper there than the fierostore.
------------------ 86 2.8 gt
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04:36 AM
Isolde Member
Posts: 2504 From: North Logan, Utah, USA Registered: May 2008
HV pumps can help with loose bearing clearances, but only if you add capacity to the stock oil pan. Adding a kick-out is best. Keep the oil away from the crank.
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08:22 AM
OH10fiero Member
Posts: 1541 From: struther OH Registered: Jun 2002
Originally posted by 82-T/A [At Work]: Why Jeep couldn't have just kept the 4L straight six is beyonod me... this V6 they have is total crap.
Sorry for being off-topic here but... I changed an engine out of a 04 Jeep and would have to agree, that thing was a nightmare to work on and ended me ever doing any work on anything Mopar after 1970 ever again unless there is enough cash given to me to buy a new car. I would list the problems I had with swap but not sure if there is enough space to do so here. Sad part is there was no need to do the engine change if the owner didn't decide to drive 130k on the oil that came new with the car when they bought it in 04, the internal damage was beyond belief. Her reasoning for not doing an oil change, the oil level was fine every time she checked the dip stick so she saw no reason to change it.
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