ecotec swap (Page 9/98)
Fosgatecavy98 DEC 07, 11:57 PM
Just wondering, if you didnt have the cav fuel pump on hand would u of just gone with a High performance fuel pump? Obviously I will be needing to upgrade my fuel pump once i get the motor in there.
wftb DEC 08, 12:46 AM
i am trying to use the cavalier fuel pump mainly because i couldnt figure out any other way to get my cavalier fuel gauge working.i looked into an extra sender and booster pump but they seemed like to much work .now i am not so sure .....
Fosgatecavy98 DEC 08, 11:40 AM
You could just always put a switch in for the fuel pump? Thats what my plan is a switch for fuel and ignition, plus it allows u to get some oil flowing before it starts.
wftb DEC 08, 01:26 PM
i am going to to run the pump off of one of the ignition switch actuated feeds on the fiero fuse block if i have to.i think i will be able to figure out what is wrong ,i think it might be just a bad ground.the cavalier harness made the fiero fuel pump work without a problem ,so it should operate the pump it was meant to operate.i was a little too tired to start trouble shooting last night .i really do not want to drop the tank again.
wftb DEC 08, 01:56 PM
turned out i just needed to add a ground to the cavalier harness .i must have accidentally cut off the ground for that part of the harness when i was cutting it down in size.the fiero pump assembly is all metal and i noticed the ground wire is attached right on that assembly.thats why the fiero pump ran without an additional ground .so now that the engine is running again ,i can go back to working on my new exhaust system .
wftb DEC 08, 02:17 PM
and the fuel pressure guage now reads 60 psi at idle.the fiero pump put out 46psi .i wasnt expecting that big of a difference.
Fosgatecavy98 DEC 08, 02:38 PM
Was there any perfomance issuse w/ the fiero pump? I plan on having a wideband O2 sensor so I can see if it leans out. You would sure think that 46psi to 60psi would make a hit on perfomance
wftb DEC 08, 06:10 PM
it seemed to run fine ,but i have the section of the instrument cluster that shows the warning lights blanked off so i dont have to stare at the airbag light,door ajar ,brakes ,and all the other stuff that lights up because they are not connected .since the car is off the road right now i wont know what kind of improvement this makes until spring.
fieroturbo DEC 09, 11:47 PM
Hey WFTB, thanks for the comments on my ecotec project. I left a special response for you on my thread, plus a solution to your exhaust manifold issues
---
I read through this thread again, and came across something I missed. Megasquirt! You guys had said that it can't control the Ecotec's ignition... that isn't 100% true.

Yes, MS is designed as a fuel computer, BUT there is an upgrade called "Megasquirt n' Spark" or "MSnS" for short.
---
The version of MS that I have is optimal for the upgrade: V2.2 board with the MS 1 setup. MS 2 apparently doesn't work with it. And as far as the boards, earlier 1.x versions need a bunch of upgrades, and V3.0 only supports 1 coil (I think).

The way my setup will (theoretically) work is as follows:

With the firmware change to MSnS, outputs 17 and 19 (default setting), two of the LED's on the side of the box, are sacrificed to trigger the 2 channels on the ignition module on the Ecotec's COP module, but the lights will be more useful, as two LED's will represent ignition pulses, and the one used for injector pulses will remain... far better than "enrichment" and "warmup" indications if you ask me.

As far as triggering source, MSnS is compatible with the toothed wheel on the Ecotec's crank (6 teeth?).

I can't confirm 100% that the Ecotec ignition module (the smaller part with the aluminum fins) will be compatible, but it's a good chance, and there is a daugterboard upgrade if it's not.

With that daughterboard upgrade, you just rip the ignition module off the COP unit (it's held on by 3 screws), and use NAPA connector part # EC144 or AC Delco connector part # PT787 in place of it (Napa's is cheaper), or you can use seprate MSD coil packs (preferabbly dual output coils). There's no good reason to NOT do wasted spark ignition with this motor, because that's how it is in stock form. Individual coil channels will kinda go against how the motor was designed, and will require more outputs from MS.
---
The COP module has two coil packs inside of it, and uses a 6 pin connector, but pins 1 & 5 aren't installed on the module.

Pin 2 is cylinders 1 & 4, pin 3 is ignition voltage, pin 4 is cylinders 2 & 3, and pin 6, although on the COP module, it isn't used, although one day I'll take a bad pack apart and see where it goes.
---
As far as wire readouts on the ignition module itself, I'm not that far yet. I have to do some R & D of my own, as no one has that info in simplified form. I have to visually trace the individual wires from the module to the individual ECM pins, and look up the ECM pin #, which I have planned for the many snowy "stay indoors" days that the state of Maine has to offer

I am going to post that info as soon as I have it.

P.S. If any Megasquirt gurus out there see any flaws in this info... DO NOT HESITATE to correct me. I did this research over 4 months ago, and I'm sure I mixed something up.

------------------
Petty Officer Michael C Casaceli
Aircraft Electronics Technician Second Class
Patrol Squadron Ten
United States Navy

[This message has been edited by fieroturbo (edited 12-09-2006).]

Fosgatecavy98 DEC 10, 12:08 AM

quote
Originally posted by fieroturbo:

Hey WFTB, thanks for the comments on my ecotec project. I left a special response for you on my thread, plus a solution to your exhaust manifold issues
---
I read through this thread again, and came across something I missed. Megasquirt! You guys had said that it can't control the Ecotec's ignition... that isn't 100% true.

Yes, MS is designed as a fuel computer, BUT there is an upgrade called "Megasquirt n' Spark" or "MSnS" for short.
---
The version of MS that I have is optimal for the upgrade: V2.2 board with the MS 1 setup. MS 2 apparently doesn't work with it. And as far as the boards, earlier 1.x versions need a bunch of upgrades, and V3.0 only supports 1 coil (I think).

The way my setup will (theoretically) work is as follows:

With the firmware change to MSnS, outputs 17 and 19 (default setting), two of the LED's on the side of the box, are sacrificed to trigger the 2 channels on the ignition module on the Ecotec's COP module, but the lights will be more useful, as two LED's will represent ignition pulses, and the one used for injector pulses will remain... far better than "enrichment" and "warmup" indications if you ask me.

As far as triggering source, MSnS is compatible with the toothed wheel on the Ecotec's crank (6 teeth?).

I can't confirm 100% that the Ecotec ignition module (the smaller part with the aluminum fins) will be compatible, but it's a good chance, and there is a daugterboard upgrade if it's not.

With that daughterboard upgrade, you just rip the ignition module off the COP unit (it's held on by 3 screws), and use NAPA connector part # EC144 or AC Delco connector part # PT787 in place of it (Napa's is cheaper), or you can use seprate MSD coil packs (preferabbly dual output coils). There's no good reason to NOT do wasted spark ignition with this motor, because that's how it is in stock form. Individual coil channels will kinda go against how the motor was designed, and will require more outputs from MS.
---
The COP module has two coil packs inside of it, and uses a 6 pin connector, but pins 1 & 5 aren't installed on the module.

Pin 2 is cylinders 1 & 4, pin 3 is ignition voltage, pin 4 is cylinders 2 & 3, and pin 6, although on the COP module, it isn't used, although one day I'll take a bad pack apart and see where it goes.
---
As far as wire readouts on the ignition module itself, I'm not that far yet. I have to do some R & D of my own, as no one has that info in simplified form. I have to visually trace the individual wires from the module to the individual ECM pins, and look up the ECM pin #, which I have planned for the many snowy "stay indoors" days that the state of Maine has to offer

I am going to post that info as soon as I have it.

P.S. If any Megasquirt gurus out there see any flaws in this info... DO NOT HESITATE to correct me. I did this research over 4 months ago, and I'm sure I mixed something up.



I was pretty much the only one mentioning megasquirt, but from what I read that little aluminum thing would not work with MSnS. Thats why I am using the 2 coil DIS off an older cavailer, since I know the jbody people have been doing this for sometime with no problems.