Held Motorsports Bump Steer Kit Heim Joint Replacement (Page 1/3)
5000S OCT 30, 09:03 AM
My heim joints on the Held Anti Bump Steer Kit are worn out. There are 2 on each control arm. One for toe adjustment and one for connecting the control arm to the knuckle. Somebody knows the right parts for replacing them? In best case with heavier duty ones since these have worn out very quick.
Speedwaymotors has many different ones: https://www.speedwaymotors....32*l_thread_type:134

Which ones to choose?

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'85 GT fastback
'86 SE Lamborghini Countach Replica "Lambo white"
w/ 4.9
'07 Lexus RX 400h Executive (white/tan)
'10 Jaguar XK 5.0 Portfolio (black/tan)

wftb OCT 30, 09:15 AM
You have to measure the stud thread size and the size of the hole in the joint. Then pick the one you want. QA1 website has a great selection of all the different joints available. Once you have their part # you can go to Speedway or Summit and order it. You may have left hand threads, so check that before ordering. The studs come in left or right.

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86 GT built 2.2 ecotec turbo
rear SLA suspension
QA1 coilovers on tube arms

lou_dias OCT 30, 10:59 AM
Whatever you find, please share. I'm in the same boat...
theogre OCT 30, 12:03 PM
Most had 1 heim for inside and standard tie rod ball end for outside.

If standard end fails likely didn't get lube or end got hit very hard. If a wheel got hit, have to get everything else too because can have bent/damage other parts.

Unlike most Heim joints that wear out because not made for this use. Replacing w/ nearly any on link page etc just wear out likely fast again too.
Most are
1. Not made constant loads for suspension for pretty must anything.
2. Not made as "water proof" or even dust resistance and every thing gets in the joint.
Including most ones w/ grease fittings. You grease them often to Very often to lube but also keep dirt/water out.

HM and others made hype/scam "fixes" like a "Bump Steer Kit" for a "bump steer" problem "reported" by some trade rags that claim Fiero has "big problems."
Just replacing OEM Struts and Shocks w/ good Gas units fixes this better even before you anything else. GM uses the Cheapest units on Fiero and most cars that you can't get them anywhere but maybe Dealer Service Parts counter even in 1980's.

I would replace w/ OE design inner rear tie rod and don't worry about them for decades and install gas strut if needed too since will need alignment.
See my Cave, Bump Steer and the rest of section.

If you want better rod then most aftermarket
RD 1984-1987 Heavy Duty Rear Inner Tie Rod

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Dr. Ian Malcolm: Yeah, but your scientists were so preoccupied with whether or not they could, they didn't stop to think if they should.
(Jurassic Park)

The Ogre's Fiero Cave

Will OCT 31, 09:42 AM

quote
Originally posted by theogre:

Most had 1 heim for inside and standard tie rod ball end for outside.




That's the RCC bump steer kit.
Held/Ryane/Arraut's kit replaces the entire control arm.

The rod ends are problably either 5/8" or 3/4". 5/8" is a -10 part, 3/4" is a -12 part. That dimension is both the diameter of the threads AND the diameter of the hole in the ball.

I've started using Aurora VCM/VCB rod ends on my Formula. VCM is right hand thread. VCB is left hand thread. The VC series has a PTFE liner. You should be able to get VCM-10, VCB-10, VCM-12 or VCB-12 from Motion Industries or any of several other suppliers. With the body profile of those rod ends, the Pro-Werks rod end seals work much better than with parts that have thicker bodies.

http://www.corner-carvers.c...198722&postcount=109
olejoedad OCT 31, 11:30 AM
The bumpsteer kits shouldn't be on public roads.
theogre OCT 31, 01:53 PM

quote
Originally posted by Will:
That's the RCC bump steer kit.
Held/Ryane/Arraut's kit replaces the entire control arm.

The rod ends are problably either 5/8" or 3/4". 5/8" is a -10 part, 3/4" is a -12 part. That dimension is both the diameter of the threads AND the diameter of the hole in the ball.

I've started using Aurora VCM/VCB rod ends on my Formula. VCM is right hand thread. VCB is left hand thread. The VC series has a PTFE liner. You should be able to get VCM-10, VCB-10, VCM-12 or VCB-12 from Motion Industries or any of several other suppliers. With the body profile of those rod ends, the Pro-Werks rod end seals work much better than with parts that have thicker bodies.

Thanks for version but has same problem using Heim Joint(s). PTFE is generic Teflon and still have most or all of same issues as metal on metal types and likely some issues for Teflon use too.

quote
Originally posted by olejoedad:
The bumpsteer kits shouldn't be on public roads.

More so if any has newer Arraut parts. Some have broken them because made weaker then original ones. Use search.
Will OCT 31, 03:10 PM

quote
Originally posted by theogre:

Thanks for version but has same problem using Heim Joint(s). PTFE is generic Teflon and still have most or all of same issues as metal on metal types and likely some issues for Teflon use too.



PTFE lined units have non-zero pre-load torque, and thus don't have any play when new. The narrow bodied style works much better with sealing washers than the thick bodied style and at least has a chance at staying clean for a decent period of time.

Fundamentally nothing beats an automotive grade spherical bearing, but they're even harder to implement than industrial/aerospace spherical bearings.
Blacktree OCT 31, 05:20 PM

quote
Originally posted by theogre: Thanks for version but has same problem using Heim Joint(s). PTFE is generic Teflon and still have most or all of same issues as metal on metal types and likely some issues for Teflon use too.


At least the RCC kit doesn't use a clevis joint in the toe link. It's practically impossible for a clevis joint to NOT have slop. Yeah, the Held / Arraut kit has toe links engineered to have slop in them. BRILLIANT!
5000S NOV 01, 10:51 AM
This is correct for all normal and maybe slightly modified 84-87 Fieros. But with a Countach Rebody you have much more weight and a much wider suspension causing trouble. The rear wheels (on 345 tires) have an offset of -40mm and 2 inch spacers on each side. I had the stock setup with all new parts, Koni struts etc. but after installing the Held rear control arms the difference was like day and night, especially with the 4.9 engine. Only problem was the joints wore out after less than 200 miles! In between I had the RCC system - better than OEM but not good enough with the wider suspension.

I found now some of the Heim joints from a German manufacturer. Expensive but heavy duty made for race cars. If they fit, I will post it.

Unfortunately there are no more aftermarket suspension parts like control arms, spindles etc. available anymore.


quote
Originally posted by theogre:

Most had 1 heim for inside and standard tie rod ball end for outside.

If standard end fails likely didn't get lube or end got hit very hard. If a wheel got hit, have to get everything else too because can have bent/damage other parts.

Unlike most Heim joints that wear out because not made for this use. Replacing w/ nearly any on link page etc just wear out likely fast again too.
Most are
1. Not made constant loads for suspension for pretty must anything.
2. Not made as "water proof" or even dust resistance and every thing gets in the joint.
Including most ones w/ grease fittings. You grease them often to Very often to lube but also keep dirt/water out.

HM and others made hype/scam "fixes" like a "Bump Steer Kit" for a "bump steer" problem "reported" by some trade rags that claim Fiero has "big problems."
Just replacing OEM Struts and Shocks w/ good Gas units fixes this better even before you anything else. GM uses the Cheapest units on Fiero and most cars that you can't get them anywhere but maybe Dealer Service Parts counter even in 1980's.

I would replace w/ OE design inner rear tie rod and don't worry about them for decades and install gas strut if needed too since will need alignment.
See my Cave, Bump Steer and the rest of section.

If you want better rod then most aftermarket
RD 1984-1987 Heavy Duty Rear Inner Tie Rod