R152a - A/C alternative fill... (Page 4/6)
theogre AUG 05, 11:31 AM

quote
Originally posted by fierosound:
Daimler Group will not be using R1234yf. They contend it is flammable.

So what.
GM and others are using this for new cars for reason posted above. GMC hits the road with R-1234yf 9/22/2016 www.macsw.org
R1234yf is not legal for converting/retofitting R12 or R134 for "old" cars.


quote
Originally posted by fierosound:
Yahoo! A/C system still working fine.
It is blowing SO cold it can freeze you out of the car…
It appears I had finally fixed ALL the leaks once and for all.



quote
Originally posted by fierosound:
It's been 1 YEAR and the A/C system is working exactly as it did last year.

You getting away w/ illegal refrigerant mean just that. Your admitting in public can haunt you if anyone is hurt or killed. You may never get charged for a crime but Lawyer love to dig thru all post to forums, FB, etc for suing you.
Say the crap May be legal in Canada to retofit, doubtful because Canada DOT rules are very close or exact as NHTSA/USDOT but say anyway... Drive that to US and your gambling w/ US Customs and other law enforcement and Lawyers that sue quoting US DOT and EPA rules.

[This message has been edited by theogre (edited 08-05-2017).]

theogre AUG 05, 11:40 AM
MSDS Highlights:

quote
PRODUCT NAME: R-152a
OTHER NAME: Difluoroethane
CLASSIFICATION: Flammable Gas, Gas under pressure, Compressed Gas
SIGNAL WORD: DANGER
HAZARD STATEMENT(S): Extremely flammable gas, Contains gas under pressure, may explode if heated
Inhalation
Vapor is heavier than air and can cause suffocation by reducing oxygen available for breathing.
Inhalation of high vapor concentration may cause dizziness, disorientation, incoordination, narcosis, nausea or vomiting, leading to unconsciousness, cardiac irregularities, or death.


http://www.refrigerants.com/pdf/SDS%20R152a.pdf
http://www.afrox.co.za/inte...266_406284.pdf?v=1.0
http://www.msds-al.co.uk/as...P-DIFLUOROETHANE.pdf

This is part of why EPA limits "exposure to concentrations of R–152a above 3.7% in the passenger cabin free space for more than 15 seconds, even in the event of a leak."
Results can have same as CO exposure problem in Ford Cop SUV https://www.google.com/sear...ford+co+exposure+suv
So far no-one died in that case but Cops are already suing Ford.

Side Note: Fellowes and some other "Canned air" products have R-152a (as 1,1-Difluoroethane)... http://content.oppictures.c...s/fel9963101_sds.pdf
Others are also flammable since stopped using CFC.

[This message has been edited by theogre (edited 08-05-2017).]

KurtAKX AUG 05, 01:27 PM
I'll add some fuel to the debate.

I converted my beater 87 with a V5 compressor to 152 when I bought it. Works great.

What I like is that the GWP is way lower and it's intended to be released into the atmosphere, as opposed to 134 which is illegal to release.

That, and I can buy enough to do two cars for $17 at Costco.
KurtAKX AUG 05, 01:36 PM
Environmental Impacts of MVAC Refrigerants

MVAC Refrigerant Global Warming Potential Ozone Depleting?
CFC-12. 10,900 Yes
HFC-134a 1,430 No
HFC-152a 124 No
HFC-1234yf 4 No
CO2 (R-744) 1 No

Basically, if you care about being legal use 134; if you care about actual environmental damage use 152
Dennis LaGrua AUG 05, 01:39 PM

quote
Originally posted by KurtAKX:

I'll add some fuel to the debate.

I converted my beater 87 with a V5 compressor to 152 when I bought it. Works great.

What I like is that the GWP is way lower and it's intended to be released into the atmosphere, as opposed to 134 which is illegal to release.

That, and I can buy enough to do two cars for $17 at Costco.



Butane R152, /Envirosafe will provide great cooling but is it worth having a potential bomb in your vehicle? The place that bottled that stuff had a fire and an explosion that blew the side of a brick building off. Its on You Tube

------------------
" THE BLACK PARALYZER" -87GT 3800SC Series III engine, custom ZZP /Frozen Boost Intercooler setup, 3.4" Pulley, Northstar TB, LS1 MAF, 3" Spintech/Hedman Exhaust, Autolite 104's, MSD wires, Custom CAI, 4T65eHD w. custom axles, HP Tuners VCM Suite.
"THE COLUSSUS"
87GT - ALL OUT 3.4L Turbocharged engine, Garrett Hybrid Turbo, MSD ign., modified TH125H
" ON THE LOOSE WITHOUT THE JUICE "

Raydar AUG 05, 04:13 PM

quote
Originally posted by theogre:
...
You getting away w/ illegal refrigerant mean just that. Your admitting in public can haunt you if anyone is hurt or killed. You may never get charged for a crime but Lawyer love to dig thru all post to forums, FB, etc for suing you.
Say the crap May be legal in Canada to retofit, doubtful because Canada DOT rules are very close or exact as NHTSA/USDOT but say anyway... Drive that to US and your gambling w/ US Customs and other law enforcement and Lawyers that sue quoting US DOT and EPA rules.
theogre AUG 05, 06:41 PM

quote
Originally posted by Raydar:
CLICK FOR FULL SIZE

I like that...

Even ignore Legal issue... Have flammable refrigerate in a system never made to have it is never a good plan.
R12 and R134a systems was design to be as cheap and light as possible and have problems because they are made such. Even new cars can have leak problems.
R12/R134a evaporators alone are famous for leak problems. Water and crap in the AC/Heater Box often rots and weaken the bottom of the evaporator then leaks/burst w/o warning. Could be smaller than a pin hole or dump entire refrigerant load in seconds. You saw the fires result of crap in the blower resistor? Same or worse can happen w/ R152. Flammable Refrigerant and Smoking then you may never hear/see anything before car explodes.

R1234yf systems are heavier and design to prevent most things that killed old R12 and R134a systems.
Some R1234yf systems may have valves that dump the refrigerate outside the cabin and even outside of the engine bay when SRS blows the airbags etc in a crash.
These are to prevent leaking and fires cause by R1234yf, more so inside the car.

[This message has been edited by theogre (edited 08-05-2017).]

Dennis LaGrua AUG 05, 06:42 PM
Check this out before using:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7X7ddGwpqfY
------------------
" THE BLACK PARALYZER" -87GT 3800SC Series III engine, custom ZZP /Frozen Boost Intercooler setup, 3.4" Pulley, Northstar TB, LS1 MAF, 3" Spintech/Hedman Exhaust, Autolite 104's, MSD wires, Custom CAI, 4T65eHD w. custom axles, HP Tuners VCM Suite.
"THE COLUSSUS"
87GT - ALL OUT 3.4L Turbocharged engine, Garrett Hybrid Turbo, MSD ign., modified TH125H
" ON THE LOOSE WITHOUT THE JUICE "

[This message has been edited by Dennis LaGrua (edited 08-05-2017).]

theogre AUG 05, 06:47 PM

quote
Originally posted by KurtAKX:
Basically, if you care about being legal use 134; if you care about actual environmental damage use 152


This is nothing but same self-justifying junk that people used Propane and Butane for the same job. Saying they are Cheap and even safe for the environmental...
code:
R-#        what     GWP    ODP 
R-290    Propane    3.3    <0(smog) (mean is not ODP problem but it is for Smog)
R-600    Butane     4       0
"Ozone Depleting?" in your table is No for both
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_refrigerants (Many other "drop in" replacements are a mix of flammable and/or nonflammable refrigerants. Get MSDS for them to see.)
da.slyboy AUG 06, 12:17 AM

quote
Originally posted by Dennis LaGrua:


Butane R152, /Envirosafe will provide great cooling but is it worth having a potential bomb in your vehicle? The place that bottled that stuff had a fire and an explosion that blew the side of a brick building off. Its on You Tube


Despite the fact we have several items on vehicles with the potential to explode already (gas, batteries, tires, airbags). Yes I know, all those items mentioned are made to be safe on vehicles....but a google search will bring up more cases of those hazards then the ones with modified AC.