The Turbo 3500 F23 swap (Page 37/80)
Joseph Upson AUG 05, 08:26 AM

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Originally posted by Dennis LaGrua:
If you are running oil to a turbo a standard rubber oil line held on a hose nipple by clamps will not hold. Either use a steel line, double flared with brass fittings (preferred) at the ends or AR fittings and stainless steel braided lines.



What he said eric, unless you know exactly what to look for you can't trust a bulk oil hose purchase from a counter man/woman who doesn't understand the difference between oil hose, oil resistant hose and heater hose. On my very first turbo build I used what I was told was oil hose clamped on to nipples which will hold as long as they have good shark-bite ridges. One day while working on the car I bumped a hose at the turbo and it broke off. It had become extremely brittle in just a few weeks of use. Not sure what they gave me but my mistake was not looking at the temp range usually stamped on the hose which needs to be at least 300 deg as I've measured 240 plus with a turbo and no oil cooler. Since that incident I used metal brake line or braided PTFE.

As for your headers, keep it simple with a turbo, as simple as you did on page 4. The only thing I would do is make it tighter with shorter radius mandrel bends. If you're not racing it you're unlikely to gain any real benefit from the added heat and leak risk from the spaghetti outfit not to mention it would need to be stainless for longevity if you're planning to wrap it.

If it's not too late get a turbo with a water cooled center. It will not protect against oil starvation but it will certainly increase longevity.
ericjon262 AUG 05, 01:56 PM
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[This message has been edited by ericjon262 (edited 09-11-2022).]

Joseph Upson AUG 05, 02:08 PM
You just scared me because my oil line is braided AN fitted line from siliconeintakes. It has been on the car for about 5 yrs now. I was going to suggest schedule 40 elbows for the exhaust. Once put together you should have trouble free service. I'm sure you're on top of it but just in case make sure you use studs for the exhaust and elongate any close fitting exhaust bolt hole to reduce the possibility of shearing anything off.

[This message has been edited by Joseph Upson (edited 08-05-2016).]

ericjon262 AUG 05, 02:38 PM
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[This message has been edited by ericjon262 (edited 09-11-2022).]

Joseph Upson AUG 05, 03:02 PM

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Originally posted by ericjon262:

did you use their fittings? I don't remember seeing anything on their site about using their fittings when I bought the lines, and the fitting I used is a standard hose end. I think that may be the root of my failure, but it's hard to say for sure.

on a separate, but related note, I was using their hose for my fuel lines, and the high pressure line failed in the middle of the line. no sign of damage, just blew out.



Yes I used their fittings. I have two types of braided line. The first I used I believe is called CPE for the fuel line. I prefer that braided line because it is much more flexible than the PTFE which is what the OE plastic looking fuel line found connected to modern fuel rails is.

The draw back is that the CPE is porous and although it doesn't out right leak fuel, it does tend to bleed through and in some cases can give off fumes and apparently that is one of the reasons PTFE has come about, I believe it also allows some oil to bleed through a little. I purchased it off ebay along with fittings which had a different locking mechanism attachment to the hose. The siliconeintakes fittings were a bit more sophisticated and dependable and now that I think about it, if you attempted to clamp the braided PTFE line to a nipple I'm pretty certain that's where your trouble started as that inner hose which is more like a hard plastic line probably didn't compress much. The CPE looks like a thin rubber braided hose and would have worked well with just a clamp.

[This message has been edited by Joseph Upson (edited 08-05-2016).]

Fierobsessed AUG 06, 08:44 PM

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Originally posted by Joseph Upson:
PTFE which is what the OE plastic looking fuel line found connected to modern fuel rails is.



The black stuff? That's actually Nylon. Good for gas, air and vacuum, but it can get brittle with heat.

PTFE or teflon itself is extremely soft and weak, it can't take any pressure before it ruptures. However, it is resilient to pretty much all chemicals. Oil, refrigerant, coolant, gas, alcohol? No problem. It's the braid itself that is actually what is holding the pressure keeping the line from ballooning. That's why they require special fittings that actually grab and anchor back the braid instead of just freely clamp around the outside. Usually you want to keep the temperature under 250f or so. Teflon gets far softer with temperature. With the correct fittings, it can hold hundreds of PSI, to around 1000 depending on size and the fitting type.

Silicone should be avoided with anything other then air or coolant. Oil and gas cause it to swell up.

It's also important to never over tighten a hose clamp, especially over a barb fitting and even more so with silicone. You tighten the hose clamp down too much and the barbs will begin to slice the inside of the pressure holding part of the hose, which is everything from the internal braid inwards. once that layer gets pierced, fluid will fill the outer jacket causing ballooning and rupturing of the hose, usually catastrophically.
ericjon262 AUG 07, 12:48 PM
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[This message has been edited by ericjon262 (edited 09-11-2022).]

ericjon262 AUG 10, 03:02 AM
well, when I built this thing I was thinking I could just unbolt the ebay POS turbo, and bolt in something reliable, well, my earlier attempts to remove the turbo to replace it proves that my design was crap and to remove and replace the turbo is probably going to require me to drop the cradle for the install... it's gonna be a royal PITA the whole way...
ericjon262 AUG 18, 09:41 AM
old turbo is out, the turbo I ordered had the wrong outlet flange, so it's going back. I ordered a different turbo, that appears to be closer to what I purchased 3 or 4 years ago.
Joseph Upson AUG 18, 11:07 AM

quote
Originally posted by ericjon262:
old turbo is out, the turbo I ordered had the wrong outlet flange, so it's going back. I ordered a different turbo, that appears to be closer to what I purchased 3 or 4 years ago.



You should be able to rebuild the first one also for a backup if the failure was not catastrophic and mainly a smoke out from bearing play. It's pretty straight forward with a complete rebuild kit.