Joe Biden and Classified Documents (Page 8/17)
82-T/A [At Work] JAN 13, 08:28 AM

quote
Originally posted by rinselberg:

Very droll, but if the reporting (to date) holds up, the Biden-linked documents with classified markings are only a small fraction of the number of documents with classified markings that the FBI confiscated from Mar-a-Lago, and only one of the Biden-linked documents is Top Secret.

Imagine the same cartoon, but with only one Top Secret document escaping from the Corvette.




I don't think you're listening to me... or you're intentionally trying to not understand what I'm saying.


Trump's Mar-a-Lago office is a SCIF. It has a CIPHER lock on the door. It looks like this:



Trump's office is STILL, CURRENTLY, a SCIF. He has what's called an NSTS phone in his office. That allows him to have classified discussions if need be with the current administration. As much as Biden's team hates Trump... all former presidents, including Carter still have a space with which they can still have classified discussions if for any other reason than to properly convey security threats to the life-long secret service (likely in Carter's situation).

Finally... there should never be a comparison to Trump... because even if you don't like Trump, or think he shouldn't have done any of the things he did... he is literally the ONLY one who has the authority to "literally" wave his hand over a stack of papers to declassify them. There is a process of course to ensure they are properly released, but that becomes everyone else's problem. The president, if he wanted to, could take classified documents and hand them out at a rally, thus declassifying them. It would just be a really dick thing to do because no one else would know what was released, and therefore couldn't formally release them in FIOAs or other proper venues. Regardless, at the time, Trump, and ONLY Trump had the authority to declassify documents. This is NOT a power that Congress holds, because the power of classification was derived ENTIRELY by executive order, and has never been something defined in legislation. In this type of situation, the President is essentially a "king" as it pertains to classified information... there is no higher authority.


Now let's look at Biden. He has no authority to declassify documents. He had absolutely no business taking classified documents for which he had no authority to procure. His access to classified materials is granted to him by the President of the United States. The Vice President does not have a SCIF after leaving office, as the VP largely does very little in most cases. Ignoring the fact that Biden had these classified documents in unsecured / classified spaces for over 6 years, which encompassed the entire Trump presidency... it means he's technically guilty of the same thing that anyone else who knowingly takes classified documents out of a building.

So the "number" of documents makes absolutely no difference whatsoever.
rinselberg JAN 13, 08:54 AM

quote
Originally posted by 82-T/A [At Work]:
I don't think you're listening to me... or you're intentionally trying to not understand what I'm saying...


Hello "82"

You just said a lot. Let me just make one point, about the serving President's declassification authority. As President, Trump did not have the authority to declassify certain kinds of nuclear-related documents solely on his own volition. In order to legitimately declassify this particular category of documents, the President has to have the formal, officially recorded agreement or signoff from certain other specifically designated officials with nuclear-related responsibilities. And I believe (if memory serves me) that it was reported by the news media that documents with classified markings of this special category were among the documents that the FBI confiscated from Mar-a-Lago.

I don't know about the remainder of what you said. If you're right, I guess Trump shouldn't be losing any sleep over DOJ Special Counsel Jack Smith, in so far as the DOJ investigation related to the Presidential records and documents at Mar-a-Lago.

That's as far as my thinking takes me, at the moment.

[This message has been edited by rinselberg (edited 01-13-2023).]

Wichita JAN 13, 09:06 AM
Has anyone ask why they were looking through his garage?

I mean, the MSM said the first trove was discovered by 'accident' in his private office by his legal team and to move on to bash Republicans.

Now this?

Biden is too feeble to even remember anything. Maybe they were for Hunter to sell for crack or something, but I do now find it curious that they are officially raiding his residence and bringing this out in public. Usually this stuff gets buried. Granted they buried it till after the mid-terms.

I can only suspect that they don't want Biden to run again, so this is a move to taint his chances of re-election.

blackrams JAN 13, 09:49 AM

quote
Originally posted by Wichita:
Usually this stuff gets buried. Granted they buried it till after the mid-terms.

I can only suspect that they don't want Biden to run again, so this is a move to taint his chances of re-election.



You may be closer to the center of the target than any of us know. Politics is the filthiest business known to mankind.

Rams
USFiero JAN 13, 11:46 AM
There is a pro-Trump message board patriots dot win that covers these things and often turn up some relevant points.

An article from 2015 mentioned the third location had an alarm system in the garage that Hunter kept setting off so often the Secret Service disabled it. The same address appeared in Hunter's driver's license. That he claimed to own.

I feel the 'third' location isn't as significant as the first two and the documents (all total of unknown actual content - like Trump's legally declassified Mar a Lago stash) won't be deemed particularly damning and used to deflect from the obvious interaction with the Chinese and compromising info on corruption dealing with Ukraine and God knows what on Iran.

I used to be somewhat ambivalent about Joe - accepting he's a notorious liar and all going way back - but like Obama he has evolved into a destructive and dangerous influence on our nation's power in the world. He really needs to be removed from office, be it impeachment or the 25th amendment. Oddly there is some speculation that the very people who installed him in the White House are moving to get him out.

I started out like most of the country skeptical of a Trump presidency but was repeatedly surprised and pleased with the man's performance - enough to vote for him in 2020.

After two years of this current administration I suspect the majority of voters realize the Democratic party has hurt our country and possibly the world in profound ways. Hopefully fiscal conservatism and non-interventionist attitudes will come back in vogue.
82-T/A [At Work] JAN 13, 12:55 PM

quote
Originally posted by rinselberg:

Hello "82"

You just said a lot. Let me just make one point, about the serving President's declassification authority. As President, Trump did not have the authority to declassify certain kinds of nuclear-related documents solely on his own volition. In order to legitimately declassify this particular category of documents, the President has to have the formal, officially recorded agreement or signoff from certain other specifically designated officials with nuclear-related responsibilities. And I believe (if memory serves me) that it was reported by the news media that documents with classified markings of this special category were among the documents that the FBI confiscated from Mar-a-Lago.

I don't know about the remainder of what you said. If you're right, I guess Trump shouldn't be losing any sleep over DOJ Special Counsel Jack Smith, in so far as the DOJ investigation related to the Presidential records and documents at Mar-a-Lago.

That's as far as my thinking takes me, at the moment.





Totally Incorrect.

For one, there were no nuclear codes, or any of that in Trump's office. Aside from the fact that nuclear codes are digital, it's already been rescinded by the media... that was something that was erroneously started. Second, you're talking about stuff that was classified by the Atomic Energy Commission, prior to the creation of the Department of Energy. AEC classified documents, and early DOE classified documents can still be declassified at will by the president. Where you're getting tripped up is whether or not these documents can be declassified "automatically." There is a provision, again... by executive order, that requires all classified information to be automatically declassified after 25 years unless it's specifically held. That means if one government worker e-mails another government worker over a cubical wall and puts, "I farted, sorry, that was me..." and classifies it with caveats, it can still be automatically declassified with a FIOA request if you submit a FOIA asking for all the e-mails where an employee said, "I farted," in an e-mail.

But as I've repeatedly said... which is not getting through. The entire concept of "classification" is created by the President. The president has the sole authority. There exists no such law establishing the classification of documents... it's ENTIRELY created through executive order, and every president refines that executive order. The most important one is EO12333: https://dodsioo.defense.gov/Library/EO-12333/
blackrams JAN 13, 01:48 PM
Todd,
Do you believe there is any truth to the story that says President Obama once said that if Joe Biden had any access, then, it wasn't very important?

Rams

[This message has been edited by blackrams (edited 01-13-2023).]

82-T/A [At Work] JAN 13, 02:13 PM

quote
Originally posted by blackrams:

Todd,
Do you believe there is any truth to the story that says President Obama once said that if Joe Biden had any access, then, it wasn't very important?

Rams




Hahah... probably. I think my biggest concern in all this is whether or not there's anything to the 54 million dollar donations from Chinese interest to PennBiden, and them using 46 million to then successfully lobby against the DOJ investigating China's influence in U.S. universities.


Aside from the rest of this... we all know how this is going to end...
- There will be millions spent on a stupid investigation for which we already know the conclusion. It will get none of the same coverage as Comey or Mueller got.
- The real aspect of it (if there was any actual Chinese involvement at PennBiden) will be totally ignored, and never mentioned again.
- Congress may subpoena Hur and Garland... ask them some questions, they'll get the usual bull-**** answers.
- After 6-8 months, Hur will make a statement, precluded by a statement from Garland, with a bunch of random professional looking people standing behind them at the podium. They'll basically say the documents were inadvertently transported with other documents by accident. That they're going too ensure in future transitions, they'll do a better job of securing documents and blah blah, and then they'll throw in there somewhere about 3/4ths of the way through speech that no charges will be filed.
- Everyone will be asking about Trump, and no one will respond. If they do, they will say "we do not discuss current investigations," which we know is not true. That's an excuse when they haven't formulated a good response, or want an easy-out.
- A few months later, the DOJ will quitely drop the charges against Trump. Trump will "Truth" this out... and the MSM will not really cover it or care.
rinselberg JAN 13, 02:37 PM

quote
Originally posted by 82-T/A [At Work]:
a bunch of random professional looking people standing behind them at the podium


I would change that, to a more current and contemporaneous expression:

quote
a bunch of professional-looking randos standing behind them at the podium


If I were handed that, in my role as a Copy Editor. If I had that role.

The singular being "rando" and pluralizing that to "randos"

It's a term (rando) that brought a conspicuous smile to Monday through Friday MSNBC anchor Ari Melber when he was discussing the alternate slates of electors in connection with "January 6."

You can trust me on that.

[This message has been edited by rinselberg (edited 01-13-2023).]

Raydar JAN 13, 02:52 PM

quote
Originally posted by williegoat:

The bigger concern in that regard is the docs that were stashed at the Penn Biden Center. That place was a huge funnel for Chinese money, and I would not be a bit surprised to find Ukrainian and Iranian "donations" as well.



How... convenient.