TRUMP 2024 (Page 3/59)
ray b JAN 07, 01:43 PM

quote
Originally posted by Raydar:


About as much horseshit as I would expect from WAPO.



but they never question the loonie moonie paper just the MSM

strong hint of a CULT that never forgave WOPO for NIXON

MAGA is a CULT
rinselberg JAN 07, 06:42 PM

quote
Originally posted by Raydar:
About as much horseshit as I would expect from WAPO.


"This is your brain on neutrons."
theBDub JAN 07, 08:27 PM

quote
"Think of it, magnets," Trump said. "Now all I know about magnets is this, give me a glass of water, let me drop it on the magnets, that's the end of the magnets. Why didn't they use John Deere? Why didn't they bring in the John Deere people? Do you like John Deere? I like John Deere."



Just the latest from Dementia Don. Yeah, he’s clear as glass lmao.
Cliff Pennock JAN 08, 03:40 AM
I hardly ever venture (voluntarily) in the P&R section. In fact, I think this is the second time the past year. Also, this is the only thread I've read so far and probably will be my last as well. Just think of it as me getting lost on the way to the bathroom and accidentally ending up here. Or something like that. 😁

Aaaaaanyways...

As most non-US citizens, I think your whole "winner takes all" electoral system is flawed. Since this means all other parties other than the Democrats or Republicans will always have zero percent chance of becoming part of the government. Not 1%, not even 0.01%. But literally 0%. Here, we have a system that if your party gets 10% of the votes, 10% of the government will be representatives of this party. It's as democratic as can be. In the US, people are actually forced into voting either for the Democrats or Republicans. Because again, the winner takes all and it's a 100% certainty one of these two will win. So people don't actually vote "pro", they vote "anti". If a person doesn't want the democrats to win (in a certain state), they will vote republican. And not necessarily because they're actually a republican.

So you are stuck at choosing between Tweedledee and Tweedledum for your next president. Again, here in Europe we cannot believe your next president is going to be either Biden or Trump - because neither is really fit for office. Sure, I get that you think one is better than the other, but still - Tweedledee and Tweedledum.

Your electoral system is so far off being a democratic process, it's scary. There aren't many countries where someone can win the elections with less votes than his opponents. Or where the government is in no way a representation of what the people actually vote for. I mean, a third party could get 30% of the popular votes and still not have a single representative in the government. Like I said. Scary. And incredibly flawed.
BingB JAN 08, 10:12 AM

quote
Originally posted by Cliff Pennock:

I hardly ever venture (voluntarily) in the P&R section. In fact, I think this is the second time the past year. Also, this is the only thread I've read so far and probably will be my last as well. Just think of it as me getting lost on the way to the bathroom and accidentally ending up here. Or something like that. 😁

Aaaaaanyways...

As most non-US citizens, I think your whole "winner takes all" electoral system is flawed. Since this means all other parties other than the Democrats or Republicans will always have zero percent chance of becoming part of the government. Not 1%, not even 0.01%. But literally 0%. Here, we have a system that if your party gets 10% of the votes, 10% of the government will be representatives of this party. It's as democratic as can be. In the US, people are actually forced into voting either for the Democrats or Republicans. Because again, the winner takes all and it's a 100% certainty one of these two will win. So people don't actually vote "pro", they vote "anti". If a person doesn't want the democrats to win (in a certain state), they will vote republican. And not necessarily because they're actually a republican.

So you are stuck at choosing between Tweedledee and Tweedledum for your next president. Again, here in Europe we cannot believe your next president is going to be either Biden or Trump - because neither is really fit for office. Sure, I get that you think one is better than the other, but still - Tweedledee and Tweedledum.

Your electoral system is so far off being a democratic process, it's scary. There aren't many countries where someone can win the elections with less votes than his opponents. Or where the government is in no way a representation of what the people actually vote for. I mean, a third party could get 30% of the popular votes and still not have a single representative in the government. Like I said. Scary. And incredibly flawed.




Could not agree more. As evenly as this country is divided right now a third party (parties) that just controlled 5%-10% of the seats in congress could force compromise that would get the country running smoother.
Raydar JAN 08, 12:12 PM

quote
Originally posted by Cliff Pennock:
...

As most non-US citizens, I think your whole "winner takes all" electoral system is flawed. Since this means all other parties other than the Democrats or Republicans will always have zero percent chance of becoming part of the government. Not 1%, not even 0.01%. But literally 0%. Here, we have a system that if your party gets 10% of the votes, 10% of the government will be representatives of this party. It's as democratic as can be. In the US, people are actually forced into voting either for the Democrats or Republicans. Because again, the winner takes all and it's a 100% certainty one of these two will win.



Thanks for popping in. Nice to see an "outsider's" opinion.
Americans have a long history of "holding their noses" while they vote.

It's truly sad that these two doorstops are the best we can come up with. Because of situations like this, it always comes down to what each of us perceive as the lesser of the two evils.
There truly needs to be a meaningful third party, at least. But of course the people in power don't want that, so it isn't likely to happen.

Hence my earlier comment. Someone sane, running as an independent, has a better chance now, than they have had in a very long time.

But everyone is afraid to vote for the independent, lest their "most feared evil" become the winner by default.
So... Tweedledee or Tweedledum it will likely be.

[This message has been edited by Raydar (edited 01-08-2024).]

82-T/A [At Work] JAN 08, 02:21 PM

quote
Originally posted by Cliff Pennock:

I hardly ever venture (voluntarily) in the P&R section. In fact, I think this is the second time the past year. Also, this is the only thread I've read so far and probably will be my last as well. Just think of it as me getting lost on the way to the bathroom and accidentally ending up here. Or something like that. 😁

Aaaaaanyways...

As most non-US citizens, I think your whole "winner takes all" electoral system is flawed. Since this means all other parties other than the Democrats or Republicans will always have zero percent chance of becoming part of the government. Not 1%, not even 0.01%. But literally 0%. Here, we have a system that if your party gets 10% of the votes, 10% of the government will be representatives of this party. It's as democratic as can be. In the US, people are actually forced into voting either for the Democrats or Republicans. Because again, the winner takes all and it's a 100% certainty one of these two will win. So people don't actually vote "pro", they vote "anti". If a person doesn't want the democrats to win (in a certain state), they will vote republican. And not necessarily because they're actually a republican.

So you are stuck at choosing between Tweedledee and Tweedledum for your next president. Again, here in Europe we cannot believe your next president is going to be either Biden or Trump - because neither is really fit for office. Sure, I get that you think one is better than the other, but still - Tweedledee and Tweedledum.

Your electoral system is so far off being a democratic process, it's scary. There aren't many countries where someone can win the elections with less votes than his opponents. Or where the government is in no way a representation of what the people actually vote for. I mean, a third party could get 30% of the popular votes and still not have a single representative in the government. Like I said. Scary. And incredibly flawed.




I think it's important to understand that even though we use the word "democracy" all the time, our country is really more of a Republic. Not to diminish how the Dutch manage their government, but think of the United States more like the European Union. The states are more like the individual countries within the European Union. That said, we do still have a "winner takes all" for the individual governors, just as you do for your cities and provinces. But the structure was very intentionally designed because power was not meant to be shared by multiple parties. The way power is regulated in the United States is through the three branches of government... Executive (President), Legislative (House and Senate), and the Judicial (Supreme court and minor courts).

This is a very common misconception about how the United States is run, and I often find myself wondering why we don't elect a president in a similar way, but it's not like the European form of government didn't already exist in some capacity at the time of our founding... but the structure of our government is very intentional. I'd say the one thing our founders didn't consider is the power that the President does have. 99% of the government is under the control of the President. This idea that Federal agencies are independent and have no political impropriety is a huge misnomer that most in the United States don't understand. The President of the United States has direct authority to tell each agency to do exactly as he wishes. I'm not sure where people get the idea that in the United States these agencies are a-political... it started somewhere... or maybe it just grew out of narrative. But this is not enshrined anywhere and is so far from fact that it's become some what of a crazy idea that people have that's just so far from reality.

Anyway, Presidents have become weak, and fearful... no one wants to be the bad guy, so the executive branch (e.g., the government agencies and departments) look like a graveyard of former and failed presidential administrations. We create new organizations, but never eliminate them when they no longer serve a need. Congress creates them through law... and subsequently funds them, but they are under the SOLE authority of the President so long as actual Constitutional law is not violated.
ray b JAN 08, 04:36 PM
I think we need a NONE OF THE ABOVE CHOICE

on every ballot in every race

AND IF ''NOTA'' wins

all candidates can not run for that office again
as they were REJECTED

and not because my screen name is NOTA on many boards

but because it is a good idea
Cliff Pennock JAN 08, 04:46 PM

quote
Originally posted by 82-T/A [At Work]:

That said, we do still have a "winner takes all" for the individual governors, just as you do for your cities and provinces.



Actually, even in provinces/municipalities, it's a representation of the parties the people have voted for. We don't have a "winner takes all" system anywhere.
Patrick JAN 08, 05:26 PM

quote
Originally posted by Cliff Pennock:

Again, here in Europe we cannot believe your next president is going to be either Biden or Trump - because neither is really fit for office.



It's much the same belief here in Canada. And being located right next door to the United States, our economies are incestuously intertwined, so we have a lot to lose if the Americans screw up.