Ukraine is screwed.......... (Page 3/19)
82-T/A [At Work] JAN 21, 09:02 PM

quote
Originally posted by randye:

The Kalashnikov rifle in all of it's variants is one of the most prolific and cheap small arms on the planet so this kind of photo has to make you wonder.




Hahah! Oh man, that is hilarious! I guess they're training, but man... that's gold right there.
Jake_Dragon JAN 21, 09:04 PM
"The man with the rifle shoots, the man without the rifle follows."

(enemies at the gate reference)
randye JAN 21, 10:55 PM

quote
Originally posted by 82-T/A [At Work]:
Hahah! Oh man, that is hilarious! I guess they're training, but man... that's gold right there.




It is decidedly NOT funny.

There isn't a single capable, modern, military anywhere in the world today that trains it's troops with cardboard cut-out weapons.

Ukraine has been trying to stand down the constant threat of a Russian invasion for over 7 YEARS now.....longer if you want to add their efforts at independence after 1991.

Granted there is a good bit of "who, what, when, where and why" associated with that single photo, but it isn't a good look and to me it suggests there might be a TO&E problem.

That said, I have a lot of "strategic theory" of my own based on a long familiarity with the region and in particular the Donbass and the Russian naval base at Sevastopol, which IMHO is at the direct heart of the issue.

[This message has been edited by randye (edited 01-22-2022).]

theBDub JAN 22, 01:45 AM

quote
Originally posted by 82-T/A [At Work]:

…

Personally, my opinion is that we should have begun arming Ukraine and supporting them with better conventional hardware and surface to air missile intercept deployments. We should have done this from the very beginning. We don't have to get involved in a fight per-se, but we can leverage our power to ensure one does not happen.

...




Haven’t we done that enough elsewhere to see it come back and bite us?

I don’t want Ukraine taken over, but at what point is it just… not our problem? Sounds callous, but I’m actually asking. Ukraine is actually very interesting with this because they’re one of the more capable nations that have faced this in the last few decades.
sourmash JAN 22, 01:03 PM

quote
Originally posted by randye:

It is decidedly NOT funny.

There isn't a single capable, modern, military anywhere in the world today that trains it's troops with cardboard cut-out weapons.

Ukraine has been trying to stand down the constant threat of a Russian invasion for over 7 YEARS now.....longer if you want to add their efforts at independence after 1991.

That said, I have a lot of "strategic theory" of my own based on a long familiarity with the region and in particular the Donbass and the Russian naval base at Sevastopol, which IMHO is at the direct heart of the issue.



No, they haven't. The Ukraine has been at the center (in the region) of globalist internationalists who have been instigating an overthrow and selling out of the power to their cohorts and the USA is the instrument they used to do it.

As proof you're wrong, the 2 break away regions that are led by Russian separatists have not been recognized by Russia for what, 7-8 years now?

NATO and the US State Dept created this situation and the region has been living under threat due to what they have created.
82-T/A [At Work] JAN 22, 01:19 PM

quote
Originally posted by theBDub:

Haven’t we done that enough elsewhere to see it come back and bite us?

I don’t want Ukraine taken over, but at what point is it just… not our problem? Sounds callous, but I’m actually asking. Ukraine is actually very interesting with this because they’re one of the more capable nations that have faced this in the last few decades.




Non-Intervention is definitely a "libertarian" trait; however, we can also be an ally. They supported us militarily and politically during the Afghan war that we engaged everyone else to participate in, with the "You are with us, or against us" speech. Granted, I think Ukraine only had maybe ~50 soldiers, if even that... but they also supported us politically in that regard. I don't expect us to fight their war for them, but they are an ally, period.

The United States still provides "foreign aide" to China, for God only knows what reason. We could use that money instead for a lot of things, but one could be to assist Ukraine with supporting their defenses. I'm more on the side of Trump's idea of ending these constant wars, and not starting new ones. But I'm also a fan of holding our adversaries accountable... which includes not allowing our enemies to "grow their power." We can do both, without involving our own troops.
maryjane JAN 22, 01:42 PM

quote
Originally posted by randye:
It is decidedly NOT funny.

There isn't a single capable, modern, military anywhere in the world today that trains it's troops with cardboard cut-out weapons.


Those are most likely, members of the recently formed Territorial Defense Units. In-Active reservists and local formed militia called up and trying to get quickly 'trained'.


Some are better equipped than others.
https://www.rferl.org/a/ukr...n-kyiv/31402369.html
Many own and bring their own rifles, according to some reports.
maryjane JAN 22, 01:46 PM
Some of us know and never forget what wins wars.

The young Marine was weary
and he sought a little rest
With his helmet for a pillow
And his rifle on his chest.
He has seen the gunships fire.
He had heard the cannons roar.
He had seen the Navy's power
as he made his way ashore.
Then he thought about his rifle
And he found it rather small,
With the gunships and the cannons
It was nothing much at all.
The efforts of a rifleman
Meant little, it would seem.
Then, as he slipped to slumber,
He dreamed himself a dream.

The man who stood beside him
Held a musket in his hand
And close around his neck he wore
A heavy leather band.
"When I was on Old Ironsides"
The apparition said
"There were cannonballs and cutlasses
Wherever danger led.
There were pistols too, and daggers
At every fighter's side
When the ships would come together
On the rolling, heaving, tide.
But when it came to boarding,
With the battle fury hot
It was Rifles, always Rifles
That made the telling shot."

The apparition faded
And standing in its place
Beneath a shallow helmet
He saw another face.
"When we were in the trenches
In the wood they called Marine
There were mortars, tanks and cannons,
More than I had ever seen.
But when the final charge was made
To push the Germans back
It was Rifles, always Rifles
At the point of the attack."

The face changed only slightly
And the helmet stayed the same
But the island that he spoke of
Had a more familiar name.
"They hit us very early
On the day the war begun.
On the wings of all their bombers
We could see the Rising Sun.
Our pilots and our gunners
Who fought and fell at Wake
Wrote a story full of glory
That time can never shake.
But when the enemy drew near
To make his final reach
It was Rifles, always Rifles
That met him on the beach."

There next appeared a shadow
In a swirl of stinging snow
And it breathed a fierce defiance
And its eyes were all aglow.
"In Fifty at the Chosin
When the big guns couldn't talk
And the First Marine Division
Took a fighting, freezing walk,
When all the world, except the Corps
Had counted us as gone
It was Rifles, always Rifles
That let us carry on."

The scene was changed to summer
And the face was hard and lean
And the tired eyes were fired
With the light that says "Marine".
"At Khe Sahn when they shelled us
We were wrapped in rolling smoke
And the thought of our survival
Was a grim and ghastly joke.
But when the waves came swarming in
To finish the assault
It was Rifles, always Rifles
That called the final halt."

There next appeared a General
As solid as a tank
With three stars on his collar
to signify his rank.
His stature and demeanor
Were the military type
And in his hand he carried
A stubby little pipe.
His jaw was squarely chisled,
His eyes were clear and keen
And his bearing left no question.
He was all Marine's Marine.

"The message they're conveying"
The burly General said
"Is that through our troubled history
The rifles always led.
We've had cannons, tank and mortars.
We've had weapons by the score,
We've had Battleships and fighter planes
To complement The Corps.
We've a most impressive arsenal.
That's obviously true,
But the final thrust for victory
Has always been with you.
It was Rifles, always Rifles
When The Corps was sorely pressed
And the rifle that you carry
Must meet the final test.
So sling that rifle proudly,
For everything we do
With mortars, tanks and cannons
Is just an aid to you."

The young Marine awakened
And put the dream aside,
Though now he clutched his rifle
With a certain touch of pride.
And then he chanced to notice
That lying near his hand
Was a stubby little pipe
And a heavy leather band.

Fightin, freezin walk......
sourmash JAN 22, 02:02 PM

quote
Originally posted by 82-T/A [At Work]:But I'm also a fan of holding our adversaries accountable... which includes not allowing our enemies to "grow their power."



Aren't you just whacking it and doing nothing of importance? Because our enemies occupy our government just as.they do.the Ukrainian govt and you're talking about a war in Afghanistan as though it was a relevant action.

No, what the normie believes is what his govt tells him to think.
blackrams JAN 22, 02:08 PM

quote
Originally posted by maryjane:

Some of us know and never forget what wins wars.
...



As certain as I am that you are fully in tune with that posting,
I'm just as sure that some here don't have a clue of what it means.

Rams