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82-T/A [At Work]
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MAY 28, 02:01 PM
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| quote | Originally posted by Patrick:
So, American values have been carved in stone (so to speak) since 1776? Okay, fine.
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Yes, that's correct. They are written on paper and stored in the National Archives building at the Smithsonian on the National Mall.
| quote | Originally posted by Patrick:
I still can't help think then that American values may differ from Americans' values.
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You can think all you want. But if the country truly felt the way YOU think they felt, then that amendment would have been overturned. The Constitution is a living document, meaning that it can be amended. To pass an amendment to the U.S. Constitution (including one that overrules a prior amendment), would require ratification by 3/4ths of the states. We are a Republic, not a Democracy, which means that 10 billion people living in California's slums cannot institute laws that affect the other 49 states. It would literally require ratification from the individual senates from at least 3/4ths of the states in the union. That is unlikely to ever happen unless there is a colossal sea-change of opinion in the United States. Our culture is one that was born out of rebellion... that is our national identity. Canada, for example... (correct me if I'm wrong), was still a territory of England until like the mid 1990s. Matter of fact, you still have to swear an oath to Queen Elizabeth 2nd if you file for Canadian citizenship.
The United States is totally different. We swear an oath to uphold the constitution ... e.g. those "VALUES" that I speak of. We are effectively pledging an oath to ourselves, and the construct that guarantees that our rights are inalienable.
The oath I took:
"I 82-T/A [At Work], do solemnly swear that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I take this obligation freely, without any mental reservation or purpose of evasion; and that I will well; and faithfully discharge the duties of the office on which I am about to enter. So help me God."
The pledge my daughter takes every morning in school:
"I pledge allegiance to the Flag of the United States of America, and to the Republic for which it stands, one Nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all."
Pledging allegiance to the flag, is pledging allegiance to uphold the values of the United States that are defined in our Constitution.
The additional pledge my daughter took every morning when she lived in Texas:
"Honor the Texas flag; I pledge allegiance to thee, Texas, one state under God, one and indivisible."[This message has been edited by 82-T/A [At Work] (edited 05-28-2022).]
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Jake_Dragon
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MAY 28, 02:03 PM
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Mag locks would be even better and can be activated from a button. (they will not do anything if some ass hat props open a door)
Why was the school not in lock down? There was the 911 call from the grandmothers shooting and the 911 call from where he wrecked his truck.
I want to know why the doors were not locked, how sad would it be if this could have all been avoided by a door bolt.
I hope the right people are paying attention to this incident. I hope those that were charged with the care of this community are held accountable to the oath or at the very least the job description.
I'm out, going to go spend some time out in the world. Wish me luck.
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williegoat
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MAY 28, 02:06 PM
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The killer in Buffalo was a racist. Why did he choose a grocery store in New York, instead of a Black Panther clubhouse?
For those who are a bit slow on the uptake or simply uninformed, the killer said that he chose his target because "NY has heavy gun laws".
rinselberg asked: "If that is the cost of freedom — if our liberty demands the occasional massacre — then conservatives ought to make that case."
I will ask, If the lives of those in Buffalo are the cost of disarmament, if safety demands an occasional massacre, then the left should make that case.
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williegoat
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MAY 28, 03:16 PM
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Oh, and the answer to rinselberg's question is that "the occasional massacre" is not the cost of freedom. It is the direct result of evading the issue, obfuscating the solution in the interest of promoting a political agenda.
As I have said, face the problem instead of taking the easy way out.
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RWDPLZ
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MAY 28, 04:14 PM
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The truth about what REALLY happened is starting to come out. If it's true they waited over an hour to respond (and especially if they really did only save their own kids), that entire police force should be executed, by firing squad. Cowardice on this scale hasn't been seen since the French surrendered in World War II. We've known since Columbine almost 25 years ago that every second counts, and you don't stand around outside waiting for someone to come do your job for you.
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blackrams
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MAY 28, 05:01 PM
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| quote | Originally posted by rinselberg:
The most recent high-profile murder spree where the perp(s) used bombs (or a bomb) as their murder weapon was the Boston Marathon bombing in 2013.
Then there was the Nashville bombing in 2020, although I had to think a bit longer to remember that one. (That perp only murdered or suicided himself, although he injured people and destroyed significant property.)
Bombs vs. Guns as the murder weapons of choice for America's menagerie of miscellaneously-motivated murderers is a sharply dissimilar comparison. It's like Kumquats vs. Oranges, in terms of commonality. (When's the last time you had a Kumquat? An Orange, or Orange Juice? Include slices used as garnishes, or twists, or zest. Flavors, glazes and sauces.) And that's why the preceding remark from "Rams" is not all that overwhelming or forceful in its logic.
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So, logic is your strong suit? If there's ever a situation where someone you care about had/has to depend on your logic to save them. Good luck with that. 
Let us know how that works out for you and them.
| quote | Originally posted by williegoat:
Jake is absolutely right.
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Absolutely!
Rams[This message has been edited by blackrams (edited 05-28-2022).]
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rinselberg
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MAY 28, 05:14 PM
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I don't think it's the people who go online on message boards like this, to express their support for "gun rights", that ever (hardly ever) turn their guns into criminal weapons.
Was this Uvalde perp an NRA member? Did he ever do anything personally to support "gun rights"? I think they're mostly like that. The school campus murderers and their ilk.
Which has given me an idea.
How about creating a special class of firearms for "2A buffs"..?
So you want to have what the progressive and liberal media have been calling "weapons of war"..? Semiautomatic rifles with detachable magazines and the other features that are popular with America's Mass Murder Shooters?
Here's the requirements for a legal purchase from a federally licensed firearms dealer:
- The applicant must be age 35 or older, and submit proof that they are have been living on their own for at least a full year prior, and are not financially dependent on their parents or anyone else for their housing and other living requirements.
- The applicant must submit proof of online activity (online forums, Facebook, Twitter, Instagram; etc.) and have a solid track record of pro "2A" and "gun rights" commentaries.
Otherwise, for those who do not qualify on these criteria for this special class of firearms... only more basic or "Plain Jane" kinds of firearms. A "Biden model" shotgun. A semiautomatic rifle without a detachable magazine, or detachable but no more than 10-rounds per magazine, round size and velocity limitations... whatever kinds of firearms that are not "weapons of war."
Problem solved.
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Hudini
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MAY 28, 05:20 PM
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| quote | Originally posted by Patrick:
A man in China killed eight children with a meat clever, on September 3rd 2019.
China, with a population of 1.5 billion... and you had to go back almost three years to find an incident of children being killed in a school there?
Okay.
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Do you have a point about the tightly controlled media in China?
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williegoat
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MAY 28, 05:22 PM
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Just as everyone is talking about two mass murders, here is what is being swept under the rug from last week: Testimony by Robert Mook during the Sussman trial has been very revealing. I will let you look it up for yourself.
Now, flash back to another three day weekend in the summer of another election year. James Comey made a statement regarding Hillary Clinton and by the next day, the whole country was talking about two high profile police shootings.
Now, go back to my original post on the first page of this thread.
Funny how things go, sometimes.
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blackrams
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MAY 28, 05:33 PM
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| quote | Originally posted by rinselberg:
So you want to have what the progressive and liberal media have been calling "weapons of war"..? Semiautomatic rifles with detachable magazines and the other features that are popular with America's Mass Murder Shooters?
Here's the requirements for a legal purchase from a federally licensed firearms dealer:
- The applicant must be age 35 or older, and submit proof that they are have been living on their own for at least a full year prior, and are not financially dependent on their parents or anyone else for their housing and other living requirements.
- The applicant must submit proof of online activity (online forums, Facebook, Twitter, Instagram; etc.) and have a solid track record of pro "2A" and "gun rights" commentaries.
Otherwise, for those who do not qualify on these criteria for this special class of firearms... only more basic or "Plain Jane" kinds of firearms. A "Biden model" shotgun. A semiautomatic rifle without a detachable magazine, or detachable but no more than 10-rounds per magazine, round size and velocity limitations... whatever kinds of firearms that are not "weapons of war."
Problem solved.
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So, no support for the Constitution and apparently one that asks "Not what you can do for your country but, what your country can do for you?
You want to take away other's Constitutional Rights and hope the police will respond in time to defend you?
You didn't or haven't done much (if anything) to serve or preserve the US as a freedom light of the world?
There are times when one has to take a stand ya know. It would appear you've led a blessed and protected life that someone provided.
Those 19 kids and 2 teachers might have still been breathing had someone been prepared to defend them. Apparently, that person would not be you.
So, IMHO there's still a big problem.
It appears that you believe that replacing the current laws with your proposal will keep "Bad Guys" from committing such crimes. Just curious but how many gang members or "Bad Guys" do you think got their weapons legally or have a permit to carry?
Maybe not in your neighborhood but, most folks can go buy or steal a gun from a relative or neighbor when they go nuts. Your proposal is pure 
Rams[This message has been edited by blackrams (edited 05-28-2022).]
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