Abortion thread (Page 20/43)
Fats APR 27, 08:04 PM

quote
Originally posted by theBDub:
Parasite



Here's why I think you are wrong about a fetus being a parasite.

In my head, for it to be a parasite, it would always need to be a parasite.

Dogs are conceived as dogs and are dogs until they die.
Humans are conceived as humans and remain human until they die.
Both are animals from conception to death.

Parasites are born parasites, and remain parasites until they die.
Nobody has conceived a dog that later grows into a human.

A fetus is a human from conception until death. It doesn't change from one type of animal to another.

Let's take your "It relies on others for life, so we can take that life away." to its logical end.

Someone on life support. Are they parasites?
What if someone is in a coma?
What about people that rely on a medical device to stay alive. I'll go with Type 1 diabetes. Would that person just be a parasite to you? They clearly cannot live without outside assistance. What about someone that needs a feeding tube?
If a baby is born and has weak lungs etc and needs put into a device for a month to survive, could we kill it then? It's clearly not able to survive on its own.

Could we end someone's life if they have never worked or supported themselves and couldn't survive if we took public assistance away? These people by your definition would be parasites.

In the end, humans are humans from conception to birth. Nothing that I'm aware of changes from one type of creature to another during their lifespan. Some people need help to survive. We aren't living in the dark ages. Just because someone needs help at one point in their life doesn't make them useless forever (or even at that point.)

Fats APR 27, 08:13 PM

quote
Originally posted by 82-T/A [At Work]:
Don't forget this list...



Am I alone in thinking that prostitution shouldn't be a crime? I get that it is, and therefore fair game. But something that can be given away for free shouldn't be illegal if you sell it freely IMO.

I don't think I would hold prostitution against anyone. As long as both parties are consenting adults, hey, more power to ya.
randye APR 27, 09:09 PM

quote
Originally posted by theBDub:

First, you need to prove that Democrats are "currently supporting sexual grooming of children in schools."





No I don't.

I very clearly and specifically said LEFTIST / DemoRATS

WOW, you sure are defensive about Democrats....

In the same way that you use "libertarian" as your ineffective camouflage trying to hide your Leftist ideology, you Leftists also use "Democrat" to try to hide behind.

The Democrat party of classic liberalism would have NEVER supported and pushed the kind of insane and immoral crap that you Leftists do today, but the Democrat party DIED years ago. It was killed off by Marxist / Leftists that absolutely hate being called and exposed for what you objectively are so you use "Democrat" and "Libertarian" and euphemisms like "progressive" trying to hide, like rats and cockroaches hide from the light.

It's an established, evidentiary, fact that inappropriate sexual discussion with small children IS going on in public schools and what you DIDN'T see in that video was the White House spokesmouth specifically saying that they don't support the type of sexual grooming of small children that actually is going on in public schools.

Instead she lied about the actual content of the new Florida law and then gaslit you that "it isn't happening and isn't a problem", then she explicitly supported the idea of a teacher engaging in inappropriate sexually sensitive discussions with small children instead of simply directing them back to their parents and like an obedient Leftist you sucked those lies and propaganda right up and puked it back here without question.....hook, line and sinker

The fact that you keep arguing your favor for infanticide and your support of adult strangers having intimate, sexually charged, discussions with other people's small children says everything about who and what you really are.

What's next? Incest, bestiality, necrophilia? Is there anything that you won't promote?



quote
Originally posted by theBDub:


Can you point out anything of what I said that’s against the Libertarian platform or ideology?

I’ll wait.




I don't have to.

I'm not going to chase you down your bottomless rabbit hole of deflection and distraction with your whack-job interpretations of "libertarianism" especially when everyone here sees straight through your use of that as a subterfuge.

Engaging in an endless and pointless roundabout of your contorted ideological weirdness has NOTHING to do with the point I made.

So keep waiting....


Leftists gotta Leftist

[This message has been edited by randye (edited 04-28-2022).]

olejoedad APR 27, 09:10 PM
A parasite is a foreign body that is introduced to it's host, not created by the host.
olejoedad APR 27, 09:14 PM

quote
Originally posted by rinselberg:

Monocular vision from olejoedad. Roger Stone. Lee Atwater. The George W. Bush campaign in South Carolina Republican primary that tried to tar one of the other Republican candidates with fictitious personal scandal accusations, if memory serves me.



No, binocular vision.

I had lens replacement surgery two years ago, and my vision is very good.

Politics has been full of dirty players since the beginning.

I'll call out either side, but in my long life, I've noticed one side is much more underhanded that the other, especially in current times.

And decidedly un-American and anti-Constitution.

Edited for spelling and additional content.

[This message has been edited by olejoedad (edited 04-27-2022).]

randye APR 27, 09:14 PM

quote
Originally posted by Fats:


Dogs are conceived as dogs and are dogs until they die.
Humans are conceived as humans and remain human until they die.
Both are animals from conception to death.

Parasites are born parasites, and remain parasites until they die.
Nobody has conceived a dog that later grows into a human.

A fetus is a human from conception until death. It doesn't change from one type of animal to another.




It actually IS possible for a parasite to eventually grown into not being a parasite.

All a Leftist has to do is grow up and stop being a Leftist.

[This message has been edited by randye (edited 04-27-2022).]

randye APR 27, 09:44 PM

quote
Originally posted by 82-T/A [At Work]:

Don't forget this list...




Todd, I'm not at all concerned with that stupid list.

It was juvenile deflection from the actual issue at hand and the only thing it really shows is that our criminal laws are working substantially as intended.

The Leftist that tried to use that massive list as a distraction is the same Leftist that hypocritically whined and cried in another one of his posts about someone else using a "gish gallop" in their post.

Leftists gotta Leftist
theBDub APR 28, 09:01 AM

quote
Originally posted by 82-T/A [At Work]:
Don't forget this list...




Many of these were in the links I provided, too.

Like I said, I don't think there is any lean one way or another. I think the entire topic is bullshit.


quote
Originally posted by Fats:


Am I alone in thinking that prostitution shouldn't be a crime? I get that it is, and therefore fair game. But something that can be given away for free shouldn't be illegal if you sell it freely IMO.

I don't think I would hold prostitution against anyone. As long as both parties are consenting adults, hey, more power to ya.



100% agree.

[This message has been edited by theBDub (edited 04-28-2022).]

2.5 APR 28, 09:18 AM

quote
Originally posted by Fats:


Here's why I think you are wrong about a fetus being a parasite.

In my head, for it to be a parasite, it would always need to be a parasite.

Dogs are conceived as dogs and are dogs until they die.
Humans are conceived as humans and remain human until they die.
Both are animals from conception to death.

Parasites are born parasites, and remain parasites until they die.
Nobody has conceived a dog that later grows into a human.

A fetus is a human from conception until death. It doesn't change from one type of animal to another.

Let's take your "It relies on others for life, so we can take that life away." to its logical end.

Someone on life support. Are they parasites?
What if someone is in a coma?
What about people that rely on a medical device to stay alive. I'll go with Type 1 diabetes. Would that person just be a parasite to you? They clearly cannot live without outside assistance. What about someone that needs a feeding tube?
If a baby is born and has weak lungs etc and needs put into a device for a month to survive, could we kill it then? It's clearly not able to survive on its own.

Could we end someone's life if they have never worked or supported themselves and couldn't survive if we took public assistance away? These people by your definition would be parasites.

In the end, humans are humans from conception to birth. Nothing that I'm aware of changes from one type of creature to another during their lifespan. Some people need help to survive. We aren't living in the dark ages. Just because someone needs help at one point in their life doesn't make them useless forever (or even at that point.)




quote
Originally posted by olejoedad:

A parasite is a foreign body that is introduced to it's host, not created by the host.




Agreed
theBDub APR 28, 09:21 AM

quote
Originally posted by Fats:


Here's why I think you are wrong about a fetus being a parasite.

In my head, for it to be a parasite, it would always need to be a parasite.

Dogs are conceived as dogs and are dogs until they die.
Humans are conceived as humans and remain human until they die.
Both are animals from conception to death.

Parasites are born parasites, and remain parasites until they die.
Nobody has conceived a dog that later grows into a human.

A fetus is a human from conception until death. It doesn't change from one type of animal to another.

Let's take your "It relies on others for life, so we can take that life away." to its logical end.

Someone on life support. Are they parasites?
What if someone is in a coma?
What about people that rely on a medical device to stay alive. I'll go with Type 1 diabetes. Would that person just be a parasite to you? They clearly cannot live without outside assistance. What about someone that needs a feeding tube?
If a baby is born and has weak lungs etc and needs put into a device for a month to survive, could we kill it then? It's clearly not able to survive on its own.

Could we end someone's life if they have never worked or supported themselves and couldn't survive if we took public assistance away? These people by your definition would be parasites.

In the end, humans are humans from conception to birth. Nothing that I'm aware of changes from one type of creature to another during their lifespan. Some people need help to survive. We aren't living in the dark ages. Just because someone needs help at one point in their life doesn't make them useless forever (or even at that point.)



Thank you for actually engaging in debate on the topic.

Re: Parasite definition

I think this is a good argument, but this is just your interpretation of the word and how it's used. To provide an example you gave based on the dog. A dog is always a dog until death, but a puppy isn't always a puppy. A fetus doesn't remain a fetus. A baby doesn't remain a baby. A parasite doesn't have to remain a parasite to be appropriately called a parasite.

At the end of the day though, this comes down to interpretation. It's a good argument.

Re: Other things as parasites

  • Life support: Because this isn't attached to another organism, probably not. But I think the more interesting question would be: Does pulling the plug on someone on life support, parasite or not, constitute as murder?
  • Coma: Same as life support. If you're thinking they take from other organisms because nurses, etc., I'd say the difference is in who can support these people. Comatose people can be supported by any number of people volunteering their time/energy/resources to help them. A fetus requires a single human and cannot deviate from that.
  • Diabetes: No... I don't think this argument is even in the same category. They aren't taking from a host, they aren't benefiting at anyone's expense, there is no reason why this would be classified as a parasite.
  • Weak baby: No, because at this point it doesn't need that single human to survive. Someone is willing and able to keep that baby alive. That's the distinction, and it's very important.


A fetus requires that specific prospective mother in order to survive. It feeds from that specific human's organs. That host has the right to terminate that relationship, as they have autonomy over their organs. That same relationship does not carry once the baby is born. Once the baby is born, it doesn't require that mother. It may require other humans, but we have a health system of other humans that have dedicated themselves to that care. Any one of those people would also be able to walk away, but inevitably someone is available to keep the baby alive.

Someone never supporting themselves: Nobody has the right to social programs. No, we cannot actively kill someone for being on social programs. However, we can end any or all of those social programs and are not responsible for that person if they can no longer survive.