Left-wing Communism (Page 2/4)
williegoat APR 10, 11:06 AM

quote
Originally posted by rinselberg:

That's a relief. I was worried that they might be Anti-Science, Clown Pedophile Groomers, which are words that almost always appear in connection with "Leftist" in the messages of one forum member in particular.


OK, now that we have a definition, here is a question: Do you like the U.S. Constitution the way it is?
rinselberg APR 10, 11:52 AM
I think the Electoral College system of electing the President and Vice-President is a useless and harmful anachronism that would best be abolished and replaced by Popular Vote. The best way to achieve that would be through a Constitutional Amendment.

I think the U.S. Senate, which has two Senators from each of the 50 states, cries out for Constitutional Amendment. There were already some disparities in population among the original 13 states of the Union, but could the framers of the Constitution have foreseen the even larger disparities of our time between the most populous states and the least populous states? It seems more feasible to introduce some system of proportional representation in the Senate than it would be to redraw the various state boundaries.

Maybe.

Amending the Constitution is preferable to upending the Constitution.
ray b APR 10, 01:12 PM

quote
Originally posted by 82-T/A [At Work]:
AOC, Talib, Biden, Obama, etc...



AOC is a clown

talib who ?

the current CiC and the former one also are center right mostly center but still not a bit liberal

unlike you and far too many here are extreme off the charts on the right [wrong side]

why the extreme right sees the center right as extreme left is a HUGE PROBLEM
any one saying old joe is a commie is nuts and a big part of the problem
tax dodgers are not a virtue greed is not good
EPA is not evil but your nasty rightwingers try to run it that way

nixon is the root of evil and so was raygun the election thief
the rump is just yet another scammer who fools the rightwing sheep

god guns and fear is a very poor way to run this country
the dark side loves the rump and the whole Gop program
of racist sexist gay fear and hate throw in the trans too
our fla govinator is trying to out rump the rump
it will not end well
but why do you support the same goals as the dark side ?
ray b APR 10, 01:22 PM

quote
Originally posted by williegoat:

OK, now that we have a definition, here is a question: Do you like the U.S. Constitution the way it is?



no the 26 smallest states should not control our nation with which together elect a majority of Senate seats (52),
make up only 18 percent of the population. 18% rules 82% is unfair
the people should rule not real estate divisions
and elections need run offs and the most TOTAL VOTES WINS not gimmicks
not the 1770's methods used by the rump to steal in 2016 an election he LOST by 3 million votes
bonaduce APR 10, 01:49 PM

quote
Originally posted by ray b:


no the 26 smallest states should not control our nation with which together elect a majority of Senate seats (52),
make up only 18 percent of the population. 18% rules 82% is unfair
the people should rule not real estate divisions
and elections need run offs and the most TOTAL VOTES WINS not gimmicks
not the 1770's methods used by the rump to steal in 2016 an election he LOST by 3 million votes



So you are basically saying "the needs of the many (coastal states), outweigh the needs of the few (the flyovers)."
williegoat APR 10, 02:22 PM

quote
Originally posted by rinselberg:

I think the Electoral College system of electing the President and Vice-President is a useless and harmful anachronism that would best be abolished and replaced by Popular Vote. The best way to achieve that would be through a Constitutional Amendment.

I think the U.S. Senate, which has two Senators from each of the 50 states, cries out for Constitutional Amendment. There were already some disparities in population among the original 13 states of the Union, but could the framers of the Constitution have foreseen the even larger disparities of our time between the most populous states and the least populous states? It seems more feasible to introduce some system of proportional representation in the Senate than it would be to redraw the various state boundaries.

Maybe.

Amending the Constitution is preferable to upending the Constitution.


And that is why you are Leftist, and a Progressive, at that.

As a Right Wing Conservative, I understand the wisdom in the Constitution.

The problem that I see with the electoral college and the House of Representatives is that they are based on the number of residents rather that the number of citizens. I believe that only citizens deserve representation.

I believe that the bicameral legislature as defined in the constitution is a reasonable compromise which distributes power among the people without giving one group, be it State or special interest, too much power over other citizens.

I understand why you want to change the Constitution, your suggestions would give California even greater power over the rest of the country. I would rather see more equal representation.

I believe in the rights and responsibilities of the individual. I trust people more than I do mobs.
olejoedad APR 10, 02:23 PM

quote
Originally posted by rinselberg:

I think the Electoral College system of electing the President and Vice-President is a useless and harmful anachronism that would best be abolished and replaced by Popular Vote. The best way to achieve that would be through a Constitutional Amendment.

I think the U.S. Senate, which has two Senators from each of the 50 states, cries out for Constitutional Amendment. There were already some disparities in population among the original 13 states of the Union, but could the framers of the Constitution have foreseen the even larger disparities of our time between the most populous states and the least populous states? It seems more feasible to introduce some system of proportional representation in the Senate than it would be to redraw the various state boundaries.

Maybe.

Amending the Constitution is preferable to upending the Constitution.



Referencing your second paragraph, do you understand that the House of Representatives is elected by districts based on population, and the Senate is elected by political boundary.
This gives the People a voice and the States also have a voice.

It's an elegant part of the Constitution, and was central to the States agreeing on the formation of a central government.

The States should go back to Legislature appointment of their respective Senators, but that would also raise the need for a Constitutional Convention.

The Electoral College should remain.

Our form of government is that of a Republic.

It is not a Democracy, nor is it a Democratic Republic.

No matter what the talking heads in your infoworld tell you.

You are being deceived, on many levels.

[This message has been edited by olejoedad (edited 04-10-2023).]

williegoat APR 10, 04:08 PM

quote
Originally posted by ray b:
no the 26 smallest states should not control our nation with which together elect a majority of Senate seats (52),
make up only 18 percent of the population. 18% rules 82% is unfair


Laws are the antithesis of freedom. I believe that no bill should be passed into law with less than a 2/3rd majority. We should never have a law that is opposed by half of the people.
rinselberg APR 10, 05:13 PM

quote
Originally posted by williegoat:

Laws are the antithesis of freedom. I believe that no bill should be passed into law with less than a 2/3rd majority. We should never have a law that is opposed by half of the people.


Couldn't agree less.

Abolishing the Electoral College system and replacing it with Popular vote—a sage idea—but putting aside my previous thoughts about changing the way that the Senate is set up, with two Senators from every state... instead of that... eliminate the supermajority bottleneck(s) in Congress, like the Senate filibuster or cloture rule, and go to resolving these legislative processes using a simple majority vote (of the Senate).

I believe I could find, witihin the ivy-covered exterior walls of academia, professors and the like who would say that making this change (to simple majority vote) would boost moderation on legislative issues, at the expense of extremism. Compromise, over conflict.

I think that would be a big improvement.

[This message has been edited by rinselberg (edited 04-10-2023).]

williegoat APR 10, 06:39 PM

quote
Originally posted by rinselberg:
Couldn't agree less.

Abolishing the Electoral College system and replacing it with Popular vote—a sage idea—but putting aside my previous thoughts about changing the way that the Senate is set up, with two Senators from every state... instead of that... eliminate the supermajority bottleneck(s) in Congress, like the Senate filibuster or cloture rule, and go to resolving these legislative processes using a simple majority vote (of the Senate).


This highlights a fundamental difference between Conservatives and Liberals. I am a “small government” conservative. I believe that laws are a necessary evil. There should be “bottlnecks” and roadblocks in the legislative process. Liberals believe that laws are the best solution. Conservatives believe that they are a “last resort”.

I will agree that the filibuster should be eliminated, but only if a supermajority were required for any and all legislative decisions, including confirmation of appointees. Yes, it would slow things down, but I see that as a good thing.


quote

I believe I could find, witihin the ivy-covered exterior walls of academia, professors and the like who would say that making this change (to simple majority vote) would boost moderation on legislative issues, at the expense of extremism. Compromise, over conflict.

I think that would be a big improvement.


Metaphorically speaking, people who spend their lives behind walls should not be making decisions which restrict the daily lives of those of us who participate in the real world.