Time for a semi-general pardon (unbanning banned members)? (Page 4/11)
jonrev MAY 22, 10:07 AM
O/T doesn't need to go away but a moratorium on the political bile that's infested it for years would be an improvement in the long run.
olejoedad MAY 22, 10:13 AM
There is nothing wrong with the way it is set up now.
Leave it alone.
If we want banned members back, we will drop our negs and Cliff can invite them back via an email.
Blacktree MAY 22, 11:59 AM
My answer to Cliff's question would depend on who is being unbanned, and why. There are certain people whom I think should never be allowed back here. There are others who were run off, simply because "the clique" didn't like them. Those are two very different things.

IMO, the elephant in the room is the ratings system itself. Long-term members (like myself) have amassed hundreds of ratings. The forum population nowadays is low enough that members like me cannot be banned via "brute force" ratings. It's mathematically impossible. The "speed-ban" mechanic seems to be a band-aid for that. But even the speed-ban can be problematic.

So what am I getting at? Perhaps a ratings system reset is in order. And maybe adjust the "trigger levels" of the algorithm to match the current forum population.
sourmash MAY 22, 12:32 PM
There hasn't been any moderation in the forum since I've been around. Allowing posters to have an active role in banning people is madness. People can create multiple usernames to neg others. Personality disorders can't be removed from the process of negging people.

I support the statements of others who cited those valuable contributors who left because there wasn't moderation.
jessesmith121 MAY 22, 12:44 PM
I would say... Let them back... Unless they stole from a member... But an argument... meh... people change
Cliff Pennock MAY 22, 01:23 PM
Let me start by saying two things:

  1. The rating system will not go away
  2. TO/T will not change


Rating system: It works. It actually works perfectly. I know that since its inception, people have been claiming members can be and have been banned by other members ganging up. And my response every single time has been: not only is it pretty much impossible, I have also never even seen it attempted. Mind you, every single ban is double checked by me. I can see exactly who and how people rate others. And never have I seen anything that even comes close to "ganging up". Also, the rating system is in no way protecting you from being banned. You can have 100% positive ratings and you can still be banned. There are tons of examples of that.

TO/T: I don't understand why anything that happens there, reflects in any way, good or bad, on the rest of the forum. As far as I can see, rivalries there don't bleed over to the other sections. It in fact it keeps the other sections clean. Which is exactly why TO/T exists in the first place.

Back on topic, I do think people can change over time. If there's one flaw in the rating system, is that ratings stick. Ratings do not in any way reflect what the current batch of active members feel about other members. You can have 100 negative ratings, and 100 positive ratings. If those 100 negative ratings are from members who haven't been active in years, while the 100 positive ratings are all from active members, than that person should have a 100% positive rating. So yes, maybe ratings should "fall off" after a certain amount of time, good or bad. Or maybe just the ratings from members who haven't been active in the past year should disappear.
olejoedad MAY 22, 02:39 PM
Cliff, your last couple of sentences in the above post have some good ideas.

[This message has been edited by olejoedad (edited 05-22-2020).]

jscott1 MAY 22, 04:22 PM

quote
Originally posted by Cliff Pennock:


TO/T: I don't understand why anything that happens there, reflects in any way, good or bad, on the rest of the forum. As far as I can see, rivalries there don't bleed over to the other sections. It in fact it keeps the other sections clean. Which is exactly why TO/T exists in the first place.




With all due respect, I believe the ad revenue in T/OT has blinded you to how vile it has become. It reflects badly on the entire forum. You can't build a mansion over pile of sewage and not expect it to devalue the property. It's your forum, do as you please, but also recognize many have left of their own accord, in part because of the bad behavior cultivated in T/OT.
css9450 MAY 22, 04:50 PM

quote
Originally posted by jscott1:

With all due respect, I believe the ad revenue in T/OT has blinded you to how vile it has become. It reflects badly on the entire forum.



It is probably worth mentioning that the other 99.99% of forums in the world don't have the "anything goes" kind of off-topic section like the one here. No politics allowed, no religion allowed. However, enforcing that rule is a ton or work. Like a 24/7 job.
Blacktree MAY 22, 05:28 PM

quote
Originally posted by jscott1: ...but also recognize many have left of their own accord, in part because of the bad behavior cultivated in T/OT.


IMO, that is the real tragedy. When I commented earlier about people being run off by "the clique", I was referring to that. The people being run off aren't (for the most part) being banned. They're leaving in disgust, because of the nasty treatment they receive from "the clique" in O/T.

If this phenomenon continues, the website will continue losing viewers until there's nobody left except "the clique" and some people who they tolerate. In a time when web forums are losing viewers to social media outlets, the last thing a forum needs is a hostile atmosphere.

[This message has been edited by Blacktree (edited 05-22-2020).]