The Getrag F23 Tutorial - By Emc209i (Page 27/28)
Will NOV 16, 12:00 PM

quote
Originally posted by pmbrunelle:

For information, Roger Thelin now sells a front transaxle bracket that is meant for the GM Metric transaxle.

https://thelinsells.limited...bracket-number-three

Here it is on my 2000 Sunfire 2.2 OHV transmission:


Some tweaking may be needed to fit it in place.



Did you help him design it?
Looks like it needs some work... unless you haven't snugged the far bolt.

[This message has been edited by Will (edited 11-16-2024).]

pmbrunelle NOV 17, 11:04 AM

quote
Originally posted by Will:
Did you help him design it?



No, Roger already had this bracket ready to ship on his shelf when I contacted him.


quote
Originally posted by Will:
Looks like it needs some work... unless you haven't snugged the far bolt.



Some tweaking (cutting/welding/bending) will be needed to get everything to line up I think.

Also, some welds (with poor penetration) should be cut and re-done.

That said, I think that the bracket is still a time-saving starting point.
Kameirocco NOV 26, 04:42 PM
Hi all - i'm trying to locate a copy of the PDF that was listed - does anyone have that handy? seems to have disappeared
was hoping to get 2 things answered.

1) does anyone have photos or a diagram of the shifter cable adapter? i've seen a few different variants
2) I had heard that some 75" push/pull cables would work just fine instead of the brackets. is this true?
pmbrunelle DEC 09, 08:34 PM
I installed a new Centric 13862019 HTOB in my F23 (bleeder assembly installed, and bleed screw cracked open), and I measured the following bellhousing-to-HTOB distances:
Retracted: 2.634"
Extended: 1.814"

Is this normal? With my pressure plate fingers at 2.548" from the bellhousing (Spec 3+ for the Muncie), I don't have much room for wear before the HTOB bottoms out and begins pressing on the clutch.

Are the aftermarket HTOBs all over the place in terms of measurements?

Should I try with another brand of HTOB? From Rockauto photos, it appears that a number of brands are repackaged "FTE" HTOBs, including Centric.
pmbrunelle DEC 22, 01:59 AM
For information, here are the distances for a Perfection Clutch 900067 HTOB, in my F23:
Retracted: 2.564"
Extended: 1.859"

It is of a slightly different construction; the aluminium is coloured black. The range is less on both ends, so I do not reccomend this HTOB.
pmbrunelle APR 07, 08:40 AM
I just ordered some F23 shifter centering springs from Century Spring.

I thought the stock F23 centering action (to bring the shifter into the 3-4 plane) was a bit too weak, especially with my non-ideal shifter linkage that I have planned for the F23 installation in my Fiero.

Stock 2.2 OHV Sunfire F23 shifter shaft axial force:
When pushing towards 1-2: 5 lb
When pushing towards 5-R: 8 lb

Here are some alternatives to the stock springs I suggest (these are Century Spring part numbers):
1-2: 11643CS 17.3 lb
5-R: 1867CS 19.3 lb
5-R (stiffer alternative): 10751CS 28.6 lb

On some cars with the same 5-speed pattern, I noticed that the centering spring force isn't symmetric; the spring force is higher on the 5-R side. I am not sure why this is the case; perhaps because 5 and R are less frequently used than 1 2 3 4, so this forces a more deliberate action to go to the more rarely used side of the shift pattern. Anyway, I included a stiffer alternative for 5-R to emulate that behaviour if desired.
pmbrunelle APR 09, 10:57 PM
***WARNING***

Century Spring recommends a "Suggested Max Deflection" for each spring they sell:


When used in an F23, two of the spring alternatives I suggested will be used beyond their rated deflection.
11643CS 113.9%
1867CS 94.6%
10751CS 106.7%

Of course, Century Spring likely adds some margin to the ratings, and these springs won't be cycling from zero to full deflection (which is less bad for fatigue)...

I am not experienced enough with springs to say exactly what could happen. Maybe the springs could lose force after some number of cycles, or possibly break. I think it's worth a try; I'm doing this on my Fiero.

The F23 was designed with soft centering springs, so when fitting stiffer springs in the same physical space, it is only natural that the springs will end up with high working stresses.

********************************************************************************

To install the springs, first remove the shifter assembly from the transmission.

Then, push out the roll pin and pull the shift lever.

Then, remove the cast aluminium piece.

From here, compress the spring cup in a vise to make the snap ring accessible:


Remove the snap ring from the shaft, and then the springs will come off.

Installation of new springs is the reverse of removal...

********************************************************************************

The 1-2 spring bears on a plastic seat. Initially, I was concerned that the plastic part might break from the increased load of the stiffer than stock spring. However, the plastic part was marked "PA66-GF30". By my evaluation, the plastic spring seat should be OK with a stiffer spring.

[This message has been edited by pmbrunelle (edited 04-09-2025).]

pmbrunelle MAY 05, 10:57 AM
What connector series do the VSS and back-up light switch connectors belong to?

I would prefer to buy separate housings, terminals, cable seals, etc, rather than automotive aftermarket ready-made pigtails.
Trinten MAY 06, 09:33 AM
That's a great question. Sometimes I get lucky with doing some Googling about a sensor connector type, but not always about pigtails. You may want to send Will or FieroGuru a PM. They are an amazing wealth of information, including with electrical connectors - probably because they put so much time and thought into their wiring setups. If they do know, please post the answer up here, it'd be good information to have!
Will MAY 07, 07:58 AM

quote
Originally posted by pmbrunelle:

What connector series do the VSS and back-up light switch connectors belong to?

I would prefer to buy separate housings, terminals, cable seals, etc, rather than automotive aftermarket ready-made pigtails.



Should be GM Metri-pack 150's... I can check on my F23's this weekend.

You can download the Delphi/Aptiv global catalog here: https://www.tti.com/content...systems-catalog.html
And then look up all the connectors and contacts you'll need.

[This message has been edited by Will (edited 05-07-2025).]