PFF - Pennock's Fiero Forum, PDA Edition

Preparing my Fiero for an engine swap (Page 12/23)

longjonsilver

DEC 21, 08:13 AM

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Originally posted by pmbrunelle:Be sure to disassemble and inspect the differential. Among the three Muncies I took apart, none of them had a differential in good health. Even the one that came from a low-mile Iron Duke car.

i've got a line on a V6 4 speed Muncie, the M17, i believe, along with a good drivers seat that also has the headrest speakers in it. Can't lose my speakers! From Bloozeberry on this forum. Good guy, seems to have his own Fiero junkyard, repair facility and storage unit. He came on our run last September. Gonna make the 75 min drive up to his place when we can arrange a time with him. Hopefully from the M19, the M17 and the MY8 trannies that i will have i can find a differential that is in good shape.

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Originally posted by pmbrunelle:For some cars equipped with automatic transmissions, GM has used a separate Engine Control Module (ECM) and Transmission Control Module (TCM).
GM has also had an architecture where the entire powertrain (engine + auto trans) was controlled by a single brain; the Powertrain Control Module (PCM).

Regardless of what it is called, the computer is usually under the air box on the Grand Prix, or so they say.... Does it look like the computer on the Fiero? i have also read that there are no wires leading thru the firewall on the GP that i will need, so they can be cut off. Does anyone know if this is so?

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Originally posted by pmbrunelle:

The pass-through is made of plastic, and it is filled with hot glue. To soften the hot glue enough to pull out or feed through a wire, I submerge the pass-through in a pot of boiling water.

i have both the C500 and C203 connections from a car in Mascouche - too bad i haven't found any junkyards with Fieroz around here. i imagine that the C203 will plug right into the ECM of the CP which will be located under the center console like in the Fiero. And i imagine that the only wires that will need to be pulled thru the firewall of Freya will be those headed to the C203. No?

(RANT: i have Charlie, a 92 S10, and Charlie has had all three (count em 1,2,3 door handles broke - i've replaced both handles and now the drivers one is broken. Freyaz passengers door handle is also broken - i notice that the handles are exactly the same between the Fiero and the S10. Why can't GM make a decent door handle? END RANT)

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Originally posted by pmbrunelle:
I don't think there exists a paint-by-numbers sort of guide to tell you how to merge the Fiero harness with a swap engine harness. This question is "complex".
To solve this puzzle, you must study one wire (or circuit) at a time. Complex puzzles are solved by breaking them down into bite-sized chunks.

So i guess i get to know my car better than i currently do. i get the opportunity to solve another puzzle. OR i get to pay the $700 big bucks for a harness. My wife only lets me play with my car if she (Freya) doesn't cost too much. $700 for something i theoretically can do myself is TOO much. Slow down, jon, prends ton temps, une circuit à la fois. i plan on pulling the engine with the harness intact, dropping it out the bottom of the car, with the cradle and leaving the harness attached as much as possible and pulling everything on the firewall that is attached to the harness. At this point, i really don't care what the engine bay looks like, because it can't possibly look worse than what i have now, altho the Duke still runs good, uses oil and bad mileage for a 4 banger, but runs good. One of the few esthetic things that i plan on doing (other than general cleaning) is to paint the valve covers and supercharger the original red of the V6 Fiero intake plenum. Somewhere on PFF i have read that there is a Chrysler paint that almost perfectly matches the Pontiac red. i'm gonna use it. Anyway, i really don't care if the wires are ugly or not, that stuff can be done later, after i experience the acceleration. heh heh

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Originally posted by pmbrunelle:
my 85 Fiero L'enfant de la bibite

So you name your cars too? Or just your Fiero? So, you are saying that you were bitten by the Fiero bug? i was bitten in the early 80's when i read a blurb in a hot rod mag, a spy reported that Pontiac was making a mid engine, 4 wheel independant suspension, 4 wheel disc brake, rack and pinion steering sports car. That was probably 1982. When i heard that they were already in town (arrived just days before) i went to the dealer and bot one. Still have her. Been quite a ride.

------------------
Astronomy says we will find a coded signal from outer space. Then we'll KNOW that life exists there, for coded signals aren't by chance.

Biology says there are coded genetic signals in every cell, but we KNOW that no intelligence created life.

I'm the original owner of a white ' 84 2M4 purchased Dec 10, 1983 from Pontiac. Always garaged, no rust, 4-wheel drifts are fun!

pmbrunelle

DEC 23, 01:10 AM

quote

Originally posted by longjonsilver:
i have both the C500 and C203 connections from a car in Mascouche - too bad i haven't found any junkyards with Fieroz around here. i imagine that the C203 will plug right into the ECM of the CP which will be located under the center console like in the Fiero.

I'm confused; your Fiero should already have C500 and C203 connections. The swap wiring would simply re-use the connectors that you already have in Freya. You shouldn't need other ones, unless your goal is to minimize downtime and build up an entire wiring harness while keeping Freya driveable.

C203 does not plug into the ECM; it is a connector linking the engine harness to the wiring of the chassis.

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Originally posted by longjonsilver:
And i imagine that the only wires that will need to be pulled thru the firewall of Freya will be those headed to the C203. No?

Yes, generally speaking.

If you choose to install your ECM in the stock location, then the wires linking the ECM to the engine will also go through the firewall.

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Originally posted by longjonsilver:
One of the few esthetic things that i plan on doing (other than general cleaning) is to paint the valve covers and supercharger the original red of the V6 Fiero intake plenum. Somewhere on PFF i have read that there is a Chrysler paint that almost perfectly matches the Pontiac red. i'm gonna use it.

I actually bought a can of single-stage urethane paint (better quality than rattle-can). I picked a colour that I liked from a book of paint swatches; I wasn't overly focused on getting the 100% stock match.
If you happen to swing by here, I could shoot your parts with the leftover paint.

Here you can see the colour:
https://www.fieromontreal.c...86.msg35920#msg35920
Colour rendering is not good, as that is with the garage's fluorescent lighting.

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Originally posted by longjonsilver:
So you name your cars too? Or just your Fiero? So, you are saying that you were bitten by the Fiero bug?

L'enfant de la bibite is the name of my current Fiero. He/she (sex undetermined) has parts originating from my first Fiero, La bibite jaune.

My daily is nameless... poor 2007 Ford Ranger.

longjonsilver

DEC 23, 05:41 AM

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Originally posted by pmbrunelle:
The swap wiring would simply re-use the connectors that you already have in Freya. You shouldn't need other ones, unless your goal is to minimize downtime and build up an entire wiring harness while keeping Freya driveable.

Exactly. And i don't wanna pull a good running Duke just to have a dead car forever. Not fun. Altho i mite have bibites in the system, at least i have a chance of driving quick. i also plan on welding up the exhaust (tacked only) so that it is (almost) ready to go in BEFORE i pull the Duke. Same for the motor mounts and the dog bone, and the alternator.....

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Originally posted by pmbrunelle:
C203 does not plug into the ECM; it is a connector linking the engine harness to the wiring of the chassis.

Its been so long since i pulled the parts that i forgot how they went in. i do remember that the first C203 connector that i pulled was a crispy critter and so i had to pull another from one of the three cars in the yard. i have fond memories of pulling parts in that yard. My door handle broke and i pulled one off of the purple Fiero there, and have yet to install it, as i drove all last year with a broken passenger door handle.

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Originally posted by pmbrunelle:
I actually bought a can of single-stage urethane paint (better quality than rattle-can). I picked a colour that I liked from a book of paint swatches; I wasn't overly focused on getting the 100% stock match.

Urethane paint? hmmm i bot the purple spray gun last time i was in the states at Harbor Freight, and i plan on running it off my little compressor. At some point i gotta do my front facia too, the job was never very well done as the white was so thin that it barely covered the grey primer, and now it has lost its shine. i found this link: http://www.fiero.nl/forum/A...090219-2-084913.html

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Originally posted by pmbrunelle:
If you happen to swing by here, I could shoot your parts with the leftover paint.

Thanks, but it might be years before i'm back in Montreal again. Talked to my younger son last nite, and he went back to Mascouche to eat dinner, but he didn't swing by the old house. i've heard occasionally from friends in the neighborhood but imho i would be fun to drive around and see, but its 12-15 hours away, so its down the list of 2dooz.

jon

edit: combien de cheveaux do you expect that you will get with that turbo? You're writing your own code for the megasquirt? Wow! thats way over my head.
------------------
Astronomy says we will find a coded signal from outer space. Then we'll KNOW that life exists there, for coded signals aren't by chance.

Biology says there are coded genetic signals in every cell, but we KNOW that no intelligence created life.

I'm the original owner of a white ' 84 2M4 purchased Dec 10, 1983 from Pontiac. Always garaged, no rust, 4-wheel drifts are fun!

[This message has been edited by longjonsilver (edited 12-23-2019).]

pmbrunelle

DEC 23, 01:27 PM

I choose not to set myself a fixed number for an hp target... that way I can't be disappointed if I don't meet the objective.

My engine should be competitive with a stock 3800SC, but not with a 3800SC that's been souped-up.

For me it's more about the building and head-scratching in the garage than it is about the end-product.

longjonsilver

DEC 23, 04:41 PM

quote

Originally posted by pmbrunelle:
My engine should be competitive with a stock 3800SC, but not with a 3800SC that's been souped-up.

For me it's more about the building and head-scratching in the garage than it is about the end-product.

i'm not gonna do a whole lot of power improvements. Just porting the exhaust, intake and supercharger. Thats enuf for me. No smaller pulley, cam or loud exhaust. No big injectors. i also enjoy the challenge of doing it myself, that was the deal with my wife, play with my car but do it cheap. Happy wife, happy life.

jon

longjonsilver

JAN 01, 08:36 AM

I picked this guy up on sale so that I could safely get my engine out of the car and into my truck to bring it home. This is a necessary first step of an engine swap.

------------------
Astronomy says we will find a coded signal from outer space. Then we'll KNOW that life exists there, for coded signals aren't by chance.

Biology says there are coded genetic signals in every cell, but we KNOW that no intelligence created life.

I'm the original owner of a white ' 84 2M4 purchased Dec 10, 1983 from Pontiac. Always garaged, no rust, 4-wheel drifts are fun!

[This message has been edited by longjonsilver (edited 01-04-2020).]

Hidalgo

JAN 02, 02:37 PM

The friend of pmbrunelle who is still waiting for his harness from Dan is me. I paid him on September 5th, 2019, and I'm still waiting for my harness. At the time, he told me it was ready to send, and that he would send it as soon as I paid him, so I did. When I still didn't have it several weeks later, he said he checked with Canada Post and they said they lost the package. However, he never sent me a tracking number, so I can't confirm the veracity of that claim. Nonetheless, he said it was his responsibility, and that he would make me another harness and send it to me, free of charge. On November 27th, 2019, he told me that second harness was ready and that it would be out in the mail the following day. More than one month later, I still haven't received that one, either. I am now starting to make alternate plans for a harness, since my 3500 LZ4 swap is nearing completion. This is very upsetting since I sent Dan 430$CAD, my two harness cores, and two heat shield sleeves from Rodney Dickman. And so, at the present time, I'm afraid I unfortunately can't recommend doing business with him. I will be glad to change this post or post an update on my situation if I either get my new swap harness or a full refund, along with my harness cores and heat shield sleeves.

[This message has been edited by Hidalgo (edited 01-02-2020).]

longjonsilver

JAN 02, 03:26 PM

i'm sorry to hear of your problems with your harness. For better or worse, i have decided to make my own, even if that means that the harness is ugly and poorly routed, just as long as it works.

jon

wftb

JAN 03, 02:18 PM

quote

Originally posted by Hidalgo:

The friend of pmbrunelle who is still waiting for his harness from Dan is me. I paid him on September 5th, 2019, and I'm still waiting for my harness. At the time, he told me it was ready to send, and that he would send it as soon as I paid him, so I did. When I still didn't have it several weeks later, he said he checked with Canada Post and they said they lost the package. However, he never sent me a tracking number, so I can't confirm the veracity of that claim. Nonetheless, he said it was his responsibility, and that he would make me another harness and send it to me, free of charge. On November 27th, 2019, he told me that second harness was ready and that it would be out in the mail the following day. More than one month later, I still haven't received that one, either. I am now starting to make alternate plans for a harness, since my 3500 LZ4 swap is nearing completion. This is very upsetting since I sent Dan 430$CAD, my two harness cores, and two heat shield sleeves from Rodney Dickman. And so, at the present time, I'm afraid I unfortunately can't recommend doing business with him. I will be glad to change this post or post an update on my situation if I either get my new swap harness or a full refund, along with my harness cores and heat shield sleeves.

Anytime I sell something to anyone over Kijijii or here in the mall I insure it for the full value and text a picture of the tracking code to the buyer. That way if the shipper loses it neither me or the buyer are out of pocket. I do not know what is up with Dan but he needs to stop pulling scams like this. None of my shipments have ever been lost.

But somewhere on this forum there is a step by step guide to build a wiring harness for a 3800 swap. Sorry I do not remember the title or who posted it.

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86 GT built 2.2 ecotec turbo
rear SLA suspension
QA1 coilovers on tube arms

longjonsilver

MAR 02, 05:35 PM

i've got my outer and inner door skins off to replace the door handle, and i am wondering what it is that rattles when i close the door. It seems to me that the only things that could rattle are the rods linking the outer lock, the handle and the inner door lock with the latch. i am planning on using foam, like wetsuit material from a mouse pad or something to cushion the rattle. Whatcha think?

jon