Click here to visit the donation page | View all sponsors
  Pennock's Fiero Forum
  FAQs & HowTos
  88 Steering Rack repair

Post New Topic  Post A Reply
Email This Page to Someone! | Printable Version


next newest topic | next oldest topic
88 Steering Rack repair by fierosound
Started on: 06-02-2015 08:12 PM
Replies: 26 (1887 views)
Last post by: SeizureNoodles on 01-13-2017 07:32 PM
fierosound
Member

Posts: 13596
From: Calgary, Canada
Registered: Nov 1999


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 274
Rate this member

Report this Post06-02-2015 08:12 PM Click Here to See the Profile for fierosoundClick Here to visit fierosound's HomePageClick Here to Email fierosoundSend a Private Message to fierosoundEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

NOTE: The 88 steering rack is unique to that year.
84-87 are different and can't have this particular problem described.

One of our members had been complaining about hard steering on his 88 - including binding and clunking.
A "professional mechanic" told him there was something wrong with the steering column internally.
He brought it over so I could have a closer look at what was going on. The car was barely steerable.
By the time we got it in the garage the steering wheel was upside down with the front wheels facing forward!

Mechanic misdiagnosis - there is nothing wrong with the steering column. It was the rack itself.

The pinion in the 88 rack has a ball bearing on the bottom end and a lock nut securing the shaft.
A snap ring locks the bearing in the housing and a dust cap is pressed into the opening.
This lower ball bearing has come apart and has literally "lost all its marbles".

The binding and clunking were the pinion teeth jamming on the rack teeth, then jumping over by a tooth in the rack.



This is the end of the pinion with dust cap removed.
The ball bearing has literally "lost all its marbles".
LOL
It did not fail because dirt got in the bearing.
This end IS NOT open and exposed to water, road debris etc.
It just looks like that because the old grease has dried out.

That ring you see on the pinion shaft is the bearing's inner race.
The outer race and snap ring are still in the housing.
It's obvious this has been broken for some time to grind up the nut on the end of the shaft.




EDIT:

I removed the snap ring and cleaned up the face of the outer ring.
All I can read is FRANCE and the number 630499
I haven't managed to find it or a cross reference to anything yet.

The bearing is 10mm ID x 30mm OD x 8mm wide
See below - DON'T WANT factory part anyway.


------------------
Calgary time/temp

3.4L Supercharged 87 GT Click me
Super Duty 4 Indy #163 Click me

[This message has been edited by fierosound (edited 07-18-2018).]

IP: Logged

fierosound
Member

Posts: 13596
From: Calgary, Canada
Registered: Nov 1999


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 274
Rate this member

Report this Post06-02-2015 11:34 PM Click Here to See the Profile for fierosoundClick Here to visit fierosound's HomePageClick Here to Email fierosoundSend a Private Message to fierosoundEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

GM had similar problems with lower rack and pinion bearings on their other cars.
http://www.ebearing.com/news2002/112101.htm

"A lower pinion bearing in the rack & pinion may separate, causing the driver to experience
either an intermittent loss of power steering assist or unintended power assist." (Source: GM)

SnapOn made a special tool to remove the bearing without having to remove and disassemble the rack.
http://public.snapon.com/a_...ments_us/ukcj147.pdf

The Rack and Pinion lower pinion bearing can fail due to faulty original bearing.
http://my.cardone.com/techdocs/pt%2022-0008.pdf

[This message has been edited by fierosound (edited 06-02-2015).]

IP: Logged

MRBLUE87
Member

Posts: 250
From: Winnebago Illinois USA
Registered: Jan 2003


Feedback score: (4)
Leave feedback

Rate this member

Report this Post06-03-2015 02:03 PM Click Here to See the Profile for MRBLUE87Click Here to Email MRBLUE87Send a Private Message to MRBLUE87Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

GM # 7828012 interchanges to Timken DB53313. This might be what you need?

IP: Logged

lateFormula
Member

Posts: 992
From: Detroit Rock City
Registered: Jul 2002


Feedback score: (2)
Leave feedback

Rate this member

Report this Post06-03-2015 02:59 PM Click Here to See the Profile for lateFormulaSend a Private Message to lateFormulaEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

That manual diagram is curious because it is titled 7. Remove and install roller bearing assembly. But in the image the bearing is noted as a ball bearing assembly.

The part number MrBlue87 provided is a roller bearing assembly that does not have an inner race.

The dimensions you provided for the destroyed bearing don't match any common ball bearing. The closest I could find is a 6200 series ball bearing (the bearing part number will include 6200) which measures 10mm ID × 30mm OD × 9mm thick. I do not find a bearing with a 10mm ID and 30mm OD that is 8mm thick. Have you pulled the bearing remains out of the rack yet? Once you do remeasure the ID, OD and thickness. It is probably a common bearing size that could be replaced with any number of bearings from different manufacturers.

IP: Logged

fierosound
Member

Posts: 13596
From: Calgary, Canada
Registered: Nov 1999


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 274
Rate this member

Report this Post06-04-2015 12:30 AM Click Here to See the Profile for fierosoundClick Here to visit fierosound's HomePageClick Here to Email fierosoundSend a Private Message to fierosoundEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by lateFormula:

That manual diagram is curious because it is titled 7. Remove and install roller bearing assembly. But in the image the bearing is noted as a ball bearing assembly.

The part number MrBlue87 provided is a roller bearing assembly that does not have an inner race.

The dimensions you provided for the destroyed bearing don't match any common ball bearing. The closest I could find is a 6200 series ball bearing (the bearing part number will include 6200) which measures 10mm ID × 30mm OD × 9mm thick. I do not find a bearing with a 10mm ID and 30mm OD that is 8mm thick. Have you pulled the bearing remains out of the rack yet? Once you do remeasure the ID, OD and thickness. It is probably a common bearing size that could be replaced with any number of bearings from different manufacturers.


Right on everything. Who the hell proofreads these things at GM - someone with no mechanical experience??

I've taken this apart now. There are TWO bearings for the pinion shaft.

There IS a roller bearing and seal in the upper portion of the housing to center the pinion.
They don't show the parts in the diagram, but they list the roller bearing and seal part number on Page 6.508-Group.

Then in the diagram, they only show the 10mm x 30mm x 8mm BALL bearing at the lower end of the pinion shaft.
They don't list a part number for that and again - GM uses a non-standard size (we all know about finding fuel line o-rings).

After seeing how this one fell apart and the recall information on other cars with same problem, you would NOT WANT a "factory" part anyway.

I used a 6200 series ball bearing - steering rack is fixed, probably permanently - owner is ecstatic!

[This message has been edited by fierosound (edited 06-05-2015).]

IP: Logged

fierosound
Member

Posts: 13596
From: Calgary, Canada
Registered: Nov 1999


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 274
Rate this member

Report this Post06-04-2015 09:54 AM Click Here to See the Profile for fierosoundClick Here to visit fierosound's HomePageClick Here to Email fierosoundSend a Private Message to fierosoundEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

You guys want to have an 88 Service Manual to do any work on your Fiero...
It tells you how to reassemble the rack properly so it is centered.
(unfortunately it not always 100% complete or clear - see above post)

NOTE: a "rebuild kit" for the 88 steering rack would be:
1 - passenger side rack bushing (see Dickman's site)
1 - 6200 Series pinion shaft ball bearing (lower end)
1 - Timken DB53313 pinion shaft roller bearing (upper end)
1 - pinion shaft seal GM part# 26006299 or National part# 222028
... and of course, inner/outer tie-rods as needed

Here is how to replace that lower bearing (not covered in Service Manual)

Getting the 88 rack out is easier than on the 84-87 cars - less parts to remove.
Once I got the wheels off and the tie-rods ends disconnected, it's just the 4 bolts for the 2 U-shaped brackets.
The pinion just "fell out" if the rack because of that broken lower bearing.



I disassembled it to clean it up and make sure no pieces of old ball bearing were inside housing.
With the rack out, I was able to knock out the lower bearing outer race.



Pieces of old ball bearing and new replacement pictured below.
I used a 6200 Series ball bearing - 10mm I.D. x 30mm O.D x 9mm Wide (all brands same number)





There should have been 8 balls - I only found 3 and nothing else.
(may have been in bottom cap when I scraped crap out of it)

New bearing is seated into place (used a socket and hammer).
When the old bearing broke, this end of the pinion shaft just flopped around.
Because new bearing is 1mm wider than old bearing, slot for snap ring is partly covered.



Snap ring slot in aluminum housing is easily grooved wider with a Dremel tool.
I covered bearing with tape to avoid getting Dremel grindings in it. Here is snap ring installed.



Below is shot where you can see both bearings.

Upper end has a roller bearing and seal.
I would have replaced those if I could find the parts easily
Roller bearing GM part# 7828012 interchanges to Timken DB53313
Seal is GM part# 26006299 or National part# 222028

New lower ball bearing that was just installed is seen at bottom.
(this plastic sleeve thing can be pried off - but I was worried it may crack)



I packed grease into both bearings before reassembling the rack as per manual instructions, and reinstalling it in the car.

Reposting the diagram of how this pinion and lower bearing go together.
A nut goes on the end of the shaft and a pressed in dust cover seals the end from dirt/water.

[This message has been edited by fierosound (edited 07-18-2018).]

IP: Logged

Michiganman
Member

Posts: 96
From: Dewitt, Michigan
Registered: Dec 2012


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback

Rate this member

Report this Post06-04-2015 12:16 PM Click Here to See the Profile for MichiganmanClick Here to Email MichiganmanSend a Private Message to MichiganmanEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Is it probable that this could be the cause of my 1987 hard steering? Very hard to steer.
Since I've never driven another fiero, I don't have any comparison experience. But, i wouldn't have bought a new one in 1987 if it steered as hard as mine does.

IP: Logged

fierosound
Member

Posts: 13596
From: Calgary, Canada
Registered: Nov 1999


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 274
Rate this member

Report this Post06-04-2015 02:02 PM Click Here to See the Profile for fierosoundClick Here to visit fierosound's HomePageClick Here to Email fierosoundSend a Private Message to fierosoundEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by Michiganman:

Is it probable that this could be the cause of my 1987 hard steering? Very hard to steer.
Since I've never driven another fiero, I don't have any comparison experience. But, i wouldn't have bought a new one in 1987 if it steered as hard as mine does.


No way for you to have this particular problem - 87 is a different rack.
Start your own thread with more details (hard to steer is too vague) on what you are experiencing.

[This message has been edited by fierosound (edited 06-04-2015).]

IP: Logged

fierosound
Member

Posts: 13596
From: Calgary, Canada
Registered: Nov 1999


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 274
Rate this member

Report this Post06-04-2015 04:39 PM Click Here to See the Profile for fierosoundClick Here to visit fierosound's HomePageClick Here to Email fierosoundSend a Private Message to fierosoundEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

I asked Cliff to move this to How To section...

[This message has been edited by fierosound (edited 06-04-2015).]

IP: Logged

lateFormula
Member

Posts: 992
From: Detroit Rock City
Registered: Jul 2002


Feedback score: (2)
Leave feedback

Rate this member

Report this Post06-04-2015 09:20 PM Click Here to See the Profile for lateFormulaSend a Private Message to lateFormulaEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Did you use a bearing that had no dust covers on the bearing? Personally I would have only used a bearing that had covers on both sides and had removable covers (snap rings). I would have removed one cover and packed the bearing with chassis grease, reinstalled the cover and then installed the bearing into the rack.

IP: Logged

fierosound
Member

Posts: 13596
From: Calgary, Canada
Registered: Nov 1999


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 274
Rate this member

Report this Post06-04-2015 11:20 PM Click Here to See the Profile for fierosoundClick Here to visit fierosound's HomePageClick Here to Email fierosoundSend a Private Message to fierosoundEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by lateFormula:

Did you use a bearing that had no dust covers on the bearing? Personally I would have only used a bearing that had covers on both sides and had removable covers (snap rings). I would have removed one cover and packed the bearing with chassis grease, reinstalled the cover and then installed the bearing into the rack.


No need for a sealed bearing. It will be obvious when you disassemble yours.
The same reason you don't use an umbrella IN the house just because it's raining outside.

The parts inside of the rack/pinion housing are all greased. The bearings are "in the housing" - not sure how you expect dirt to get into them.
The upper pinion shaft roller bearing has a seal and the intermediate shaft dust boot covers the pinion shaft, pinch bolt, u-joint etc to the firewall.
I'll post this drawing a 3rd time so you can see that the dust cover seals the bottom of the pinion shaft housing (it's not an "open window")

[This message has been edited by fierosound (edited 07-18-2018).]

IP: Logged

Rodney
Member

Posts: 4713
From: Caledonia, WI USA
Registered: Feb 2000


Feedback score: (4)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 269
Rate this member

Report this Post06-05-2015 08:48 AM Click Here to See the Profile for RodneyClick Here to visit Rodney's HomePageClick Here to Email RodneySend a Private Message to RodneyEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

I have a solution for a replacement for the 10 x 30 x 8 mm lower ball bearing. I'll get going on that.

------------------
Rodney Dickman

Fiero Parts And Acc's Web Page:
All new web page!:www.rodneydickman.com
Rodney Dickman's Fiero accessories
7604 Treeview Drive
Caledonia, WI 53108
Phone/Fax (262) 835-9575

IP: Logged

fierosound
Member

Posts: 13596
From: Calgary, Canada
Registered: Nov 1999


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 274
Rate this member

Report this Post06-06-2015 08:44 PM Click Here to See the Profile for fierosoundClick Here to visit fierosound's HomePageClick Here to Email fierosoundSend a Private Message to fierosoundEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by Rodney:

I have a solution for a replacement for the 10 x 30 x 8 mm lower ball bearing. I'll get going on that.



Machining 0.5mm off each side would do it, provided it doesn't weaken the bearing races.

[This message has been edited by fierosound (edited 12-24-2015).]

IP: Logged

FTF Engineering
Member

Posts: 704
From: Near Philadelphia PA
Registered: Sep 2001


Feedback score: (1)
Leave feedback

Rate this member

Report this Post06-07-2015 10:26 AM Click Here to See the Profile for FTF EngineeringSend a Private Message to FTF EngineeringEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

They really used a non-standard size at the lower end?

GM......

Maybe it was a standard size back in 84?

IP: Logged

KMFDMFAN
Member

Posts: 152
From: Gulf Coast, MS USA
Registered: Sep 2013


Feedback score: (1)
Leave feedback

Rate this member

Report this Post08-13-2015 09:32 AM Click Here to See the Profile for KMFDMFANClick Here to Email KMFDMFANSend a Private Message to KMFDMFANEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Just finished "rebuilding" my steering rack on my 88 GT auto. This info is invaluable to anyone repairing or refreshing the upper and lower pinion bearings. I had no idea how bad my steering had gotten until it failed me completely. With the new parts installed the car has literally transformed handling!

Thanks for the walkthrough fierosound! btw did you ever find a suitable replacement seal for the upper part of the pinion gear? I found another post showing that a seal from a 90's Honda would work. I got one from Autozone and it fit great.

:-)

IP: Logged

2.5
Member

Posts: 39424
From: Southern MN
Registered: May 2007


Feedback score: (1)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 178
Rate this member

Report this Post08-13-2015 09:36 AM Click Here to See the Profile for 2.5Send a Private Message to 2.5Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by Rodney:

I have a solution for a replacement for the 10 x 30 x 8 mm lower ball bearing. I'll get going on that.



IP: Logged

fierosound
Member

Posts: 13596
From: Calgary, Canada
Registered: Nov 1999


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 274
Rate this member

Report this Post08-13-2015 05:20 PM Click Here to See the Profile for fierosoundClick Here to visit fierosound's HomePageClick Here to Email fierosoundSend a Private Message to fierosoundEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by KMFDMFAN:

Just finished "rebuilding" my steering rack on my 88 GT auto. This info is invaluable to anyone repairing or refreshing the upper and lower pinion bearings. I had no idea how bad my steering had gotten until it failed me completely. With the new parts installed the car has literally transformed handling!


Good to hear this helped. Maybe this breakdown isn't SO rare after all.

 
quote
Originally posted by KMFDMFAN:

... did you ever find a suitable replacement seal for the upper part of the pinion gear? I found another post showing that a seal from a 90's Honda would work. I got one from Autozone and it fit great.


Kinda vague. A part number would be better.

[This message has been edited by fierosound (edited 08-13-2015).]

IP: Logged

KMFDMFAN
Member

Posts: 152
From: Gulf Coast, MS USA
Registered: Sep 2013


Feedback score: (1)
Leave feedback

Rate this member

Report this Post08-13-2015 10:19 PM Click Here to See the Profile for KMFDMFANClick Here to Email KMFDMFANSend a Private Message to KMFDMFANEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Oops, yeah sorry bud. I didn't have my notes with me.

I found National part# 222028 and it's a perfect fit.

 
quote
Maybe this breakdown isn't SO rare after all.


My rack had the same symptoms and when i pulled off the press on cover the ball bearings and inner cage fell out. I could only find 7 of the 8 balls. I also had to dremel out another 1mm to get the snap ring back in.

IP: Logged

TrotFox
Member

Posts: 137
From: Carrollton, TX USA
Registered: Feb 2005


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback

Rate this member

Report this Post08-14-2015 02:39 PM Click Here to See the Profile for TrotFoxClick Here to Email TrotFoxSend a Private Message to TrotFoxEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Where were you guys last year when I had my rack apart trying to find a replacement for that lower bearing?! I was trying to keep from having to widen the groove and ended up re-using the stocker (I did replace the needle bearing at the top, then found that my issue was actually in the steering column.)

Red 5spd Formula,
Trot, the better-steering, fox...

IP: Logged

fierogt28
Member

Posts: 2627
From: Quebec, Canada.
Registered: Feb 2005


Feedback score:    (13)
Leave feedback

Rate this member

Report this Post08-14-2015 06:05 PM Click Here to See the Profile for fierogt28Send a Private Message to fierogt28Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

This is good information for 88 owners like myself.

I will be adding this topic to my favorites.

For once, I will check my rack if I ever take it out of the car for inspection
on this issue.

------------------
fierogt28

88 GT, Loaded, 5-speed.
88 GT, 5-speed. Beechwood interior, All original.

IP: Logged

johnyrottin
Member

Posts: 5123
From: Texas
Registered: Oct 2007


Feedback score:    (8)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 82
Rate this member

Report this Post08-20-2015 08:32 AM Click Here to See the Profile for johnyrottinClick Here to Email johnyrottinSend a Private Message to johnyrottinEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

What year steering racks are interchangeable, if any?

IP: Logged

fierogt28
Member

Posts: 2627
From: Quebec, Canada.
Registered: Feb 2005


Feedback score:    (13)
Leave feedback

Rate this member

Report this Post08-20-2015 12:46 PM Click Here to See the Profile for fierogt28Send a Private Message to fierogt28Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by johnyrottin:

What year steering racks are interchangeable, if any?


None...88 specific.

IP: Logged

olejoedad
Member

Posts: 11432
From: Clarendon Twp., MI
Registered: May 2004


Feedback score: (5)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 175
Rate this member

Report this Post08-20-2015 02:38 PM Click Here to See the Profile for olejoedadClick Here to Email olejoedadSend a Private Message to olejoedadEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

84-87 interchange with each other.
They can also be adapted between 88 and pre-88, but not bolt-in.

IP: Logged

Mickey_Moose
Member

Posts: 7155
From: Edmonton, AB, Canada
Registered: May 2001


Feedback score: (3)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 140
Rate this member

Report this Post12-24-2015 08:45 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Mickey_MooseClick Here to visit Mickey_Moose's HomePageClick Here to Email Mickey_MooseSend a Private Message to Mickey_MooseEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

...thanks for the info there tony - now, you want to do mine (preventive)??

My garage is heated...and I have free beer.

IP: Logged

Rodney
Member

Posts: 4713
From: Caledonia, WI USA
Registered: Feb 2000


Feedback score: (4)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 269
Rate this member

Report this Post12-24-2015 09:08 AM Click Here to See the Profile for RodneyClick Here to visit Rodney's HomePageClick Here to Email RodneySend a Private Message to RodneyEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by TrotFox:

Where were you guys last year when I had my rack apart trying to find a replacement for that 1988 lower bearing?!


http://rodneydickman.com/ca....php?products_id=370

For now I only have the lower bearing. Soon I'll have the upper bearing and seal.

------------------
Rodney Dickman

Fiero Parts And Acc's Web Page:
All new web page!:www.rodneydickman.com
Rodney Dickman's Fiero accessories
7604 Treeview Drive
Caledonia, WI 53108
Phone/Fax (262) 835-9575

IP: Logged

Mickey_Moose
Member

Posts: 7155
From: Edmonton, AB, Canada
Registered: May 2001


Feedback score: (3)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 140
Rate this member

Report this Post12-24-2015 10:15 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Mickey_MooseClick Here to visit Mickey_Moose's HomePageClick Here to Email Mickey_MooseSend a Private Message to Mickey_MooseEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by Rodney:


http://rodneydickman.com/ca....php?products_id=370

For now I only have the lower bearing. Soon I'll have the upper bearing and seal.



Excellent, will buy the full set as soon as you have them.

IP: Logged

SeizureNoodles
Member

Posts: 60
From: Marysville, WA
Registered: Dec 2014


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback

Rate this member

Report this Post01-13-2017 07:32 PM Click Here to See the Profile for SeizureNoodlesClick Here to Email SeizureNoodlesSend a Private Message to SeizureNoodlesEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

I know this thread is a bit old, but has good info. I just wanted to add that I found a 10x30x8 bearing with chrome shields online, maybe rodney can look into stocking these, though I am not sure how easy it is to pack these with grease.

https://www.bocabearings.co...pRMH4ZNv1RoClDLw_wcB

IP: Logged


next newest topic | next oldest topic

All times are ET (US)

Post New Topic  Post A Reply
Hop to:

Contact Us | Back To Main Page

Advertizing on PFF | Fiero Parts Vendors
PFF Merchandise | Fiero Gallery | Ogre's Cave
Real-Time Chat | Fiero Related Auctions on eBay



Copyright (c) 1999, C. Pennock