Well, I know it's not me. I have always done fixed rate. I'm the type of person who thinks ahead, way ahead. I would never do an ARM, but if I had done an ARM I would have read the entire contract and plugged the max interrest rate into a mortgage calculator to see if i could afford it based on my salary.
To answer your question, my opinion is this: There are two idiots in the end, the lender and the borrower. Now to go into more depth on my opinion, I think the bigger idiot is the borrower. Here is why I say this. The lender can absorb the cost associated with the fallout of many buyers who made bad decisions. The buyer can't absorb anything, they default and it's all over; therefore, they have to be more vigilant.
I'll agree with you 100% again. No, it's not you. It's not me. It's not even Mr Bitter. It's the people who THOUGHT that the house price was going to go up and they could sell the house in a matter of 1 month. It's idiots that took out loans they knew they couldn't afford. It is idiots like banks that figured they could lend more money on shoddy loans.
LOL.. it's like romper room around here any more I tell ya!!!
no kidding
I would love to see the insults decrease around here. I have been doing a pretty good job of controlling myself lately...although I have done my share of it over the years
[This message has been edited by ditch (edited 03-09-2008).]
Originally posted by aceman: I'll agree with you 100% again. No, it's not you. It's not me. It's not even Mr Bitter. It's the people who THOUGHT that the house price was going to go up and they could sell the house in a matter of 1 month.
I agree with that.
quote
It's idiots that took out loans they knew they couldn't afford. It is idiots like banks that figured they could lend more money on shoddy loans.
I very much disagree with this. If you loan your money to a street bum and expect him to pay you back.. well shame on you aceman because you are a flaming idiot for thinking you will ever get your money back... Now what does he have that you can flip for a few buchs than what he got it for? House maybe?
They only "lost" in the short term while the bubble was increasing. Now they are losing their freaking asses and I do love it so... I really really do. It just puts a smile on my face.
I can agree with you on one thing man, I'm glad to see banks take a hit in the nuts. Sometimes that is what it takes to knock someone back in line
Read Mr Bitter's comment's, Don. Mr Bitter believe that this mortgage meltdown is coming from all walks of life....From those that have been laid off, or get a smaller wage, or are disabled, or die. Mr Bitter believe that the economy is the reason for the mortgage meltdown.
The mortgage meltdown: Idiots took out loans there was no way in hell for them to afford. Banks allowed it and no one wanted to realize that there is a ceiling on the price/value of a house in a given point of time.
Well, you have to look at a very big picture. In a growing economy banks have lots and lots of money to lend. More than there are borrowers. They offer subprime loans to entice more borrowing. All is well-the economy is booming and everyone is paying their loans back. When something happens to slow or even reverse the economic cycle, a number of things take place. People-(and people are what constitutes a bank's assets)-have less money to spend, less maney to stick in a bank. The same holds true for businesses. Both individuals and businesses cut their deposits. This makes banks more vulnurable. A person may be able to afford to pay the high rates during good economic cycles, but when raises dry up, energy costs skyrocket, healthcare costs increase, the wage earner is in a bind. He may have looked at that loan carefully, looked back at what his income rate has increased by, and figured he was safe. All it takes is one domino to fall.
In the bigger picture, on a personal note, I am very much alarmed at where this whole mess will come home to roost at. I am currently moving assets around trying to find a safe place, and there aren't a lot of options. Should banks begin to fail, everyone will be at risk, even tho the percentages appear to be low, the total capitalization tied up in foreclosures and subprime loans is a lot, considering the economy as a whole is slowing. I'm not at all convinced the banking industry can survive this large of a loss, so all this discussion hits a lot closer home than a lot of people may think. Remember back last month when the Fed suddenly met and acted, then the bill was introduced to spur the economy? I believe when all is said and done, it will come out that a very large US bank, or a group of banks let the Fed know that they were in dire straits if something wasn't done and done immediately.
Originally posted by ditch: I can agree with you on one thing man, I'm glad to see banks take a hit in the nuts. Sometimes that is what it takes to knock someone back in line
Well there was a reason for "banking regulation." How long has it been since the deregulation? What 8 - 9 years? In that time frame they have managed to fark up the entire economy and it will probably take twice as long to repair.
Why did/do I have to repeat things to you, Mr Bitter. You wouldn't get that lashing out if you'd listen to the FACTS and understand them. I'm NOT the example you are looking for.
My apologies, Avengador1. It comes out when I'm dealing with a total idiot that can't get a simple point through a thick skull.
[This message has been edited by aceman (edited 03-09-2008).]
You agree, through your use of this service, that you will not use this messageboard to post any material which is knowingly false and/or defamatory, inaccurate, abusive, vulgar, hateful, harassing, obscene, profane, sexually oriented, threatening, invasive of a person's privacy, or otherwise violative of any law.
Didn't we also have a rule about bypassing the filter? Can't you guys watch your language? This is a family forum afterall.
[This message has been edited by avengador1 (edited 03-09-2008).]
Something I guess you can’t learn in school is, Respect, Respect of another’s ideas, Respect of another’s opinions, Respect period.
Obviously that was something that some here don’t know how to do.
Says the man who calls Ace an "educated idiot". Before you talk about respect you may want to check yourself. You talk all the smack about schooling, schooling you didn't get, yet its a lesson you didn't learn. I guess they didn't teach respect to union worker lackeys either.
Jayzuss!!! I didn't even read the last two pages of feces-slinging. I will offer an opinion, though.
I've only seen this mentioned once, and never again. A few years ago, there were a "disproportionate" number of middle class (generally white) borrowers who were getting approved, and a disproportionate number of ethnic borrowers who were getting denied. Of course, this was perceived to be due to ethnicity, not buying power. People screamed "discrimination!" (and indeed, there may have been some, but generally all the lender cares about is "green".) In any event, the finance industry was told to be "more inclusive. More creative." Hence, all the ARMs and other silliness.
The stage was set.
This is a rerun of the Telecom collapse. After all of the day traders lost their collective asses when the telecoms tanked, everyone said "Real Estate! Real Estate is always stable!"
And everybody got involved. The lenders knew they would make their money (at least in the short term. Never anticipating more than two weeks into the future.) The buyers saw an opportunity to either flip a house or two, or to buy more house than they could afford. The realtors happily went along with it and collected their commissions. ("If the bank says you're approved, it's gotta be good.") And it all worked fine until those first ARMs started converting. And the "house of cards" started tumbling.
In a nutshell, there a a lot of people who bought houses, who had no business doing so. They were financed by lenders who had no business writing those loans, in the first place.
And they ran off the end of the earth with it, like they did with Telecomm stocks. And just like the telecomms, it's come back to bite them on the ass.
One other thing, and I'll shut up. The people mentioned on that Real Estate Panic forum or whatever it was, who are sitting on several hundred grand from previously flipped houses, and are going to let their present mortgages go into default and hope the government will bail them out... Ought to be sued to within an inch of their lives. They are at the heart of the problem.
[This message has been edited by Raydar (edited 03-09-2008).]
Originally posted by Phranc: Says the man who calls Ace an "educated idiot". Before you talk about respect you may want to check yourself. You talk all the smack about schooling, schooling you didn't get, yet its a lesson you didn't learn. I guess they didn't teach respect to union worker lackeys either.
I respect anyone’s opinion as just that their opinion, they are entitled to it. Right or wrong.
I never lashed out and called ace names until after all the name calling he did to me. For what were facts he just didn’t like the fact that someone of my education had the facts correct.
That it was not just those who took out the loans fault, there were many who were at fault, I said that in the beginning.
From his first post to me, on page 2, long before I made any disparaging remark to him.
quote
Originally posted by aceman: Mr Bitter, ..Right, Mr Bitter?
BTW, Mr Bitter, you're throwing up your bitter, drunken bum in a crappy bar argument again. I don't have anymore time to waste on you. Come back with a better argument and maybe I'll talk to you again after work.
And then of course there was this on page 3
quote
Originally posted by aceman: What fuking part of LOSE vs LOOSE didn't you fuking understand?
What part of your post relates to the title of the post:
Foreclosures at record as household wealth falls
And still page 3
quote
Originally posted by aceman:
Dillusional Mr Bitter, Houses will ALWAYS increase in value. (Well, except mobile homes) Stop painting a little corner of the picture and you'd see that.
Everyone but you saw and understood the analogy I used between a car dealership and the home buying experience. That analogy just couldn't get a seat in your brain. Too much paranoia and broken seats inside the brain for that analogy to sit down.
Still page 3
quote
Originally posted by aceman: OH JEEZUS! Good Day, Mr Bitter. You are so fuking dense!
All pages before I called ace anything. I can take a lot but to just simply degrade someone for no reason at all is just plain stupid.
Ace degrades anyone who has a different opinion than his. That is his MO.
Don’t want to be degraded by Aceman, Don’t disagree with him, Or point out that he is wrong.
------------------ Technology is great when it works, and one big pain in the ass when it doesn't. Detroit iron rules all the rest are just toys.
I degrade you because your posts are not thought out and you run around like the drunken, bitter, idiot that just wants to pick a drunken argument or fight in a crappy hole-in-the-wall bar.
GIVE ME SOMETHING THOUGHT OUT, RATIONAL, INTELLIGENT AND FACTUAL TO DEBATE YOU. Until then, I will argue and degrade you.
Give me a reason in these threads to respect you and your opinion.
I don't jump into your technical threads and degrade you where you are giving advice because your background and information is factual and relevant, do i?
[This message has been edited by aceman (edited 03-09-2008).]
i've been on the forum several times a day the last couple of days looking for amusement, and didn't see this thread. it started late on the 6th, and appears in the trash on the 9th.
questions:
how did i miss this thread for 2 days?
was it started as a "political" or "religion" topic?
was it intended from the beginning to "become" political?
too bad. A lot of good info and links went to the trash can with this. Younger folks on PFF could have learned a lot from this thread had it stayed civil. Older ones too.
Originally posted by aceman: I just wanted to archive this. Classic about you! Notice Cliff said Usual SuspectS. Plural. That would be you too. That quote above is like you clearing out a room with a fart and asking if you did something wrong.
quote
Originally posted by 84fiero123: I would like to hear that from Cliff thank you.
in pursuit of the parthian shot you both achieve at best a pyrrhic victory.
[This message has been edited by lurker (edited 03-09-2008).]
It's always the same people too. 
Can't you guys watch your language? This is a family forum afterall.
Once again 
